Looks like I gotta decide today or tomorrow, or it will be too wet to get in the garden. There appears to be almost no chance of a freeze in next 9 days. Or maybe waiting one more week will not hurt anything.

Where do you measure soil temp ? Does it have to be as deep as the root ball will be buried ?

I barbecue and I have a lot of digital meat thermometers. I have one probe that's 8" long that I don't use any more. I just put it in the ground as far as it would go, and it said 60* .

I'm sure it will read differently in the morning.

Lynn Dollar, I use to measure my soil temp, but now I just look at the Oklahoma soil temp chart on the web, I dont live in Oklahoma, but a few miles east of the AR. OK. line. I go by the 2" bare soil temp, but you can use whatever chart you want.

Lynn, check out the Mesonet for soil temps.

Well, whatever chart I read at Mesonet, said temps were mid 50's, which would've been fine for planting. And I tilled my garden a couple weeks ago, then raked it into raised rows, which I'm sure allowed more warming.

But that window is closed, its raining now, and if the weatherman is right its gonna be wet for another week.

And my wife reminded me ( her memory is much better than mine :) ) , that last year I planted in the last week of March, but we did not get ripe tomatoes any earlier. The plants set fruit earlier, but then took a long time to grow and ripen. And those first tomatoes that set on the vine for so long, had no flavor or an off flavor.

I wouldn't have planted as this rainy spell was approaching either. The tomato plants don't like staying wet constantly. Tomato production hinges on many factors, including the soil temperatures at the depth of the root ball but also air temperatures. As long as the nights still are pretty cool, the plants will not necessarily set fruit or enlarge it well. You can get fruit to set (by thumping the blossoms daily) with air temperatures in the 50s and 60s, but it is fairly slow-growing until the daytime temperatures are in the 70s and 80s. I usually get the first fruit to set in mid- to late-March by thumping blossoms, and some years by early March, and those won't ripen until mid- to late-April because the weather still is on the cool side 9 years out of 10. I used to be happy to have the first ripe tomatoes by June. Then, I got better at working with the weather and was getting fruit in May. That was great, so I began pushing the limits and trying to get the first tomatoes in April, and most years we do...it isn't a lot of tomatoes in April, but enough for a few BLTs and some happy people. I have to watch the weather like a hawk though and protect the plants and small fruit if a cold night below 45 degrees threatens. I am so far south in OK that Texas lies to my west, south and east so we tend to warm up pretty early here and that makes it possible to manipulate the tomato plants into blooming and setting fruit early. It really matters down here, because most years the type of temperatures that impede fruit set arrive in June and you won't get much fruit set after that, and some years those temperatures arrive in May, and in one horrible year (2011) those temperatures arrived in April.

The saying " time waits for no man " is really true in gardening. The season marches on and either we do or we don't. Its not something for procrastinators ( like me ) .

This cold rain and weather will push soil temps down, probably a good thing I waited. I've shut the grow light off over the plants, so maybe I can slow'em down a bit.

Next weekend looks pretty cold, especially if you believe the European model. The pattern, in general, is going to favor possible periodic cold spells for the next few weeks, probably into the middle of April. We're actually going to be in a "normal" winter pattern, which we haven't seen since it was so cold in November. I do not think we'll see "real" winter, but I bet we're not done with freezes, especially here in Tulsa.

Lee

If I had planted ..... it appears this Friday night would've been a problem. I could survive that with 5 gallon buckets, but getting into the garden with the buckets would've been a muddy mess.

I gotta slow these plants down , though. They're getting out of hand. I've done this for years and never had them grow like this year, I don't understand it , not at all. My seed plantings were too successful.

The bottom leaves on many of my plants are yellowing , any theories on why ? Too much water ? Not enough ?

Lynn, I have not had a lot of problems like that, but, the first time I tried my hand at starting tomatoes I had no lights to put then under. I started my plants on a make-shift table in front of (3) 30" windows that were side by side, on Jan 25th. The way I handled my problem was to build a make-shift greenhouse just outside of those windows. ( I was single at the time and could cobble up any thing I wanted to) Everything worked out well, but it was not worth the extra work.

I think that the lower limbs die first anyway. I think that if those plants were mine, and I could not plant them, I would go ahead and pot them up and carry them out side each day that I could. I have pretty good luck now by using plenty lights and giving the plants plenty room, plus, most of all, dont plant start the seeds so early. You can lay the plants down when you plant them and still get a good crop. For me, it is just too much work to start seeds too early. I do often buy a six pack of plants early and try to have a few plants to try to get a jump on the season, but no more starting seeds in January , it is just too much work, I am not equipped for it.

I have used an old frame of a pup tent style greenhouse and toss a peace of plastic over it, using a piece of 4' x 12' conveyor belt for the floor It work very well, but most people dont wont that kind of junk piled up in their yard. I have a very understanding wife, and all she says is " when are going to put that stuff away. I would place it on the south side of the house and I think that the white siding reflected heat and light that helped my plant. I dont do that any more because it is too hard to get down and crawl in and out of the greenhouse to move the plants in and out.

The short answer, for me, pot up and sit out side in a protected area to keep the wind from tearing them up, or get them in the ground as soon as you feel safe.

I'm shooting to get them in the ground next Monday. Not much longer.

Any chance you can put those tomato plants in one gallon pots, and give them a couple more weeks before they go in the ground? There will likely be more cool/cold mornings the next few weeks....at least 30's, maybe more freezes.

Blach. Thanks, though, wxcrawler, for the heads up. As God is my witness, I will NEVER EVER plant tomato and pepper seeds before March 5, ever again.

I think I can survive any freeze above 25 to 27* , just depends upon how long it stays at those temps. I've done it many times in the past. Even if I waited to April 10, there's always that late freeze , it seems.

And I have back up plants.

The last few years, I've had trouble with germination, both in number of seed germinating and how long it took them to germinate. Last year, I had to order fresh Big Beef seed from Johnny's in middle of February.

So this year I planted early, just prepared for Murphy's Law to take effect. Cuz ole Murphy has been running me ragged. And guess what, everything went perfect. And I'm taking note of everything I did this year.

Biggest lesson is don't be cheap and rely on older seed, even one year old seed. Get fresh seed every year. If I'm gonna work this hard at something, then don't scrimp trying to save a few bucks.

Lee, It is good to see you here. Despite the early warmth (and mostly nothing but warmth since November except for a few cold nights down here at my end of the state), I haven't been "feeling it" and have nothing at all in the ground in the veggie garden (we've been too wet) and haven't rushed any tomato plants outdoors into big pots either. I'm waiting for the weather to stabilize and for the soil, even in the raised beds, to dry out. I even started my tomato seedlings very late indoors this year because that little voice in my head kept telling me not to hurry, so I can be patient and wait for the cold weather to pass and the temperatures to stabilize more.

Lynn, Yellowing leaves are merely a sign of stress, so you have to figure out what is stressing the plants and correct that. Possible causes of stress: plants are getting too dry at some point, or being flooded and kept too wet or fluctuating too much between being too wet and too dry. The plants need nice, even moisture at all times, not too wet, and not too dry. Because the plants are pretty close together in the flat, the foliage on upper branches could be preventing good light from reaching lower branches, or another possibility is the plants need to be fed and haven't been fed. Those are the most likely reasons for yellow leaves on plants of this age. Due to the larger size of the plants relative to the size of the cups they are in, the plants probably are rootbound, making it increasingly difficult to keep their soil evenly moist, and this could mean they are suffering both from a lack of moisture and lack of nutrients. If you are going to have to hold the plants indoors another week or two, I'd pot them up to larger cups and that would alleviate the issue of being rootbound, which should eliminate the problems that come along with the plants being rootbound. I've been watering my son's and daughter-in-law's tomato plants this week while they are on vacation, and theirs are in cups about the size of yours and the plants are even bigger, and they definitely are rootbound, so I water them well in the morning and again in the evening, and they are completely dry before I start watering. If they were my plants, I would have been potting them up this week to larger cups, but I didn't want to overstep and do that to their plants while they were gone. Maybe I should have. They're on their way home today so they can handle it themselves once they are back.

I agree with Lee that waiting a little longer will pay off. OK is just too prone to late 'surprise' freezes and frosts, even after it seems like we should be past all of that. I have frost blankets that give 10 degrees of cold protection (because I love planting early to get fruit set early) so I certainly could plant early and cover them up if I wanted, but it is a pain in the neck to haul out all the low tunnel supports and the row covers and cover the plants, so this year I have started late on purpose and am willing to wait patiently for the weather to stabilize so I can avoid that whole routine of covering up plants at night and uncovering them in the morning. I started my seeds a month later than usual this year, and have no regrets at all. Even though our days have been plenty warm, and sometimes shockingly warm for a few days, and the nights have been decent enough, we still occasionally dip into the 20s or 30s at night. So, I'm just waiting on the weather. I just potted up my tomato plants to larger cups this week.

My average last freeze date is around March 28-29, but we seem to get a late frost or freeze later than that more than half the time. I consider our low-lying creek hollow in the already low-lying Red River Valley to be a cold microclimate that has to be managed carefully. I love planting my tomato plants in March to beat the heat which tends to arrive too early here, and often do exactly that, but also wait for my gardener's intuition, which I jokingly refer to as 'the voices in my head' to tell me it is okay. I also tend to wait for Lee to give us the all-clear weatherwise. Last year I remember well we had a late freeze on April 1st and I had to cover up all kinds of plants. That makes it a bit easier to be more patient this year...and, believe me, I am not at all a patient person.

Dawn

My plants on this day last year

Amazing, in spite of all the rain the past two days and this morning, when the sun came out at noon today, and temps got up near 80, then the big gusty wind ....... the garden is drying out quickly . I will have no problem getting in the garden and planting Saturday .

Well, the ride begins ...... average last freeze in OKC is March 30.

Lynn, your garden sure looks good. I now have my mower stuck in my garden, I did however get most of it mowed. I also tried to take a bucket of compost into the north garden (where the mower is now). Even in 4 wheel drive, the tractor would't pull up into the garden. I just dumped the compost at the edge of the garden, and will use a shovel to toss spread the compost to where I need it.

I'm sure I have the advantage on you, of smaller scale.

I plant a winter cover and its a lot of work. I plant a mixture of rye, oats, and austrian pea. If we have a mild winter a lot of it survives and I have to chop it down with a weed eater. Then I put it into a 40 gallon trash can and chew it up with a weed eater. Then it goes back on the garden to be tilled in. Even if we don't have a mild winter, it doesn't till back into the soil very easily.

But that said, I have soil tests done every year by OSU . They always tell me to add nitrogen " in two months " , or something to that effect. I've never done that. Tilling that organic matter back into the soil adds all the nutrients my garden needs.

Lynn, I like the way your rows are elevated, that is the way I try to build my garden ( the whole garden ), rather than just the rows. I dig a ditch around the garden and use the soil from the ditch, plus compost to raise the level of the soil, ( the whole garden sorta like a raised bed ). The past two years have been so wet that the north garden is not high enough, both gardens are just a few inches above grade. When I first starter gardening this way, I used a tiller and a shovel to dig the ditches. I am not able to do that anymore, but I have a tractor now that makes the task very ease. I fill the ditch with organic matter and scoop it out about every year or two and refill it with organic matter, that is where I get some of my compost. The ditch is why my mower is stuck, and why the tractor would not pull up into the garden from the north side. I am too tired to pull the mower out tonight, I have also had to drag it out of the bar ditch in front of the house today. My lawn is so cut up from tractor tires, and we are suppose to get more rain.

Making the raised rows got a lot easier after I bought one of these landscape rakes, the same rake they use on baseball diamonds to smooth out the base paths

Landscape rake