I forgot about the hips!!! Thank you for reminding me, Alana.

It depends on the rose. It also depends on what the gardener wants from the rose. It also, also depends on what sort of pest are around locally.

AFAIK, the only pest to seriously attack R. hugonis is the local snowplow.

(continued due to Houzz weirdness)

While R. moyesii 'Geranium' seems quite resistant to the local road crews.

Love Geranium! Alas I cannot grow them all! Wish I could!

Baltimore Belle gets nibbled by the mowing crews.

I think that every rose garden has to deal with some kind of pest. In Las Vegas, it was aphids in the Spring and spider mites during the Summer. The spider mites attacked roses whether they were in bloom or not. So I guess it would be the same for once-blooming roses unless insects etc. have a distaste for the class that many of the once-bloomers seem to fall under? I had some roses that insects would feast on whereas others would be skipped year after year. Blush Noisette, for example, is a rose that the insects seemed to bypass or the damage was negligible.

I have never seen a once-blooming rose in person (to my knowledge or observation) and many of the images on-line show blooms without much focus upon the leaves or bush. I attempted to grow a rugosa and noted the different crinkly leaves. That could create visual interest when the rose is not in bloom.

R. moyesii 'Geranium' leaves are different in appearance, to my eye. Is that leaf pattern etc. characteristic of species roses, MadGallica?

Baltimore Belle (Hybrid Setigera) has very pretty blooms, but the leaves have an appearance like many other roses which I am familiar with. I cannot see it providing much visual interest when not in bloom, and if it becomes a feast for whatever summertime insects arrive... The pain of dealing with that would have to be balanced against six weeks of blooms and hips for I do not know how long...

Lynn, I think of them as the opposite from H.T.s. They are graceful plants and more naturalistic, billowing shapes. The hips and varying foliage add interest. They can be larger, which I love.

I am planning trips to rose gardens in Pennsylvania and possibly Ohio next month and June. I would love to see what you describe, Sheilah! I think the visuals could be a tremendous help.

A neighbor of mine grows them in deciduous Oak trees where they bloom before the Oaks leaf out in the spring. They are just gorgeous then after the trees leaf you do not even notice that they are there.

The moyesii leaves are typical of the spinossisima clan.

It sounds to me like you are really going to have to recalibrate to grow roses in Pennsylvania. The biggest problem is going to be blackspot. The second biggest problem is going to be blackspot. The biggest insect pest is going to be Japanese beetles. Most once bloomers bloom before the JBs arrive, so they are much less of an issue. Aphids get eaten. Spider mites aren't at all fond of the humidity.

I've never dealt with midge. You may want to dig into that issue a bit.

The design of the old Victorian gardens put the once bloomers at the very back of the garden for a good reason. In the spring it was wonderful to walk all around the gardens and see all the roses in bloom including the once bloomers. But when the heat and bugs came, walks thru the entire gardens were less enjoyable and the far corners were ignored. To really enjoy once bloomers you really need space. Double tiering works with repeat bloomers in front of the once bloomers with a hidden maintenance path between. Most once bloomers are quite large as compared to a hybrid tea and they usually set a large quantity of rose flowers. So the bloom time may extend many weeks but 8 weeks might be wishful thinking. If it was so I would be planting a good many more. I always appreciated my once bloomers display and many are so fragrant that it is fine to forget them the rest of the year.

I've never dealt with midge. Now aphids get ate by lady bugs. I am no spray, highly recommended so you have beneficial insects.

I highly recommend seeing the them in person. Maybe you will see some you like more than others. You wouldn't be able to see the fall and winter interest then. I didn't even know some of my Rose's had them, until I grew them.

I do also have some rebloomers for a few fall blooms. I'm not out as much in the summer, or what I do get is fried when I do see it. But its nice to mix them.

Now I just wish you luck when you see them in bloom, if your anything like me, you will want and love them all :)

I've been reading more info on once bloomers. Because I'm still a newbie and you don't see a lot of them for sale in most garden centres. But I really like the look of many I've seen online. Palatine has quite a few that look appealing to me. We have japanese beetles here & once bloomers may beat the worst of the jb season. I also like the idea of hips for fall interest. Anyways, my hesitations are the sizes. I keep reading about larger sizes. Not sure if that's the nature of the rose or for those that live in warmer climates. Then that leads me to my other hesitation, winter cane dieback. I know many once bloomers are considered hardier, but even in zone 5 would they lose a lot of canes in a colder winter, thus affecting buds and missing out on the once a year show?

In your zone, Blondie, hardiness will triumph over all. Corn Hill has some Scots roses, species, Canadian and rugosa that will get large where you are. I had large roses in Alaska that were hardy to z3. If they aren't hardy, they will not do for you.

Halloblondie -

I have read that when possible, one should favor roses two zone ratings beneath the hardiness zone rating for the garden...

I do not know if you have looked at the following once-bloomers, but these are those that I have looked at so far. They are all rated zone 4. Maybe the (4) would provide a little zone cushion during typical Winters in your area:

Félicité Parmentier, (once blooming) (4b)

Mme Hardy, (once blooming) (4b)

Petite Lisette, (deep pink..once blooming) (4b)

Tuscany Superb (4b)

Hippolyte (4b)

Juno (4b)

Crested Moss (4b

Charles de Mills (4)

That's the idea, Lynn. That zone buffer will allow the plants to get large rather than just survive.

Growing roses in Southern Oregon, it must be like rose heaven, Sheilah! It definitely looks like that. Just remembering the garden images you posted. I hope you will post more images of your tea garden when it takes off? I digress...

Have you found any books regarding growing roses in cold climates that you have found very useful, Halloblondie?

Once bloomers tend to have reasonably accurate zone ratings. However, since they don't die back, they do get big, particularly if you are only used to HTs.

About 70% of the roses in my LV garden are Old Garden Roses. However, I think the biggest roses I have grown are MAC and Emmanuella de Mouchy. When I think of a big rose, Cecile Brunner comes to mind. I was afraid to go anywhere near it. I will definitely pay close attention to the size potential of the once-bloomers.

Thanks for the info on the hardiness & sizing comments. I know on this forum; zone & winter hardiness are common discussions, always going back and forth about tip, cane & root hardiness.

Desert - I have looked at a number of the roses you have listed. It's the dark rich blooms like Charles de Mill that draw me in.

I live just under a 2 hour drive from Palatine, which actually puts me in one zone lower than they are. But I'm planning on taking a trip down that way during spring bloom time, visiting a few botanical gardens & nurseries to see things that are not around here. The internet is my main source of research since I do not know a lot of people who grow roses locally. Hopefully, I can see some living examples of some of these old roses & learn a few things.

desert garden - are you in Las Vegas, or in PA? Makes a big difference. The yellow rose on the right above (banksia lutea/ Yellow Lady Banks Rose) would be very happy in Las Vegas - the largest rose in the world is a white version of this rose, which grows in AZ. Mine bloom, depending on the weather (this year it is late - just starting to show color after 15 inches of rain and cold so far this month) from Feb/ March to April. This is a picture of the THIRD story of our house - the roses also cover the first 2 stories. The pinkish coral one on the left is also a once bloomer - the hybrid gigantica Belle Portugaise. It is my most favorite rose for the beauty of its blooms. The last rose below is also a once bloomer (which does not get as big) - de la Grifferaie. My garden is 100% no spray, and we have all sorts of bugs and birds which eat the bad bugs, so they are not a problem.

Jackie

Hi Jackie. I am residing in both places, but my primary residence will definitely become PA prior to the arrival of Summer heat in Las Vegas. I grew the white Lady Banks Rose in Las Vegas. Within a year, it had reached the second story of our home and was growing all over the place. I definitely misestimated what this rose would do, was not prepared and did not have the skills etc. to handle it. It was removed.

Your Belle Portugaise and de la Grifferaie are gorgeous! I am going to research both. Thank you for the suggestions:)

desertgarden - here are 2 pics of a once bloomer which was growing in 3 places on our property when we moved in to our house in 1989 - with no care at all. At that point they were, according to my FIL who grew up in our house, over 50 years old. So, a definite survivor. It is Cl American Beauty, a winchurana hybrid, hardy in zones 5b - 9b. Very very fragrant with classic old rose fragrance. Easy to keep as a bush, but if you want it to, it can make a moderate climber. I think it would like PA. (In the second pic below it is the rose on the far left, growing on the wall.

Jackie

Jackie, you are killing her, since she has to be in PA.

I think Jackie's garden has the potential of "killing" a lot of people. It really looks like a work of art.

I am definitely learning about the challenges of gardening in PA, but am looking forward to being able to grow all of the things I could not grow in Southern CA or LV. I continue to diligently work on my steep learning curve and am inspired by the numerous gardeners on this forum and bloggers who have created beauty/ works of art in cold zones.

@Jackie - I say this every spring when you post photos, "I'm so jealous, I wish I could grow roses like that, they are so pretty, etc.", lol. I do mean it though.

@desertgarden - It's true that we all want things in our garden that we can't have. I remember some of the people on this forum from hot climates wishing that they could grow lilacs or having the bright red leaves in fall of a maple tree. Where I just think they are so common. But I would love to grow some beautiful agave plants or crepe myrtles. But now you can try out some new things in a cooler climate! And it will be a huge adjustment for you with the amount of rain & humidity!

Desertgarden, do you remember hearing about the book _Right Rose, Right Place_ ? I think I heard about it here. This book was written by Peter Schneider who gardened in Ohio. There is a website which talks about the book, roses and garden and gives several Sundays in June when a garden growing these roses is open to visitors. Many of the roses he mentions are once-bloomers. If you are up for a road trip, it might be worth a look-see. There may be some difference between your PA home and this garden but the similarities would outweigh the differences, I would think.

When I lived in western MA, I came to favor once-blooming roses because of the Japanese beetles, which pretty much ruined every rose bloom after the 4th of July there. Also, they were, in general, hardier roses than repeat bloomers. I had a book back then, Hardy Roses, An Organic Guide... by Robert Osborne that I found helpful, because I was also not interested in spraying for fungal diseases, the other scourge of western MA.

Peter lives in ravenna Ohio, north of Wooster and south of Cleveland. It's acutally his garden that has the open house for 3 Sundays in June. I was planning to go again this year, but with the Rose Garden of Legends and Romance closing this year it's a long ways for one destination. ( I'm kicking myself for not insisting on going last year, but Colorado wasn't so bad either and I got to visit Mat at HCR again.

It's a fantastic book that I always recommend. It's probably the book I reference most.

Cl American Beauty is hardy to zone 5b accd to HMF, and de la Grifferaie is hardy to zone 6b, also accd to HMF. The other roses I posted individual pics of are indeed, heat lovers.

The book Right Rose, Right Place is wonderful, if you grow roses in a climate similar to Ohio. As I recall, that is about zone 6, so in theory it ought to be good for PA also. Great book.

Jackie

Peter writes for zone 5 as his section is actually a zone 5. I like to use his roses because that zoning up for me. I'm in Southern Ohio which is 6.

I only grow 2 once blooming roses. For two very different reasons.

I grow "Lady Banks" yellow variety because my mother always grew a gigantic fence eating rambler example of one that grew up into the oak trees and was gorgeous for about 6 weeks give or take every spring.

I also grow a Cardinal de Richelu. I grow him because his is a combination of dark purple and amazing fragrance that I have not found matched in any repeat bloomer I have tried. Twilight zone burns too much and Ebb Tide if I recall doesn't have as strong of a scent to it.

Lady Banks grows on a fence and when she gets size to her, her foliage has a nice quality to it. C. R. grows in the middle of my rose bed surrounded by repeat bloomers and when he is done blooming the repeat bloomers are just coming out so I don't really notice his lack of blooms.

Neither of them have much in the way of pest problems for me. However, from my original experience with C.R. on the gulf coast before moving to the rolling plains, I believe he has a chill hour requirement or something as he never bloomed for me in 2 years down south but has bloomed liked clockwork every year up here. I was told chill hours was the reason but I don't know that to be a fact.

It sounds like many of you would be interested in the Plant Literacy Project (PLP). The goals of the PLP are to improve human-plant interaction by making the plants more aware of human expectations of plant performance. The idea is that if plants were able to read the descriptions themselves, they would understand that it is in fact *they* who are being unreasonable in refusing to thrive in zone 5, despite what the books say. The plants would them be encouraged to conform more closely to written descriptions. Currently, it is the humans who are continually being disappointed by illiterate plants, straining human-plant relations.

Thank you for the recommendations. I purchased Right Rose for the Right Place prior to our decision to move to PA, but all of my rose books are in storage and of no use to me right now. What was I thinking...I still prefer paper books versus those delivered digitally, but I will get a digital copy.

I will definitely look to purchase Hardy Roses, An Organic Guide... by Robert Osborne, Catspa. Thank you for the suggestion.

Cardinal de Richelu is gorgeous, KingCobb. It is definitely going on the list.

I am beginning to think that if the garden is not skewed toward once-bloomers, when the Japanese Beetles arrive, I am going to become like Faye Dunaway in Mommie Dearest - the rose scene.

Lynn, Robert Osborne the "Hardy Roses" author started Corn Hill Nursery which Alana has ordered from recently and I have in the past. They have some great roses at that nursery. I plan to order again. I really love his book.

I've had my Cardinale de Richelieu for 20 years but it has never been remotely fragrant! The color can fluctuate with the temps and sometimes is darker and sometimes more red. It is devoured by JBs all season long along with most of my other once bloomers, not just when it blooms. Marie Louise is an exception with good fragrance and the JBs mostly leave her alone when she is done.

That is surprising

Mine competes with Gertrude Jekyll for scent dominance

The catalougue from the Sacramento historic rose garden lists cdr as having little fragrance

Well as usual fragrance varies from person to person. Helpmefind rates it as good fragrance and davesgarden lists it as very fragrant while garden.org say mild....so go figure...

Wow, Lynn and Comtesse, that is some Mommie Dearest rose scene.

I have read that Gallica (or apocathary) roses were selected for keeping color and fragrance in their petals when dried, not so much for fragrance on the bush. But I have not tried drying the petals myself.

There are many roses that are more fragrant in the humid east than the arid west, or vice versa.

The hips are beautiful in winter

r. Glauca has beautiful grey foliage

Fall foliage and hips of r.Mulliganii

Tiny foliage of Bergundian Rose

Complicata hip

Beautiful foliage of Edmond Proust

altorama that icicle pic of the rose hip needs to be in a magazine. That is so cool!

Six weeks is not really a short time. It is as long as summer vacation. Even a month is not that short a time.

Mad gallica, as an English teacher, I’m all in favor of the Plant Literacy Project. I’d even volunteer to write a standardized test for us to use to determine if they are good roses or not. :-)

I agree with SJN, cool images, Altaroma!

Thank you!