My second attempt to germinate was also a fail. I might try again but not until I can do it out in the greenhouse sometime next month using a heat mat.

Annette

Rdback & Annette,

thanks guys!!!

Rdback, thanks for the mention of Aribibi Gusano. Looks a lot like my favorite pepper. I've found it also called Murupi Amarela. I think the one I grows tends to be more yellow than some of these. But it does seem to turn white at later stages of maturity.

By the way, my wife and I visited with Glenn and Linda Drowns, last weekend. Glenn inherited Tom Knoche's frozen seed bank and came up with seed from my Barksdale Wax Pole Bean. The amazing thing was that Tom's seed was from the original, first crop of seed I ever produced, after receiving our start from my wife's grand parents in 1984. Glenn planted it in the summer of 2016 and got a great crop!

Needless to say, I came home with a packet of Glenn's seed, as it will probably widen the gene pool a bit. It's like going back in time 33 years. Here's a link to a write up on Barksdale. Annette is one of our Barksdale connoisseurs.

Barksdale Wax Pole Bean

Macmex, Barksdale is still my favorite wax bean, Although at end of season I package up my extras in separate pkts I keep a small jar of Barksdale seed containing a few seeds from all previous years, this is the jar I grow from. Haven't run into a problem yet but have backups if needed. Having a small garden and growing a lot of varieties I always bag a few flowers on all the varieties I grow, this way if I happen to run into a problem with crossing I have something to fall back on. The only other yellow bean I've liked so far is Grandma Nelliie's Yellow Mushroom but Barksdale is still my favorite. I guess everybody's taste buds are different :).

Annette

Yes, that is the same bean. The information they give for its origin is the same as I gave the Seed Savers Exchange. I'm sure that they got their seed from someone in the SSE. I'm very happy when I see companies adopting and selling seeds I helped to bring to light.

Thank you for providing that link. I was unaware of them.

I heard back from keith, he still has a few Ralph's so he's going to send me a few, it's older seed so keep your fingers crossed. If it germinates I'll plant them this year and hopefully be able to spread them around. I just did a germination test on some 12 year old Seneca Speckled Egg seed, 5 seeds 3 days later they've all sprouted, so there's hope.

Annette

Awesome!

I receive some Ralph's pole beans in the mail today from Keith, they don't look anything like Ralph's Italian sold by Victory seeds. Here's a comparison picture. HMK, Macmex, do you recognize the one on the left as the Ralph's you had?

Annette

Nope. That's definitely not it. The ones on the right look like it (old seed).

Agree with George.

Annette,

That looks like the Ralph's from Tom G. in CT. He sent me some very old seed several years ago, but it never germinated for me. He said the vines had a bit of frost resistance compared to everything else in his garden.

Gary

Gary this is the same man Keith got them from, Keith's seed is from 2012, I'm doing a germination test on them right now, let you know if successful. I just did a germination test on my own 2012 Seneca Speckled Egg seed and got 100% germination, couldn't throw them out so they're in the greenhouse until I can plant them out. Hopefully I will get a few of Ralph's to germinate too.

Annette

Annette, here's what my Ralph's seed looks like:

....and here's what they look like after I germ-tested 10 seeds lol. I did the paper towel thing, then just stuck them in some seed starting pots. Looks like I'll get 7, maybe 8 out of 10 to germinate. Not bad!

rdback, yes I have the same ones, but germination is nil. Have you been able to germinate yours? The other Ralph's I got from Keith are completely different, Not the one we were looking for.

Annette

...ummm, I think we were typing at the same time lol.

That's great news, you may be the only one that has these. I'm going to direct sow the rest of what I have but don't hold out much hope.

Annette

I wish you luck. My germination was zip. Please keep us updated.

Wonderful news! Kudos to Victory Seeds and Mike Dunton for keeping them around!

I don't ruddy believe it, I was cleaning up the other day and went to throw away the packet "Ralph's Italian"seeds came in, It had one lonely bean seed I guess I missed. The rest of the packet I tried every method of germinating old seed I knew with no success,. I said what the heck, got my seed sprouting jar out, dropped the bean in, filled the jar with water, gave it shake, turned it over and dumped the water. I left it on the kitchen counter, muttering to myself I'll throw it out when it starts to smell. Today I went to give it the sniff test, low and behold it had sprouted. What are the odds of that happening. It is now planted out under a hot cap with a band of copper mesh around it. I'm still scratching my head over this. Maybe just maybe if it grows I'll get a few seeds in the fall.

Annette

The bean is resilient isn't it.

Annette, would you explain how your bean sprouting jar works?

"

"Annette, would you explain how your bean sprouting jar works?"

Just another one of my wacky ideas :). It's just a mason jar with a plastic snap on lid used for sprouting seeds for culinary use, I used to use it for sprouting mung beans and radish seeds. I was moving the last of the bean seed I had stored in the fridge to the freezer and I was going to toss some 9 year old Cherokee Trail of Tears when I came up with this brain wave. Put them in the jar, soaked over night, drained in the morning, and for the next few days, 5-6, can't remember they got a rinse, swish, 3-4 times a day. Just pour and empty the water through the lid. Low and behold most of them sprouted. Then of course I couldn't toss them, had to find a spot to plant them ;). I've done a few more this way with good results Juanita Smith for one.

Cherokee Trail of Tears

Both of these are planted and starting to climb. I don't know if it is being open to the air or light that's helping but if it works, not knocking it.

Well George you know I'm a crazy lady, I once helped a Golden Hops vine go up a tree trunk using twine and crazy glue :).

If I'm successful I'll send you some Ralph's Italian in the fall. Hopefully you can help get them back in circulation.

Annette

Great idea! Now off to find one of those lids lol.

Me too! That's a great idea! We need more "wacky" people to come up with such ideas!

rdback how did your Ralph's Italian do? My 'only the Lonely' has gone up and over it's 8' pole and into our magnolia tree. The vine is now roughly 16' and still climbing, we can see flowers, but they are way up there, praying for a decent fall or we won't get any seed.

Annette

Hello Annette. Well, I've got absolutely nothing good to report. I planted out the seven seeds I got to germinate, just in time to feed the bunnies. I put up the electric fence and replanted 10 seeds directly in the soil. Waited two weeks - nothing. Planted another 10 seeds - nothing. We got over 20" of rain from mid-May thru June. Didn't have more than two days in a row without rain. I'm sure the seeds drowned. In fact, this is the worst year for gardening in recent memory. Most of it went in 6 weeks late. Don't really expect it to produce much this year. I still have 20 or so Ralph's seeds. I'll try them again next year. Fingers crossed for 'lonely'.

So it looks like we have to keep our fingers crossed that "Only the Lonely" makes it. Hubby came in to say he can see a few small beans forming high up in the Magnolia tree. It will all depend on what kind of fall we have, no early killing frosts.

Annette

This bean must know it's in jeopardy, I just went out and had a look, starting to flower profusely and found it had also branched and made it's way amongst the wisteria on the pergola, a few beans forming there too. Now it;s going to be finger biting time. Keeping my fingers crossed.

...and, of course, there's a hurricane dumping untold inches of MORE rain. I think the garden is a wrap this year. I can't tell for sure though, don't want to WADE down to it to see!

...we've had rain most every day so far this month, the pods are getting bigger so have my fingers crossed. No sign of frost yet, fingers still crossed but it's going to be touch and go. Hoping for some dry days, overcast is fine, clear skies mean colder nights.

UPDATE: These are some of the pods Ralph's Italian is producing. Victory Seeds call it a green bean but it looks like somewhere in between a green and a wax. Hubby went out and took a pic, said there's quite a few bean coming now, hopefully we'll not run out of time. That heat wave we had earlier really slowed things down.

This cluster was at about the 10 foot level, above the pole and starting to reach for the sky :).

Are you sure that pale bean isn't just starting to dry down? I don't remember Ralph's ever having pale colored pods. They were green and tended to curve a bit. They were good as snaps, while young, but they got tough when seed started to mature. Seed was easy to shell.

Here's a link to Victory Seeds.

https://www.victoryseeds.com/bean_ralphs-italian-heirloom.html

My pods look the same as theirs. They say they originally got it from you.

The Victory Seed photo looks as I remember them to be.

WELL, What I am growing certainly looks like a wax bean, a really nice one but not a green one, that is unless I'm going color blind. Macmex remembers it as a green bean and thinks it may be a cross. After all this he may be right. Has anyone else grown this variety and can chime in?

Still if it isn't Ralph's Italian and it's a goodun' it'll keep the name "Only the Lonely" and IF I manage to get seed I can pass it on to someone who wants to play around with it, see if comes true, it really is a nice looking bean.

Annette

I did a review on Victory Seeds which mentions Ralph's Italian Heirloom. I only just thought to post the link here!

Review of Victory Seeds

Also, I just published a blog post which mentions both Victory Seeds and Ralph's Italian Heirloom.

On Paying the Price for Good Seed

George the flowers on mine are white, the same as they show on their site.

and you can see the pods forming are not what I'd call green.

This single vine has gone crazy it's now about 20 ft. up one tree and reaching into another. If you look close enough you can see a few bean pods right up there.

We had a closer look at a couple of pods lower down, with the sun behind them you can see the beans forming inside the pods but the pods are still hard and firm, nowhere near I'd dare picking yet, fingers crossed. Time for an umbrella over a few as an added precaution.I think I can tie it down so that it won't get blown off.

Those look right. Hope you get seed!

Wow, that's one vigorous - and aggressive - bean vine. Keep a watchful eye out for giants. ;-)

So far , so good, although it has turned cooler it looks like this vine has at least another two weeks to do it's thing. One cluster of pods is now under an umbrella :).

Just throwing this out there, could this possibly be a mutation, I've only had this happen in my garden once before and it was unstable. I grew it out two consecutive years and the seed coat shape and pattern kept changing, it was an oddity and turned out to not be worth growing again.

I've picked one of the pods that felt leathery and have it drying inside, it's thick walled, 8" long, 3/4" wide and I can make out 5 seeds inside, the seeds are spaced out with about 1/2" space between them. I want it to thoroughly dry before shelling.

The seed I planted looked identical to the rest in the packet of Ralph's Italian Heirloom. This vine is at least 20 ft. long. Does this bean strike a resemblance to any wax pole bean you know?

I didn't see any POLE wax beans on Victory's site or did I miss one. I won't know what the seed actually looks like until I open the pod.

Annette

Well, I don't know what I have and it is definitely a wax bean we pulled the vine yesterday and is now hanging in the greenhouse. I picked two pods earlier that felt dry enough to shell, the seed doesn't look anything like what I planted so there was a cross before I got it or it's a mutation. I went to Victory's site and didn't see a POLE wax bean listed so doubt a stray seed made it's way into the packet beside the seed I planted was identical to the rest in the Ralph's packet.

This is all new to me can a green podded bean mutate into a wax bean? I have the white seeded Cherokee Trail of Tears, a mutation of the black seeded variety. Can Ralph's patterned seed produce these?

Shelly stage

Annette

I bet its from a cross, possibly a couple years back. I don't understand the genetics of seed coat color. I've planted all black seed and had brown seeded plants pop up as well as the opposite scenario.

If it is a cross, a first generation cross (F1), then when you plant the seed you'll get a lot of variations, probably including some seeds which are more like the original. It takes space, time and a number of plants to stabilize a cross. I'm working on one now. Just finished the F2 generation.

Well well...

I have a few days off, and was reorganizing my seed storage. All of my seed has been stored in various boxes & drawers, a system which has become ever more cluttered as my collection expanded. I've been wanting for years to transfer the collection into metal file cabinets, to make them easier to access & protect from rodents; but the cost was always prohibitive. Until yesterday, when DW found an incredible deal on used 4-drawer filing cabinets, 4 for $85, in really good shape. So today, I have been transferring the seeds.

To get to the point of this story... as I was pulling some papers from a drawer, a coin envelope with seeds fell out. It was "Ralph's Italian"! So apparently I did not plant all of the seed George sent in 2004. The seed is very old, and may be dead; but I'll plant all of it indoors next year, using old seed protocols. If anything germinates, I'll post an update on this thread. Guess I've got a dog in this hunt after all. ;-)

You never know, hopefully you'll be lucky Zeedman. I had a jar of Emelia's sitting on the kitchen counter in a glass container as a decoration for 15 year and got some of them to germinate. Fingers crossed :).

Annette

Yeah, I have a few left as well. will start inside again and cross my fingers. If they sprout, I hope the garden doesn't get flooded out in 2019.