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mjbelyea79

so confused about tomatoes

8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago

Good day, I am currently growing from seed Roma tomatoes (20 little potters), tiny tims ((8), Super sweet (8) I have very limited space in my back yard. So I was thinking I could to pots? Is this possible? If i do need to make a garden it would be a raised bed. How much space between plants is required? I just read that you should plant 2 determinants with 1 indeterminate?

I am also planting cauliflower, cucumber, carrots and beans. I have a place for them.

Thank you

M

Comments (17)

  • 8 years ago

    The Tiny Tims can go in small pots on your windowsill.

    Roma would probably prefer to go in the ground, but maybe you could grow them in really big containers.

    Super Sweet 100, although these are cherry tomatoes, they are really large plants that need to go in the ground and have tall stakes, at least 6' high.

    If you are willing to prune the Super Sweets to one stem, you could plant them two feet apart.

    Roma should not be pruned, so probably the minimal spacing between them should be 3'.

    Linda

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I don't mean to bring bad news, but it seems that you have 28 tomato plants that will get to good size - probably not the best idea if you have "very limited space". While Roma is a determinate plant, it can still easily get 4' tall and 2' wide. Super Sweet are cherry tomatoes which are notorious for becoming enormous plants - they can easily reach 8-10' tall and one plant alone can take over the space of 2 or 3 plants. Of course, perhaps you're not actually planning to grow all 28 plants, but if you are, you will need lots of room. Tiny Tims are considered dwarf tomatoes and you could likely do well if you plant them in containers - maybe 4 or so to a large whiskey barrel. You can probably play with those and see what works for you.

    Spacing is always just a suggestion regardless of who you hear it from - everyone has their own methods, but most people make their suggestion based on personal experience. I use Earthboxes for most tomatoes - two plants per Earthbox, which puts the plants nearly 2' apart. My Earthboxes are situated about a foot apart end-to-end in two rows with about 5' of space between the two rows - plenty of room to walk between. Some people only grow one plant per Earthbox. Ideally, you'd have enough space to walk around each plant once it matures - so 2-3' between plants is a good rule of thumb if it's possible. It reduces the spread of blights and other communicable diseases and increases air flow; very important for tomato plants as moisture can quickly and easily lead to development of fatal fungal diseases. I live in a very arid climate that just doesn't easily propagate diseases associated with excess moisture. I also maintain my plants on a daily basis - by pruning and staking - all season long, so I have managed to keep the nasties away with relative ease. After heavy rains, I always gently shake the support systems (NEVER directly touching wet plants intentionally) to knock off standing water. If I lived in a wetter, more humid climate, I would not space my plants so close together. Either way, a good maintenance schedule is essential for happy and healthy plants.

    Most seasoned gardeners in this forum suggest a container no smaller than 10 gallons for large, mature tomato plants (including Romas and other regular determinate varieties). The consensus is that "the larger, the better" - both for optimal root growth and a reduction in the need to water so frequently. I won't disagree because I am not what I would consider a seasoned gardener. Whiskey barrels and other large planters are perfect for tomatoes - one indeterminate, maybe two determinates - and lots of other garden goodies. Self-watering containers such as Earthboxes and "global buckets" generally allow more forgiveness, especially given their smaller size, because the roots eventually tap into the water reservoir creating a quasi-hydroponic situation that mitigates issues associated with over or under-watering. Earthboxes contain about 15 gallons of soil (so 7½ gallons per tomato plant, theoretically) and "global buckets" contain about 5 gallons of soil (one tomato per bucket). Personally, I have had little issue with my Earthbox plants getting 7-9' tall and producing huge, gorgeous tomatoes, often better than in-ground/raised bed tomatoes grown by neighbors.

    If you decide to build raised beds, just keep your plants 2-3' apart and you should do fine as far as spacing is concerned. Keep up on pruning and staking, which is a whole other beast that everyone has their own opinion on.

    I'm not sure where you heard you should plant two determinates with one indeterminate. That makes no sense. Plant what you want.

  • 8 years ago

    "I just read that you should plant 2 determinants with 1 indeterminate?"

    That's entirely false. You do not have to mix them. I am curious where you read that and what the reasoning behind it was.

    Rodney

  • 8 years ago

    Agree that " you should plant 2 determinants with 1 indeterminate" makes no sense. Can't imagine what they were talking about?

    With all the plants you have it could bankrupt you buying containers and potting mix for all of them. So how many do you actually want to grow?

    Dave

  • 8 years ago

    I'll take the comments on planting determinate tomatoes with indeterminate varieties one step further and actually advise against it. Your staking/ caging strategies will vary between them. Likewise dwarf varieties would get too much shade next to either of other taller growing types.

    Also spacing between plants is affected by how you manage the plants. Indeterminate varieties can be pruned to a single stem giving you the highest yield per square foot of garden space at a higher density planting. I planted 540 Indt. plants in a 30x 96' high tunnel this year with a space of 22" between plants in each row. You might want to consider that for your raised beds.

  • 8 years ago

    Thank you everyone for the information. I found the information on this oage of planting the 2 different tomato

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    "I found the information on this oage of planting the 2 different tomato"

    If you mean you found it on this forum then perhaps it was in a specific context that would explain what was meant. It may have been correct for some reason within that specific context but taken out of context it is impossible to say. It is not a common recommendation by any means.

    Dave

    PS: I did a search and only found one reference to mixing they two types. It was in a discussion about succession planting. They used early determinate varieties first and then several weeks later had late indeterminate varieties planted on either side of them. The reason given was that by the time the indeterminates were large enough to begin setting fruit the determinate would be about finished and ready to be pulled. That may or may not work depending on one's length of growing season. But it in no way means one should do it.

  • 8 years ago

    Could you have perhaps read 2 determinates or 1 indeterminate in an Earthbox?

  • 8 years ago

    One well-grown tomato plant produces a lot of tomatoes. I'm planning on planting four plants this year. There are only two people in my house, so I'll be giving tomatoes away. On alternate years I plant 12-15 and that gives me enough tomatoes to can a 2-3 year supply, many tomatoes to eat fresh, and enough to give to friends.

    You may not need all 28 plants. You'll get more tomatoes if you don't plant them too close together.

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    As noted, "limited space" and 36 tomato plants are phrases that don't go together. Each plant will be easily capable of filling a 3x3 foot space. We aren't, by any chance, talking about a 18x18 foot "limited space"? BUT, no biggie. Plant them as close together as you want, BUT, you won't get 36 plants worth of fruit. Tomatoes planted close together pretty much act like stems on a single plant. Only so much root space and nutrient to go around. 36 plants worth of pots is a veritable forest of pots. You sure you want to get into that? Each pot should be at least a couple of gallons, ideally a lot more, and filled with good potting soil. Not plain old garden soil. An expensive proposition.

    As noted, the cherries are vines, and grow huge. You'll need trellises.

    Probably the main lesson here is to think ahead before planting so many tomatoes. I assume if you are planting cauliflower and carrots, you're probably way up north, and have a bit of time before planting out tomatoes. Plenty of time to give some away.

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Haha thank you everyone. I am nOw giving away some plants. I will grow 12-15. There are 3 people in our house and i want enough for canning. By the way I am very new at this. This is my first year :)

  • 8 years ago

    growing from seed Roma tomatoes (20 little potters), tiny tims ((8), Super sweet (8) I have very limited space in my back yard ...

    -----------------------------------

    Twenty (20) Roma ? Your choice, of course . But what do you want to do with 20 Roma plant tomatoes ? IMO they are not that great tasting, are prone to BER. Roma is mostly a sauce, cooking tomato, not a good slicer or in the salad either.

    SPACING IN RAISED BED:

    I have done raised bed planting for 4 years. Due to lack of space I grew them at 18 to 20" spacing or about 3 sq-ft per plant. But I had to stake them and pruned to 2 stems, or 3 stems, max.

    Lets say you dedicate 4 sq-ft for each Roma type. Then you will need a minimum of 80 sq-ft just for 20 Romas that is with efficient bed design , staggering and good staking.

    Sey

  • 8 years ago

    Sey, I don't think you tried to prune Romas to a few stems. That would be difficult. I remember liking the Florida varieties and trying to regulate their branching. I was somewhat successful with FL7514 but FL47 and FL91 were impossible to try to manage as indeterminate varieties and prune to a few stems.

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    the traditional/classic Roma are determinate, so the plants are naturally more compact and shouldn't be pruned. it's a touchy subject, but i'm not a fan of pruning indeterminate plants. if i had a small space i would rather have 3 plants than 6 plants pruned to only a few stems. i would almost guarantee that by weight, the three un-pruned plants would yield the same, if not more tomatoes overall than the six pruned plants.. the tomatoes might* be slightly larger on the pruned plant, but isn't always the case.

    i plant my indeterminate tomatoes at 28-32in spacing.. i suppose if you have a long growing season then 36-48in. might be better. besides the vines really close to the ground, i leave the pruning to greenhouses ;-)

  • 8 years ago

    We plan on 8 sq. ft. per indeterminate plant. We typically plant around 70/year. We are raised bed planters, cagers and limited pruners.

    Shell 6A

  • 8 years ago

    I am looking to can the tomatoes for sauce (roma). I still have 2 marion tomatoes, 8 super sweet and 8 tiny tim and 2 grapes

  • 8 years ago

    You can make sauce out of any tomato variety, most of them with much better flavor than Roma and less growing issues. So be prepared for dealing with BER with them.

    But since you already have them growing just give some thought to better varieties for next year.

    8 Super Sweet plants will give you a ton of cherry tomatoes and take up a great deal of garden room because the plants are so big. When you plant make sure they aren't going to shade out the other varieties.

    Are you an experienced canner and familiar with the current guidelines?

    Dave