Oh, hello my little baby! I am glad to see she is in good hands. I had a wonderful batch of her this year and was happy to share the bounty.

Oh nice to know who contributed it! Rosie

irina_co(z5 CO)

It is very prone to be TOO WHITE as it matures - but it slows the growth considerably.

As long as the white is not to the extreme of making it impossible for the plant to survive, I'd be okay with a lot of white. Like the pink blush some of the newer leaves have in addition to the white.

I had several babies I potted up last fall - and they came to bloom this May- June. They had about as much variegation as Jeff's one or more . Under t8s. It is slow in my book.

YAY!!!!!! Rosie

I really enjoyed the last one. Speaking only for myself, I often have doubles and triples of plants that I would love to gift to somebody. They are usually in either 3 or 4" pots though. Mostly the side effect of past crown removals. I guess somebody could give me a quick tutorial on how to remove all the dirt and just send the rooted plant in a plastic bag. We'll see.

I usually only propagate leaves that I want to keep for one reason or another. I usually do two or three just to insure I get one to survive. Generally, they all do ok and I can gift some of those when the time comes. I just never know when that will be. (I have some that are on their third month w/o new growth. Heavily variegated plants can be real stinkers that way.)

At any rate, Im sure any size box could be used and enjoyed by the group. I am thankful that you would take the time to take on a project like this that me and so many others will enjoy.

Hey, Deb! I am kind of low on stock now. But if I know a RR is coming, then I can get to a club sale in the spring to pick up some Californian grown vintage varieties to be prepared. Joanne

Joanne, what vintage???? I am always on the lookout for 1960's & 70's vintage! Heck let me know before you go, I may have a list and a check for you if they are old enough vintage!!!!! Rosie

Ohhh boy! Rosies Christmas money is on fire now!

HAHA!!!!! You betcha!!!!! I have it socked away in a little,,,,,well now did you really think I would give away my hiding place? hahahahaha Rosie

Hi Julie! Good to hear from you!!!!! Forgot to say that in my first post! Will I see you at the Spring Ann Arbor Sale???? Only about 12 or so weeks away!!!! Rosie

Rosie,

Happy New Year!

You will definitely see me at the Spring sale!

Haha!!! Happy New Year to you also! Look forward to seeing you then! Rosie

Your Rose Bouquet is a beauty. I have recently purchased one and trying different locations. Currently, in bath of east window now. Mine is not as pretty as urs yet. Hopefully soon.

Heavily variegated plants really do better under lights...

Irina_co - I did purchase 2 grow lights. The room I can put the lights in however can be quite cool. I tried them in the room with the lights but didn’t see a reaction of any growth. The room their in now has humidity, warmth and east winter natural light. I will b so happy to find the correct growing conditions. They have been n this new room probably 2 weeks. I am starting to think timers on the lights and a wet rock pan 4 humidity. If I move them back. Currently, I like to c them in the morning n my bathroom. They r so cute n friendly. But, I will try whatever is best for them

Hi, Rosie, The sale is unusual because it is held by only one seller who grows locally. We (the club and I) never know 'til we get there what will be offered. I was told it is more or less kept secret because the grower is a private individual, not commercial, so has limited supply. If word got out ahead of time what was being offered, the stampede would flatten me even more than people just reaching over me. People line up for hours before the doors open. They can get very grabby. I have learned to get what I can before the stampede, then return to the tables what I or club mates don't want. Rather than pausing to think it over. I also pick newer varieties that are interesting and hard to get. Or variegates. Several club members want only minis. The specialty varieties are always starter size. The seller also has a separate section of full grown blooming commercial quality Optimaras for non-hobbyists, such as young families who come with their children, who basically want to take home a pretty houseplant. The Optimaras are not labeled. But the hobbyists know which ones are which. The seller tries to offer variegated Optimaras. I get a couple of those, too. Joanne

Cheryl -

It is nice to have lights but if this room in winter is cold, the plants will not be thriving - if it is chilly - they will start developing root rot. You still can use this setup in summer. Plants need a combination of conditions to do well - and if something is lacking... why bother swapping the warm with not enough light, but enough humidity and good temperature - to a cold and dry room with lights. You like them in the bathroom - fine - may be you arrange a supplemental light for them - I would hang a single under the counter T5 light fixture above them - put it on a timer for several hours a day - and enjoy the bloom. You need to see blossoms every morning - to have a good day!

Joanne - I am sorry to hear that your AV sale is such a stressful event. It is nice that you have a grower who really produces - but what about the rest of your club members? You guys are overdue for the program on propagation from leaves, ordering some leaves for the club, putting them down, then doing another hands on program on separating and potting up the babies...And in no time you all will be so overwhelmed by new growth - you will have a real need to sell. Club has money - you guys can order a bunch of standard, semi and mini leaves. Even if the starters won't be in bloom- you can print out the stickers from First Class program with photos and description, Or just make a poster with color prints of different varieties,

Irna_co

thx, w look for T5 light. Have timer already

Fortyseven_gw

Why are Optimara for only non- hobbyist? How r they diff from other AV’s? I concluded they where from specific manufacturer and some have been to space. R they lower quality or genetically fragil?

thx. ; )

Nope, just the opposite. Optimara plants have been and are bred to be some of the most resilient African Violets available. They have many nice varieties and in my estimation, represent the meat and potatoes of the African Violet world. A perfect plant for those wanting to try their hand at growing av's.

They are also the primary grower providing the tens of thousands of african violets that are available at your local big box stores. They (Optimara) created a stigma of sorts when they got so big that they could not effectively provide the names of the plants that they provided to the BBS. Once this became the norm, more scrupulous buyers opted for growers that provided the names of the plants they were buying. Soon most moved to buying "only" named plants which primarily ruled out the BBS plants, i.e., Optimara plants.

Even though the Optimara plants that are available at the BBS are un-named, they are so readily identifiable that many people name them by comparing theirs to pictures and other identification available on the internet. (This is generally frowned upon by the rank and file. They are forever to be called NOID'S.)

I still do purchase plants from Selective Gardener. They are really the only vendor that reliably provides the names of the Optimara plants that they sell.

My take - they have a durability of army boots. A lot of them make great show plants. Good plants to start the hobby. And when you advance... you want to wear Prada or Louboutins.. even if they do not have the durability...

Jeff Zenner

- haha ! Great, felt stupid asking as no real information on differences were available. That explains why one of my very 1st plants ( to this new obsession ) is nameless. And, yes..... I was waiting for it to bloom again to try an identification. It had a separate crown so I divided it and removed the blooms hoping to promote growth. Its doing ok. Little trooper.

Irna_co

i hope my advance plantlets survive my messing. Pictures and new conversation to come. Wait til you see my poor Rose Bouquet. It had a horror in shipping and I think it may not like me. That germination dome might be needed for critical care 1st.

What does NOID stand for?

No id-entification! Don't you just love acronyms??? Rosie

Jeff - you are way pass the messing stage. Rose Bouquet is a slow grower - so it is going to recover slowly, Watched kettle never boils. Spa treatment - a dome - is always good - just keep the soil on the drier side. Wick watering and dome on the top - is way too wet.

Cheryl - NOID - is no identification, noname ... plant has a name - but you do not know it and very probably will never find it out for sure. Too many AV,,, over 10000 registered, too many lookalikes as well. Even store bought Optimaras are a challenge. They have some very similar varieties - you will never guess what it is unless you put them side by side.

Regarding the soil humidity measurements - nothing works better than your index finger - and it is free. You want your soil barely moist when you touch it. Second test - lifting the pot. If it is too heavy - you overwatered, if it is too light - it is dry. Water your plant, splash all the water out from the saucer in 15 minutes - check it in a couple days - finger test and lift the pot test. This is how it is supposed to be.

Irina, thanks for defining NOID in a better way than I did. I just threw out the "skinny" version! Rosie

Good to know on the dome and wick. Also, good to know it is a slow grower. I assume because of the variegation and photosynthesis is slowed. Makes sense. I will relax a bit more. Promise pics today.

We probably posted at the same time. I didn't see your post until now.

Anytime a leaf has any amount of variegation, it automatically means photosynthesis will be compromised. But there are fixes for just about everything. Just have to adapt. The tricky part I have found through reading, is when babies emerge all or mostly all white. That gets worrisome. You can't separate them until they "green up" some. Can't wait to see pixs!!!!! Rosie

Oh no, Irina,,,,I think we did!!!! How weird! Rosie

It’s a sad example. I hate to see it myself. Don’t know if I should let grow as is or dismantle and try to save the leaves.

Can you show us? Rosie

Cheryl - you just let it be - most of the time - as long as momma leaf is alive it is feeding white plantlets - and eventually they green up, Fish emulsion and Epsom salt is what people use to speed it up.

Irina, It is not my club I was referring to. It is the major club in the area. We are so GRATEFUL that one member has the ability to grow large quantities of plants that we cannot get anywhere else. I would NEVER say anything derogatory about that club or its sale. For one thing, growing specialty AVs is NOT popular here like it is in the midwest or east coast. For another, We are thousands of miles away from the famous east coast hybridizers. Also, many members of that club are up in years. Specialty AVs can only be bought by direct mail. Most people do not bother. Californians especially are not "collectors" and have no need to do that. There are plenty of locally grown NOIDs available in many retail stores. Not just Optimaras, all kinds. They are strong, cheap, and if they die, easily replaced. Collecting specialty AVs as a hobby is not a popular activity here. That is why people like to join internet groups like this one. As for my local club, they need support, not criticism. They are by now a tiny group of very dedicated individuals. They do their best to have their own shows and sales. They are very kind and generous to newcomers. They go way overboard helping newcomers get started. Once again, growing AVs in this horticultural "paradise" is no longer a popular activity. In fact, many members and hybridizers "aged out" or passed on. AV clubs had a "heyday" back decades ago. There used to be 100 members. Now, ten. Members who want a more popular and competitve activity have moved on. I was first introduced to AV collecting by non-local people and because I am from the east coast. Most local people grow outdoor orchids or succulents.

Cheryl, I did not know anything about specialty violets til I came here and read the AVSA magazine. Before that, I only grew what I bought at retail nurseries. So this club I wrote about is open for AV enthusiasts plus the public. So, the specialty AVs are tiny starter plants. The hobbyists come very early in the day and line up for hours. The general public come later, mid morning ir afternoon. The AVs offered for them are full grown NOIDs in full bloom. They are usually young families with small children who come to buy a few flowering, decorative houseplants. The Optimara plants are near-perfect. They grow in almost any inside house condition. They grow in perfect circles and bloom profusely. I always have many Ootimaras in my collection for gift giving.

Ootimara is the current brand name of the original company that discovered AVs, brought them to the U.S. (California), made them into the "perfect houseplant" to grow in natural window light, not drop blooms, bloom in bouquets held high, grow symmetrically. And remain a medium size. The company has numerous patents. Every advance in AV development is due to that company. They became a commercial company and made the AV into the most pooular houseplant, nationwide. The founder was German and spread their popularity to Europe.

As Paul said, they are easily identifiable. The company introduces about a dozen to 12 varieties to retail stores each spring. There will always be a few classics plus new experimental varieties. Their website is fascinating and fun. You can buy directly from them. There are clubs and collectors devoted to this brand.

Because they are a commercial plant, they are shipped in a plant medium designed for transport in trucks. Many people repot them once they get them home and inspect them for thrips. This company is the reason we can buy a lovely plant cheaply.

This plant and Lyndon Lyon's are the original starter stock for the majority of all developments in AVs.

The commercial plants sold in retail stores tend to be a bit more common-looking than the fancier specialty varieties because they are grown for durability.

However, because Optimara, or Lyon's, is often the original stock most small, non-commercial hybridizdrs use, it is possible to find an Optimara version of most of the specialties from their website, except for chimeras and some extremelh complicated fantasies.

People often show Optimaras at clubs. Sometimes they have their own separate section.

When they first went commercial, I think in the 1970's, the AVSA "had a fit." But if the company had not done that, today, the AV would have all but disappeared as a fad from the past.

Now when I read the AVSA magazine, I see many reprints of old articles. There are few new hybridizers, except for Russians and a few in the U.S. joanne

I would not care for plant shelves that held not a single Optimara plant. As we speak, I think I still have 4 or 5 that I would not care to get rid of. Sort of the A student, captain of the football team kind of plant.

Thanks Fortyseven_gw. Good to know about the transport soil. I know one of theirs is what brought me to this point. Now I have a fascination and warm memories of my Grandmothers violets every window sill. It’s a good thing.

Yes, Optimaras, those "A student football captains" of the AV world, plus Grandmother, are the "recruiters."

By the way, the current generation of AVSA editors fully acknowledge their debt to Holtkamp, the founder of Optimara. Joanne

The ease of growing Optimara tends to make people that same high performance from all AVs. Joanne

Joanne - what I said - is not to put the club down - but to give a idea for the program. Even a small club has programs - correct?

It is wonderful that a big club has a semi-commercial grower - some people just love to propagate and we all enjoy the fruits of their labor.

The sad reality - when the club ages, and no new people come - it slowly passes the point of no return - the meetings become a coffee meet for old friends, people talk about grandchildren and colonoscopies, nobody is interested in plants that much - so even if the new person shows up - they do not stay,

A friend of mine said - for the club to be viable - you need to have 2 people who are passionate - and you need them to be compatible - they can carry the club. As long as your small club has active growers - hands on programs, new plant material - it will keep the members interested. If it is already a coffee klatch - too bad.

You are passionate and interested - you just another like minded member! You people can go on.

I am sure that the tendency is the same - in CA as well as on the east coast - the clubs are shrinking and aging, No time and desire left for growing plants for people who live in a demanding competitive world. But you do not need a huge club - you just need interested few.

I am sure I am preaching to a choir.

When people buy Optimaras and take them home - it is a blessing. It enriches their life, it wakes up the latent interest in growing things, it it great for the kids...

When AV club limits themselves to Optimaras - it is not enough. There are thousands of plants on ebay, there still Lyndon Lyon and Violet Barn, nobody goes to the on-land stores anymore - everybody buys online.

I do not fill my shelves with store bought Optimaras - I can grow my own - and there is always something I want to try - last year project for me was - they had a line of girl leaf plants - Optimara Scorpio, Los Angeles, Orlando etc - in 80-90s, They were not a big success with the general public - so they are not available from Home Depot - but you can get them on ebay, Very well behaved and floriferous girls. Hold the flowers for long long time.

Optimara Los Angeles.

Oh Irina, Opt. LA is so pretty! I like that!!! Rosie

irina_co(z5 CO)

Joanne - what I said - is not to put the club down - but to give a idea for the program. Even a small club has programs - correct?

I would agree with Irina ... even a small club can have programs. For that matter, what about trying to get together with other clubs -- including the larger one you mentioned -- to have programs or sales? It could lessen the cost of having programs or putting on a sale as well as give members from other clubs a chance to see what the other clubs are growing. For that matter, would that one hobbyist allow the clubs to sell as well? From what you described, I wouldn't think the clubs' offerings would grossly detract from her sales. And it might provide the clubs with a bit more income.

The sad reality - when the club ages, and no new people come - it slowly passes the point of no return - the meetings become a coffee meet for old friends, people talk about grandchildren and colonoscopies, nobody is interested in plants that much - so even if the new person shows up - they do not stay,

For a club to survive, new members are critical. If your club has degenerated to the point Irina mentioned, then it may indeed be too late to recover. If not, then it would still require a great deal of effort to resuscitate but may be doable ... IF there are members willing to take action. Which again, to quote Irina, will require at least 2 people passionate about the club who can work as a team. There needs to be programs not only to keep old members interested but to entice new members to come and return. There absolutely must be an up-to-date media presence for that club. It is not just your area which is having difficulty in attracting new members. Does your club have an online presence? Particularly a regularly update Facebook page? The proliferation of online modes of communication has resulted in a generation that by-and-large lacks face to face communication skills. They are much more comfortable texting, tweeting, whatever. Also, sites like YouTube have numerous "how to videos" (not all of them correct) making it possible for folks to see things remotely at their convenience. This is a tough set of hurdles to overcome. Personally, I am not a FB fan ... never have been. But I am fully cognizant of the fact that FB is a mainstay of many people's lives -- particularly the young 'uns. Having an active online presence is the way your club will be "discovered". Regular updates shows that it is active and the types of things one can expect to learn about or participate in and therefore have a reason for attending. Once a new person shows up at the door, then it is vital that the members greet the newcomer and make them feel welcomed or you will never see them again.

I am 100% with Paul.

The plant club when members get Optimaras from the Big Box store and then slowly kill them - and then get more... something is seriously lacking in this picture.

I would think that you can invite this semi-commercial grower to give you guys a hands-on presentation "Propagation Basics", pay this person a speaker fee - it can be $50 - or more - the clubs usually have money in a kitty.

Or you can bring one overgrown trailer and make sure the every member gets a couple leaves or a tip cutting planted in a solo cup.

All is doable - if there are people in the club that want to learn. If it is a group of people who come to socialize only... it is lovely - but it is not necessary a plant club.

My first club ended like that... and our president was really trying - but it was already past the return point.

I understand what you mean. My club is north of me but not so far I can't drive it. Then there is another group (I don't know if it is the same size of us or larger) still farther north than my group. Some of my group are also in the other group and some of the other group come to our meetings. That makes for fresh ideas! And for the Ann Arbor Violet Sale twice a year both groups have people who sell! I am the one who lives the farthest south. It would be a prohibitive drive. But I am the only one so far away, but I am happy to hear what everyone in our group has to say! We already have a pretty good agenda for the year set up. Not an inflexible agenda, but some of it includes our own little judged violet show. Remember my post about Rob's Argyle Socks? One of the members gave everyone a little plant of it that she grew and we are growing to show it and be judged! There are other things also and I think it should be fun to participate!!!! Rosie

My turn! Here is baby Elizabeth, from a leaf in the fall RR. She's the largest of two babies (and the leaf is still going!) Not pictured are the scads of Jolly Mimi babies that are taking over my house...I think I'm up to six now?

What a lovely baby!!! Now don't forget pix of the first bloom!!! Rosie

!Beauty