Just curious as I have no experience with IKEA at all. Does that cleat mean that there is a gap between the back of the cabinet and the wall?

Branden B:

Start here, please, then buy a 4" level.

Ikea all the way!

Hi Joe! That’s a cool system.

IKEA cabinets have legs that are adjustable, so you might not need the leveler if you go that route.

Ikea. You won't need the leveler.

We used the EZ levels to install our Conestoga cabinets in our 100 year old house with crazy uneven floors. Best decision ever. Made it so much easier and they are worth every penny. If you don't go with IKEA I can't recommend the EZ levels enough.

Chess I can't recall a gap, I believe the cleat is inset slightly, but am not sure. The cleat is pretty slim, but very strong. Either way, when you add the end panels, you set those flush to the wall and if there was a gap, that would hide it.

Shoot. I just balanced them on drywall buckets, shimmed 'em hight enough, stood on the counter top (which I made, too) pressed my head against the ceiling and screwed 'em in. So the install, about which you asked, can cost nothing.

The cabinets? $100,000,000.

Or nothing. Or something if you build them yourself. Or as much as you decide to spend!
(Ok, it's the Christmas wine talking!)

French cleats make hanging cabinets single handed a snap. I make mine by ripping 3/8" baltic birch plywood strips from scrap. I'm guessing the Ikea clips are a variant on this old idea. I either extend the side of the cabinet a bit at the end of a run to cover the gap or use a small moulding.

That gap is the whole reason I need new ones haha. It bugs me soooo much.

Extremely open ended question given just pics of existing. Cabinet costs vary greatly. I recently replaced all my builders grade 30s with nice glazed 42s because of 9 foot ceilings. Executed all installation using just leveled 1X strips drilled into the studs. Needed 1 other person to hold while leveling and plumbing. Lots of sites and videos available giving tips on installation. Call me a hack, but the hardest part of the installation was actually the hinge-down sponge holder in front of the sink. Found it very difficult to center and adjust. Was lucky that the walls were pretty plumb, so I didn't have to scribe any of the cabs. A table saw was a must to cut a couple of spacers and the cab front for the sink area, but I already had one.

I've got a pretty good general ability how bad of an idea is it to build the lowers myself?

Bad. If IKEA is beyond budget, why not just paint your cabinets?

these cabinets were a curbside special that the last owner put in. they fit very poorly and don't line up

why is it a bad idea, more expensive?

If IKEA is out of your budget, you are completely SOL. IKEA is as cheap as decent cheap comes. Sure, you can find cheepchinesecrapola garbage lots of places. But most people want to improve what they have. Building yourself requires about 10K worth of tools and beyond just “handy” abilities. You cannot build them for what you can buy IKEA.

Here are two kitchens put together for very little money but a lot of DIY. I throw them out in hopes they may inspire you.

This first on is from the blog French Country Cottage and is the kitchen in the guest house. It uses a few unfinished home center wood cabinets painted white, some shelving built with curtained cabinets, reclaimed uppers and some open shelving:

This explains what they did:

http://www.frenchcountrycottage.net/2012/09/building-vintage-farmhouse-kitchen.html

This next one is my basement kitchenette. I used some of my original cabinets that I had stored in my garage, refinished them, and added shelving where I needed a cabinet but did not have one. (I painted the uppers years ago and hung them in my laundry room - so no uppers.) I reused my cast iron sink from my recent kitchen refresh and Home Center stock laminate countertops. The area was already wired and plumbed and I did not add appliances since it is a kitchenette (someday will have a fridge, right now there is a mini fridge). Also there are built in pantry cabinets under the stairs and not shown that were already there. The cost was about $1000. The majority was labor to have the cabinets set, countertops installed and sink installed - $600 in labor. If I had been able to do that myself, this would have been a very inexpensive project.

[https://www.houzz.com/photos/my-pics-work-in-progress-phvw-vp~65270573[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/my-pics-work-in-progress-phvw-vp~65270573)

Possibilities for cabinets include a home center store - possibly unfinished like in the first kitchen, or cabinets from ReStore. Many people are changing out kitchens and donating nice cabinets to ReStore so check out what you can find there. You might have to be creative - like adding shelves where you cannot find the right size cabinet. You may need to refinish or paint the cabinets.

My current main kitchen cabinets are from a home center store 20 years ago. They were made in the USA and have solid wood doors and frames. They have held up just fine. I refinished them a couple of years ago and expect another 20 years out of them:)

Sophie I have all the tools as I work construction and have a whole box trailer of tools

jhmarie, These kitchens look very nice! I might try to salvage as much as possible for this.

It's amusing to see folks assuming lack of skills and knowledge simply because one does not have a "pro" designation here.

Do you own a joiner? A real sized table saw? If so, and you have the heated and humidity controlled space to set up a shop, you might manage the boxes. A carpenter can manage boxes. Almost all of the faux custom guys buy the doors though.

Doors are a whole other category of difficulty. Mortise and tenon gets a whole machine in a shop production environment. Not a jury rigged drill press. Although if you have a drill press, you can certainly jury rig it well enough. But most carpenters don’t have a drill press. Unless they have a shop already set up. Not a circular saw and bent up framing square in a trailer.

No assumptions. I can read between the lines with the questions that are being asked. They betray the knowledge and skills. I already
know the answers to these vital questions before asking. It doesn't
take a designation to be able to do a project properly. It does take
actual skills and actual tools. Those are never in large supply. And,
the questions themselves reveal the answers here. If you have to ask the question, you seriously do not have the skills or the tools to do the job. It's a lot harder than your average Tupperware party crowd thinks it is.

I’m not trying to discourage you but you work construction, you’re not a carpenter. Do you have a friend who is a carpenter? He or she can give you an idea of what’s involved in terms of expertise and tools, and the cost of materials.

Are there any real Carpenters that can help me calculate the cost of the materials? The wall the cabinets are in are about 9ft

Is about 9ft* Sorry pressed send too early..

You're out of your depth already if you csn’t figure the materials costs. You cannot DIY build cabinets cheap enough. Nothing will be cheaper than IKEA. Unless you work a production environment yourself.

As fond as we all are of carpenters, they tend to prefer to hang out in the Building and Reno forums. You might want to post there as well.

There are salvage shops, as jh points out, that sell cabinets that are in perfectly good condition. Ask your friends at work where you might look for these.

You need to see what is out there and see if you are creative and have some decent math skills:) It is kind of fun to do the looking before you actually have to spend the $.

Check ReStore - there might be some good cabinets to start with. Look at the unfinished cabinets at home center stores and many also sell parts - frame parts, unfinished standard size doors, end panels etc. The price will be different depending on what species of wood you are looking at.

Look at finished cabinets at home center stores - look where they are made. I bought a spice box cabinet a couple of years ago from Menards - it was made by Schrock and it was solid wood throughout. Schrock is part of MasterBrand which includes many, many other cabinet brands (just google it) and MasterBrand cabinets are manufactured in US, Canada and Mexico - according to their website. Since you do construction, you can look at the materials and construction and get an idea of the quality. I looked at some painted cabinets at the home center stores just for fun and did not think much of the quality - but I admit I am a solid, stained wood girl:)

Home center stores frequently have sales - do not feel pressured to make a decision because a sale is on. The sale will be back on in a few weeks.

The unfinished cabinets at Menards (oak, cherry, maple and hickory) are US made - but you still need to assess quality. If you paint, use maple.

I ordered a wood hood - unfinished online. I also ordered the vent insert - I saved over ordering through a cabinet company or home center store, but it was still much more than a simple stainless vent - and a vent has to go someplace, so that will add to the cost. A vent is not required, but important to keep your kitchen clean and decrease odors.

I would put the microwave in your nook area to clear off as much counter space as possible.

If you work construction and can't figure materials, I second the statement that you're out of your depth. This coming from a not-pro, but now-experienced cabinet builder. (I bought the doors that weren't slab.) Figuring material is the easiest thing ever, if you have any construction experience or sense. For goodness sake, it's plywood.

I also suggest you start stalking reuse centers or H4H. You can buy cabinets there for as little as $10 each. And this would includ the doors. I picked up some of mine in those places, after I used up my stock of cabinet-grade plywood. When I realized I could pick plywood cabinets up for pennies, why pay for materials, time and frustration!?

Thanks Rwiegand, I was thinking this was turning into a bash the newbie page. I am going to start tearing the old cabinets out in a couple weeks after New year's and my house warming party. I'm probably going to build my own cabinets unless I can find some good quality real wood cabinets. I'll make sure to keep everyone updated so y'all can keep bashing my efforts

Hi, Brandon

Bashing newbies is Sophie's specialty. You gotta have thick skin to post here.

I'm a moderately skilled DIYer, have made some of my own cabinets, and I began with almost the same basic tools as Rweigand, Making cabinet boxes is the easy part. Getting them square and making cabinet doors is not easy. You gotta love and respect geometry. It helps if you like to draw.

In order to calculate materials, you need a design that includes a 2D layout. With a 2D layout you can develop 2D elevations which will allow you to develop the cabinet dimensions that will ultimately be built. Your kitchen layout could use improvement, and this is the right forum for layout help. Post a sketch of your space, showing all the window and door locations, and let the layout gurus (not me) work their magic. :)

I'll draw up a sketch real quick when I have the time tonight. I'm very good with details and I'm a hobby artist so that might help haha

Branden B, no bashing from me. I'd absolutely love to see how this turns out. I'm still somewhat of a newb here, too, but in the time I have been here I have learned to learn where I can, and laugh at the rest. There are a few here here that, even though they are capable of offering very useful information, they much prefer to be condescending whenever the opportunity arises. It's a shame because while the underlying message can be a good one, it gets lost in the offensive tone.

Anyhoo, I am very much a DIYer, and there are many of us here. We certainly enjoy seeing other's projects and learning from them. Please post updates when you can. I'm looking forward to seeing your progress.

Input your measurements into the IKEA planner. Now double that cost and add 9-12 months to getting up to speed to produce something usable in sufficient quantity on your first go around. It will get faster and cheaper for the sprice cons set, but you aren’t doing a second set. All of the costs and learning curve are in the first set.

Never ever do demolition without a final plan in place, and all materials complete and on hand, ready to go. Education is expensive here. You can learn from others, or you can be hardheaded and learn from your own mistakes.

I just wanted to say that I'm also really tired of all the bashing and negativity (most of which comes from only a few people) on this site.

Sophie that chart is only for people who don't do their own handy work ;) And yeah I'm going to tear it out first for motivation to get it done and for some workspace. Any Carpenters here know what wood to look for for the cabinet boxes? I'd like a darker wood

I disagree with Sophie's timeline. If you're like me, doing everything yourself, becoming periodically overwhelmed, spending months of procrastination? Sure, it can take a long time. If you're like me on a roll, though, you can knock out a couple boxes a day. Assembly line 'em. I also disagree with the drawing programs. That can easily be done, free, with pencil, paper, and probably a good eraser. You can ask me how I know 'bout that.

As far as offering an estimate on materials, I stand by my, "really?"
How many cabs?
For the bases:
No. x times 2, 24" x 34" side pieces, one back x times 34" tall, and a cabinet bottom and/or shelves? (I built in drawers, BTW.)
Mulitply that times how many cabinets you need.
For the uppers? Decide your depth and figure widths.
Figure all that into a 4x8' piece of plywood. Anyone with any construction background can roughly figure that, way better than someone such as I can and did.

If you have the tools, that's a $0.00.
You can do it, but you're gonna need to think about it, draw it 30x, measure a million times, cut 3 or 4, and then it'll come together.

I also stand by the suggestion of Restore, H4H, and reclaim centers. I really did save a FORTUNE once I discovered the great materials and boxes available there. I've done more than a few cabs just putting new face frames on them. (I'm addicted to beaded inset.) I continue to figure that although I don't put a monetary value on my own time, it's still not worth reinventing the wheel. It's well worth a look around for you or anyone DIYing.

Bashing a newbie? OP says he's not.
I was a newbie and maybe just have less need to get my back up. I come to all these boards for advice and recommendations. Take what you want and leave the rest. Turn the channel. One thing I have never been prone to do, even as the newbie I still am, is to keep asking the same question with different words until I get the answer I want to hear. (OP, not referring to you.) What evah!

You will want to find a carpentry forum. Wood moves with changes in temp and humidity. For the sake of stability, boxes are made out of veneered plywood or veneered MDF - helps prevent too much movement. Face frames and doors - make out of solid wood if you are staining. You can stain your cabinets any color you want, though some wood takes stain better than others. Oak is strong and staines well - great for a craftsman look. Some don't like the grain, but quarter sawn white oak is gaining in popularity right now. Cherry has less grain, but can have a red undertone. Maple turns yellow as time goes by and can stain blotchy if the person isn't careful. Some woods like pine are rather soft and are very finicky to stain. So, lots of info to learn, but the information is out there. I don't know if you will find a cabinetmaker / carpenter here though as mentioned there are some great layout people.

Here is the gardenweb woodworking forum, but there are other forums out there.

http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/wood

There are tons of Youtube videos. Norm Abram of This Old House has a series. Many other videos too.

jhmarie, Thank you for the help! I really appreciate it.
I do want a Craftsman vibe so I believe oak is my wood of choice. I'll pay that forum a visit for some pointers

Branden, you certainly can make your own. However, carpentry does not equal cabinetmaking. I have a good friend who is a master framing/finish carpenter, and he's fond of telling me "It's not that hard - it's not cabinetmaking."

I made my own lower kitchen boxes over the course of one year, spending ~6 hours/week. This was after spending ~100 hours on planning and drafting, and who-knows-how-many hours developing my skills before that. The lowers are installed now and I'll be spending the next year building uppers and pantry cabinets.

The answer to "how much will it cost to build" is as variable as "how much will it cost to buy" cabinets. I have built shop cabinets for as little as ~$25/linear foot, while my current kitchen cabinets will probably come in just over $100/linear foot, based on my use of rough-cut lumber, prefinished/veneered MDF, and top-of-the-line drawer/door hardware. Paying a pro to make them made would have been at least 10x that cost (and they would probably not have been quite as OCD as me about the gaps on the inset doors).

Start by estimating how many sheets of plywood or MDF you'll need for all your boxes (which requires having a draft layout), price those sheet goods in your area, and then start multiplying costs. (For reference, my low-end costs are based on plywood at $30/sheet, minimum.) Then add in any material for the drawers, drawers fronts, and doors. Then add in hinges and drawer slides. Don't forget that even with a well-fitted shop, you WILL need to buy miscellaneous tools to get the job done in a reasonable amount of time.

Good luck, and don't take anything personally here - especially when people make assumptions or think they already know the answers to your questions.

PS - Also check out the woodworking forum at Sawmillcreek.org. It's worth becoming a registered member.

Not to harp on Ikea, but IMO you'd be much better off using Ikea boxes and making your own doors/drawer fronts if you really want to make your own cabinets. It can be done, but will probably be more cost effective to buy the boxes and make the doors. You can purchase drilling templates for Ikea cabinets that will speed the process.

RW, I’m tired of trolls who have never posted anything of use on this site in the past, coming out of their caves and posting nonsense on a thread with the intention of pissing people off. You’re the mouth breather that cheers when someone’s about to jump off the roof of a tall building. If you have something useful to say, say it without spewing your nasty on the rest of us.

OP, what a pity you feel diminished by our imput. That’s probably appropriate. We all love youthful exuberance. If not tempered with knowledge and experience it often leads to folly. We have been generous enough to share our knowledge and experience with you, whether you can learn from it remains to be seen. I hope this goes well for you whatever you decide to do. I’m also done here.

I used to work in a cabinet shop. All I did for 8 hours a day for 2 years was make doors. I couldn't imagine undertaking this project without the tools I used to use.

I wish you the best, and buy more clamps than you think you will need and a Kraigjig.

You can do it, but you need to ask yourself if it makes practical sense. I am building my second set of kitchen cabinets, and they are turning out beautiful. But that makes sense because: (1) I have enough experience and sense to build cabinets that are much better than I can afford, (2) I already own all the necessary tools and don't mind purchasing more as needed, (3) I have copious amounts of free time (I'm a teacher) and am not in a hurry to get my kitchen done.

Time may be your biggest factor. Do you have serious time available to learn? Are you interested in doing that? It's not like you can just jump into this without any learning and get good results. Are you willing to read a few books about cabinet making? What is your time frame? Are you willing to make detailed drawings and several revisions?

Regarding tools, you want at least a decent table saw, planer, and kreg jig to build your carcasses (with face frames). If you build doors, you can go several different ways. If you like a shaker look, you could probably get away with your table saw and kreg jig. If you want a bead profile, you can cope and stick with a router table or shaper table. If you want a raised panel, you'll want the shaper table. You can also just buy doors (I don't have experience with that, but many people do).

I do all my drawing in Sketchup, which is free and excellent. There are lots of good tutorials online. Again, this takes time.

I finish with an HVLP turbine gun. You could brush, but of course you'll get worse results.

Definitely IKEA. Good luck!

This is a nice tutorial on drawer boxes.

https://tombuildsstuff.blogspot.com/2013/01/how-to-build-drawer-boxes.html

If you want a kitchen done quickly and reasonably nicely Ikea is great. If you'd like to become a woodworker then start building something.

I find cost comparisons to be difficult, because when I DIY projects I tend to significantly upgrade the materials and spend as much or more than cheap pre-made alternatives.

Last winter I built seven 24" wide frameless four-drawer cabinets for my shop. This took about 8 sheets of prefinished maple 3/4" ply at about $100/sheet, about 8 sheets of 1/2 and 5/8" baltic birch for the drawers at about $100/sheet, and 28 pairs of heavy duty Blum undermount glides at $36/pair plus shipping. It took me two weeks to make them. So about $2800 in parts and two weeks of my time. I'm guessing Ikea might have been cheaper (I didn't look), but I have drawers that I can confidently throw 150 lbs of cast iron parts into and have them not break and roll nicely. I think they look decent, certainly for a shop, and the exactly fit the space they were designed for.

eam44, I'm not sure what I did to get your knickers in a twist, but I do my best to be helpful in my posts (though I do have a snarky tendency that sometimes comes through.)

I would have charged about 12K for those cabinets. IKEA, not so much.

Yeah to the Kreg jig. Cuts HOURS off building. I never thought to mention that. If all the things I have, and the few that I bought myself, the Kreg jig stands out as life-changing. That, and I'm really into my biscuit joiner, planer and jointer. I'm afraid of my table saw because I hate loud noises. Oh- and the B&D Matrix kits. Love those attachments! :) I can be such a guy. Which I'm chromosome-ily (I made that up) not.

I was lucky that my ex- was a GC from birth and when he bailed on me he left 3 generations of tools behind. It helps if you don't have to invest. I was lucky enough to have all the tools people keep telling you you need. They sure do come in handy, that's certain!

(eams, I missed the snarky. You KNOW I can be snarky, so I always appreciate a good snark. )

OP, do you want to see some bad pics of my reclaimed cabinets that I stripped, or of the ones where I put face frames on them? My phone takes horrible pictures and I extremely seldom share, but I think you'd appreciate the cost savings of finding plywood boxes.