Evap coil $2K - too expansive. Find a better price. If your system had a copper coil 12 years ago it was junk in the first place. The replacement of one cased ICP coils with another pretty generic Al, Ti ICP coil and is NO Cadillac engine in a Chevy.

2) The coil won’t last etc. - Pure B.s. If it replaced property most coils will last 10 years. You furnace or HP unit may not last 10 years, but your coil should.

>ok so a new coil won’t work as efficiently as an old one

That is pure B.S. You coil designed to boil the refrigerant. Some old coils may had a piston metering while newer will have TXV that will make them more efficient.

===

Pro: you will have working system

Cons: other components may fail like HP sooner than this coil.

IMHO all depends on overall state of the system, how well it was installed.

just swap out the coil. That's quite a high price but prices are local - the only way to find out if it is fair is to get multiple estimates. Oh, and a Cadillac engine IS a Chevy engine!

The replacement coil is a repair to your older AC system to get it to work again. Will it work, how long it works, how good it works is depending on a myriad of things.

It will work if the repair is done properly, coil is properly matched --- but it doesn't 'have to be' a Carrier coil to work. We're talking skill here not old wives tales.

I can't tell you how many systems I have repaired due to a leaking evaporator coil. In some cases the condenser dies a short time later. But many times the systems I've repaired years ago by doing this fix, they are still running today. 26 years of doing this for a living, not just bored with nothing to do than comment in a forum board. (Some people will hate that comment, truth has a funny way of slapping certain people. Your choice to take my advice or not.... there is risk there but you don't get an old, old AC by not repairing it when it breaks. That said you could put in a new one, and the new one could break in a year or two. Replacing the AC each time it breaks gets expensive.)

An HVAC contractor does not have an ounce of future telling ability. That talk about price is a sure fire way to more problems. It's skilled labor, take away that skill for a cheaper price you got labor, a dangerous concoction when it comes to your poor HVAC system.

Thanks for all of these replies, this is what I was hoping to get - to learn what is involved. I'm not a n opinionated blowhard so I'm not trying to disrespect anyone. Coil replacement should be looked upon as an economic decision. But when people say "you replace the coil and then something else may go wrong and you'll have to spend for that".. well my answer is that something else can always go wrong. If you have competing needs for cash then you have to look at spending the smaller amount (i've been quoted 7k for a Rheem 14 Seer and 10k for an Amana 16 Any advice on these brands. My current units are Infinity. One is the noisy reciprocating compressor I believe and the other uses a scroll, again I say this because it is much quieter). They were installed 2007/2008 when 410A was new.

Meanwhile the unit is working today maintaining a setpoint of 72 (a relatively warm day here at 41F). When I called on 12/2 the Infinity stat reported a malfunction temp was 68 (call for 70). Another curiosity is that 10/29 on winter tuneup, no problems reported, I assume they check coil pressures. So one month later it was declared low on 410

I guess the tech restarted the unit, I may have falsely assumed the unit had shut down when I called because I turned it off.

I'm getting another company to run diagnosis again to get an independed view.

Thanks gentlemen, for your input

Forgot to mention, Amana quoted has lifetime compressor and all systems have 10yr parts and labor, they said no exclusions. But I bet they charge a diagnostic fee which if they do would not make sense since they are supposed to fix anything free under warranty

Depending on the system purchased Amana has life time replacement if the compressor fails for upper tier models. The labor warranty is an add on that you pay for, if you don't maintain the unit via annual maintenance that labor warranty can be voided. Depending on the company you may have to pay for refrigerant / possibly other add on charges like freight / shipping handling and such.

Diagnostic / Service fees tend to revolve around a window of certain things that aren't covered by any warranty like maintenance issues as an example. Or service outside of normal business hours. In some cases the servicer may waive these charges once it becomes apparent what the problem is and your service history (maintenance of the system involved).

It's is an industry leading warranty, but there are rules to be followed. Not just 'do whatever you want' because you have a warranty.

In terms of replacing a evap coil to repair a unit, that unit at some point breaks due to other problems... why do you think I would say such a thing? To be snide?

No, I actually run service. I actually deal with people and their perceptions. I can NOT count on two hands how many times a unit has been repaired by me and someone has this notion that the unit should never break down again. What does this mean? It has happened repeatedly through out my 26 year HVAC career.

People love gimmicks... you know like: It's hard to stop a Trane.... but Trane's break just as much or more than any other brand. I work on all of them.

So if you can't handle reality, you should probably go back to being a renter and let a landlord fix your HVAC problems. I know you probably won't like that comment either. That's life.

I fix air conditioners, I don't fix people or their perceptions of how things 'should be in their realm of the world.'

In terms of comments on a forum board, I am not in the sugar coating business either. If you are old enough to own a home, I am under the perception you are old enough to handle the truth and don't need a dose of sugar to swallow. Regardless of how bad or how much you don't like the information I am providing you with.

Now if you prefer sugar coating, you're just looking to get sold. Plenty of companies to choose from if that is what you want. These companies will tell you everything you want to hear. Once they got your money... well you'll see soon enough.

Also consider that R410A will be phased out because of GWP. There is a drop in replacement like RS-53 (R-470A) but it probably uses different oils and require full removal of R410A.. We know R410A prices will be going up.

Hey Austin, I think you got me wrong here. No I'm not a penny pinching old skinflint. I'm not rich but I believe in buying the best stuff I can afford. 12 years ago when I started taking bids for my HVAC - 2 units, I had several estimates. I rejected one man and his truck who said he "never pulled a vacuum, didn't see the need for it" but was dirt cheap. I rejected a very honest guy who does good work who said he was wary of 410 and was not going to put any unit that used it. I rejected Goodman because I went to the dealer to look at the unit in operation and the wire cage around the fan unit was rattling when it was working. I rejected the Trane guy , well I did not like the spiny fins to begin with, but in the course of the visit I told him that my dryer vent was depositing lint on the AC units and he came up with some several thousand dollar solution to move my current unit. I went to the grocery store and bought a colander which I put over the vent and it collects the lint which I empty from time to time. I ended up getting the Infinity units, still look good after all these years. They were top of the line Carrier units.

I've had a good relationship with this company for 12 years. Went along with anything they said I needed. Run cap for $300 the last time, raised my eyebrows but I went along with it. If you win my trust then your my man.

Oh and I soundly rejected add on ionization cleaning because I know they create ozone.

Now lately the company has bought a Dr. Energy franchise and the guy who runs that is selling the iron now. I spent 4K sealing the home, on his advice not sure now about that.

I find now that when they come out on a maintenance visit they always recommend air cleaning, surge protection etc. The tech once apologetically told me that they are required to do so by the company. That I don't like, that is not his job.

Believe me, when you get to be a certain age there are people out there ready to take you in. Like my auto dealership. I knew I was going to get a call yesterday because my car had crossed 70K when I took it in for an oil change. "You've got a TON of oil leaking out of your valve timing cover, we need to replace it YES or NO $2530". Well if that's the case why isn't there oil all over my garage floor? Well that's because it is collecting on top of the motor (lol lol lol). I go in and no need to put it on the rack as he promised, pop the hood and he points to some smudge that looks like an oil stain under the cover. No visible signs of even droplets of oil seeping out, let alone a TON, whatever that is.

The guy from the company I use says they don't use Carrier anymore. Why? Because it is all made in Mexico now. I look it up and it turns out nearly every company is moving some production to Mexico. He recommends Amana. I ask the next guy about Amana (I didn't tell him it was a recommendation) and he says "Amana??? you know who Amana is, they make kitchen appliances". Well Mitsubishi makes a lot of things and their mini split has been running in my house faultlessly for 10 years. Except when the drain line backed up, destroyed my floor and subwoofer. The current company has the maintenance. Tech comes in and says "Oh they just do that". Then they sent a NATE guy and he says "Why didn't you tell the guy to be sure and drain the line, they always forget, I need to tell them to be to sure to do this". Really?

I listen carefully to what people say. By the way the guy recommending Amana from my current company said my ductwork in the attic was not good and should be replaced. I read the maintenance report from October a couple of months ago and it says "GOOD". I ask two other people who came in and they said nothing wrong with it.

The world has changed, it's the Wall St mentality, find how you could boost revenue by upselling what the customer does not need. They don't realize they can do just as well ethically by doing good work and charging more for it. I have no problem paying 2x if I feel you are doing the best job possible.

And it does not make logical sense to charge a diagnostic fee when you have a no exclusions warranty. I'm not saying that's the case, I will ask them, but it flies in the face of logic. I don't think they charged me that when I had the warranty (it is expired now and I'm ok with the fee).

So bottom line, I will always respect, and do, the people who come into my house for their knowledge but my advice to them... I'm listening so don't give me any BS and also don't shrug it off without taking care to explain why you are saying what you are saying as if I'm too stupid to know.

The unit failed again overnight (low pressure it said) overnight when temps went down. So perhaps refrigerant is low but the October maintenance check did not catch anything amiss

Axg9504,

yeah it's quite possible I got you wrong, but that response wasn't necessarily for you alone, but others who happen along this thread. I have to cover all my bases so to speak.

There are plenty of my main customers 'who get it'. You know the idea of repairing an older unit that it will break again... it's the 20-30% that ruin it for everyone. Maybe I have been dealing with people for too long and every little thing lights my fuse? I don't know, I am human too you know.

In terms of no exclusion warranty, you must realize they are trying to sell you when they say things like that. Then years later when you start having problems they have selective amnesia or Amana manufacturer did something to upset them and they've run back to Carrier or some other equipment maker. My opinion is put little trust in a so called no exclusion whatever. Read the fine print and all you'll see are exclusions! LOL.

I think you said you have an Infinity Heat Pump. So they probably didn't check the charge... because to do so you have to run it in AC mode. If it was cold outside at the time, this makes that part of the check harder to perform in cooler weather... the down side of owning a heat pump, among other issues depending on where you live.

No problem, I can imagine what it must be like dealing with customers who are always on antagonistic. I'm OK with the warranty terms. I'm not sure about twice annual checkups. Now I have switched to Air Bear media filters so they put two in twice a year. I had previously an Amana and a Carrier. The Carrier ran 13 years with no regular maintenance except for some cap replacements.

Do you like the Amana they are proposing, they also have a 14 Seer Rheem as the cheapest model and the rep actually proposed doing that since it is an upstairs room and only used when we have company. The Rheem is a basic single stage unit.

I am trying to find out the model number on the Amana but I think it is ASZC16. I had to ask what they were selling me because they have some agreement to use the HVAC company name in model description:

XXX TruComfort Signature Series Heat Pump (dual speed)

XXX TruComfort Pro Series Air Handler Variable Speed Blower.

XXX is HVAC company name

The rep said Amana was "allowing" them to use their name. I know of co-branding where both names are used. I know of very large companies sourcing things (Amazon Basics line) having things made to their specs.

12 years ago this company was an "award winning" or "distinguished" Carrier dealer. Now they don't recommend it.

The specs say "Unit replacement if Compressor fails"

My unit is failing with a low pressure code. I should have written it down, now I don't know how to get back to it using the Advanced menu on the Infinity thermostat. I think you hold the Advanced button down for 6 seconds, I'll try that.

Anyway couple of things irk me, a few months back we had a malfunction on both units, the tech fixed it without replacing anything. And is it possible that the system was rated working within specs late October and then early Deember it needs a coil? I thought leaks were very slow.

Thanks again for all the good info.

I have Carrier Infinity furnaces and AC condensers which which will be 12 years old in April. I am interested in the details about your coil failure. Was the coil a Carrier or a third party? If it was a Carrier can you provide the model number?

If you have a trustworthy HVAC repair person I would be inclined to replace the coil. The Infinity is very nice equipment. But it is a gamble if the person who is doing the repair is not competent.

25hna624 two stage. coil is original Carrier. The company I get service seems to send capable people for installation. Not so sure about annual inspections, some seemed uncertain. Anyway, I'm getting other people to look at it too. One company was a large Carrier dealer back then and is NATE certified, I think that means all their techs have that credential. I have heard people say you just pay to get that, don't know. Don't know details of failure, just that there is a bad leak, will require replacement or could be just charged up to kick the can down the road.

You have a leak. Most likely place is the evaporator coil. Second most likely place is the condenser coil, least likely place is the lineset. There are other possibilities (eg schrader valves, but that's usually an installer/service tech issue). Like I say, I'd get the coil replaced after getting a couple more estimates.

The coil model number should be on the sticker on the coil. I have the tin plated coil which ends in ATA. The other choices are ACA which is the old copper coil which had problems or the newer ALA which is aluminum. I was curious which one was installed on your furnace.

@mike_home sorry but to get the coil number I believe I would have to take off the cover and it's up in the attic. Anyway, when I get the next estimate I will be sure to ask what the three letters are. I guess this would explain the difference in costs

Do you like the Amana they are proposing, they also have a 14 Seer Rheem as the cheapest model --- The Rheem is a basic single stage unit.

I am trying to find out the model number on the Amana but I think it is ASZC16. I had to ask what they were selling me because they have some agreement to use the HVAC company name in model description:

XXX TruComfort Signature Series Heat Pump (dual speed)

XXX TruComfort Pro Series Air Handler Variable Speed Blower.

XXX is HVAC company name

The rep said Amana was "allowing" them to use their name.

Ah, OK a couple of things... There is nothing wrong with Amana. I've installed it many times. Rheem units I've repaired many times nothing really wrong with those either. Most of this comes down to how well you take care of it. Who installed it, how they installed it and so on.

I have installed over 8 different brands of HVAC equipment. Not to brag but to tell you brands don't make much difference... when you know what you are doing.

Most people don't realize what I say here, most of what manufacturer's do is a mirror room of competing brands all of them made by 7-8 manufacturing companies.

So the most important in my eyes is: buying the model that has the options you want, lowers utility bills, keeps you comfortable etc. The more options you buy the more it will cost.

The Amana ASZC16 is a 2 speed heat pump. The lowest 2 speed you can buy. Not a bad unit, but not as efficient as say the AVZC20 which is the Amana 20 SEER inverter heat pump.

I put in an inverter heat pump at my home last year, I didn't choose the Amana. I went with the Bosch 1.0 18 SEER inverter heat pump. This can and will throw some for a loop why I often sell Amana but went with the Bosch. I have sold the Bosch to others as well.

It's knowing and understanding how these things operate. So to keep this short all I am going to say is it was a choice based on what both do, how they do it AND the cost involved to pull it off. Their are risks in using the Bosch that aren't there with the Amana brand. So it's a choice is what it is.

Now in terms of a Company True Comfort xxx air conditioning made by so and so...

They can do this because they move a LOT of equipment. Probably in the 100's of thousands of dollars a year. Carrier upset this gravy train by getting too greedy most likely and this company shopped around while waving a cash stack, ready to buy a lot of equipment.

It's really no different when Kenmore sold their branded AC back in the day made by none other than Carrier ironically. The reason companies do this is only they can sell you a 'True Comfort' so and so. You know if brand is so important to you and nothing else is. That's why you need to avoid the 'my brand is better than your brand' they all break.

Going with a bigger company has it's plusses but also it's negatives. The negatives revolve around the feel like another number to the company. Most of my customers are on a first name basis with me. I am the only one they ever see. So many ways to do something as you can see here.

While high, the price seems about right. the replacement coil should be al match to the failed Carrier coil, no third party brand. The question is the cost of the replacement coil versus a new system. How long do you plan on being in this home.? What is warranty? Guess what? Even with the replaced coil, you will still have a 12 yr old system...

good luck

IMO

Mini-Split Warehouse,

Is it necessary to have two spam posts in the same thread? Did you loose track of the several identities you use when posting spam?