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b__tertzak

Wobbly Tam Juniper

8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago

Hi, guess this is also a potentially general question regarding what constitutes a well-established/rooted in-ground plant. But since it pertains to a particular variety... I'll just say that I'd be really grateful for some info/advice re why the juniper we planted about 8 months ago still seems a bit shaky/wobbly/unstable when I press down on the soil around its trunk/base...

I'm not exactly given to going around and tamping down on the soil around our plants... but... well maybe a summary might justify my apparent anxiety...

We planted a Tam Juniper at the bottom of a slight slope in our yard about 8 months ago. It, by all (most?) accounts, seems to be doing just fine, is reasonably low maintanence, and has grown about as much as I believe a slow growing plant can be expected to.

While i was giving the drip lines a once over today I happened to sort of pat/tamp down on the soil around its base/trunk, and the the plant seemed rather woblly and a bit on the unstable (semi-established) side. Youngish Junipers tend to have a loose/limber structure so I figure it's going to be less than stiff overall...

Still though, I'd greatly appreciate some advice/wisdom re how "normal" this sort of thing is 8 months after planting something in the ground.

I guess I needn't go wild w/ the tamping/patting just to see how unnestled it truly is... since this won't exactly yield any answers, but I'm quite curious re how well-established the plant can be if it is so (evidently) prone to wobbling/instability when the soil around its trunk is pushed down.

Comments (7)

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I just noticed this same exact thing for the first time just this week with a P. Pungens about 3-4’ tall that had been in the ground 3 -4 years. Totally wobbly. Cant figure it out as this is the first time in 5.5 years and 200+ conifers later that I have noticed something like this. It wanted to lean a certain way so I will probably put a stake in and tie top part to stake in opposite direction so it doesnt settle in at an angle. No idea why as it appears to be just this tree. Ive got major moles on my property but this did not appear to be the cause as their was no tunnel going to the tree and no mole hills nearby (I get new mole hills daily, they dont bother me and soil aeration is a benefit imho). Im stumped too.

    B. Tertzak thanked User
  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    No moles here (not to my knowledge anyway). The only lean/tilt seems to occur when I apply pressure to the soil right around its trunk/base -- any further away and it doesn't move/give much (if at all).

    Am pretty sure the roots were splayed out when it was put in the ground. The soil's on the sandy-loam (quite coarse sand in fact) side -- figure that's alright w/w drainage being desirable and all... and it doesn't look like any of the surrounding soil has washed away (the base's settled in at more or less the same depth as when we planted it, and i don't think it was planted too high/shallow either)

    Some neurosis notwithstanding, I'm mostly just curious why it seems to be so free/shaky right around its base. Not sure if the variety's got something to do with it... the rosemary hedge nearby is planted in the same sort of soil, and they appear to be firm/settled enough.

  • 8 years ago

    Some neurosis notwithstanding,


    ==>>> lol ... i was wondering about fixing something that isnt broken ... lets tread lightly .. see what i did there.. lol ...


    how big was it at planting ... did you bare root ... how different was the media from surrounding soil ... i see you gave most of those answers directly above ...


    i think my best advice is to let it settle over winter ... and then.. basically leave it alone ...


    if the plant is growing just fine ... whats to fix????


    ken

    B. Tertzak thanked ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Most woody container grown plants presented to the retail market in my area are root-bound. With there often being a tight knot of roots right in the center, dating back to when these were left in small bands or pots for too long at the production facility. I'd be willing to bet both the juniper and the spruce mentioned on this thread have deformed roots somewhere inside their root masses, so that it may take them years to stabilize themselves. With the spruce perhaps being bad enough that it is still struggling to get a firm grip on the ground even 5 years after planting.

    For instance I once had several foundation shrubs topple under snow loads here, after being in place over 20 years. When dug up these turned out to have small turnip-like knots of roots underneath their main stems, with only a small number of additional roots ever having managed to escape this initial severe deformity.

    Resulting, again, from extended confinement to small pots way back in their early years.

    The Myth of Fragile Roots

    Containerized materials, especially those in gallon sized pots, often have serious root problems as a result
    of poor potting-up techniques. Potbound plants exhibit circling root systems, which if not corrected
    become woodier and more troublesome the older they get. Eventually these circling root systems become
    girdling roots, which can lead to the early death of otherwise healthy trees and shrubs. At transplant
    time, a more aggressive approach to root preparation can discover potentially fatal root flaws. Circling
    roots, J-hooked roots, knotted roots, and other misshapen roots can often be corrected by careful pruning.
    In this manner it’s possible to remove those root problems before they threaten the survival of your shrub
    or tree.

    https://s3.wp.wsu.edu/uploads/sites/403/2015/03/fragile-roots.pdf

    B. Tertzak thanked Embothrium
  • 8 years ago

    To be quite honest,

    8 months is not enough time for any woody plant to reestablish a complete root system.

    That could take 2 years or more.

    Did you really plant it in February?


    B. Tertzak thanked User
  • 8 years ago

    Really appreciate the feedback.


    Guess I didn't properly nail the keywords re "well-established" and "woody plant/perennial" when I initially attempted to look this up, so am actually quite glad to have things cleared up for me.


    Looks like 8+(ish) months is indeed a kind of baseline for any sort of substantial (substantive?) rooting/establishing to occur. This -- due, by and large, to rampant inexperience -- had pretty much escaped me.


    The timeframe I provided in the original post could've been more... ironclad... too: the clearest (visual/photo) evidence I've @ hand suggests planting took place circa mid-to-late March (so more like 6 months vs the stated 8).


    All things considered, am gonna take/paraphrase ken's counsel and sit pat w/ a less anxiety-addled "if it ain't broke" mantra.


    Thanks again for the examples/info/advice.