Anything he finds with his inspection, if if he doesn't buy and does share with you, must then be part of your disclosure for future buyers.

That is actually not true in most states. It is an incredibly popular oversimplification and if you search information on the internet or ask a realtor, they will often tell you that you have to share defects found in a previous report. However, when you actually look at the disclosure laws or precedent, most states carve out an exception for items found by a buyer's inspector so long as you didn't pay for it.

I learned this one the hard way, in an estate sale when the children didn't disclose massive termite damage found in a previous inspection. I lost a case pretty quickly because they were not required to disclose it even though they were given a copy of the report. My inspector missed it because the home had been recently "updated" and the damage covered up by the parent who passed. Honestly, I was stunned I didn't win, as I couldn't believe a 90 year old guy in hospice care was remodeling his house...

You should, of course, check with a local real estate attorney.

You have a dilemma. Has your agent advised you to do a pre-listing inspection? Some agents think this is a good idea because you have a second pair of eyes on issues that you may not know about or have forgotten about. You might consider one of these. Some sellers will repair some or all of the items. Or, you may decide not to conduct one these. It is entirely your choice.

You buyer is getting a little more serious by upping the price. They are willing to spend the money for an inspection.

Is the new price in the ball park? If yes, let them inspect. Tell them that in light of the inspection, the sale will be "as is". Also, you don't want to be informed about the results of their inspection. You will refuse to discuss it with them. Either, they like the house after inspection or they don't.

If the new price is nowhere near the ball park, tell them that the offer is insufficient for the effort. You appreciate their offer. You will wait for the agent to return and will put it on the open market. They are welcome to bid at that time.

From a buyer's standpoint, there is no way most buyer's should purchase a home without a pre-sale inspection. I wouldn't do it. As a buyer, I would pass. Asking for an inspection is a prudent financial choice.

Here is a direct quote from the email he sent us two days ago:

To reiterate the conditions of the sale we would buy your home as is, and in cash - to simplify the process. The only contingency would be the engineer's report.

My personal take is that he sees a fish about to take a hook. Do yourself a favor and get a real estate agent to actually put it on the market. My second take is that you have way under valued your house.

From a recent article in Money: "According to real estate brokerage Redfin, the national median home sale price was $336,200 in February, a 14% increase from a year earlier. More than a third of homes sold above list price last month and Redfin says more than half of the offers placed by its agents faced competing bids for the 10th month in a row."

Don't continue with this person, tell him you're going to list it and he can present a competitive bid to your agent or to you if you are writing him in as an exclution. ..to simplify the process...Who is this being simplified for? HIM! You will simplify the process by turning it all over to your agent. Is this the same person who wanted to take advantage of reducing his price by 4% because you weren't using an agent?

If you have three potential word of mouth buyers competing against each other, imagine how much more the price will rise if you open it up to the world.

If the realtor is going to add value to the property by getting more offers then fine. Once they bring you a better offer, then accept that offer, pay the realtor's percentage and be happy that you got more money.

However, if the offer that you had in hand before signing with a realtor is still the best offer, then accept that and don't pay the percentage.

----

Personally, I am a big fan of the offer in front of me. I also like dealing with people directly with buyers and so would actually add weight to an offer directly from a buyer. How much I would discount the house based on those things is the only real question, but certainly anything less than the realtor's percentage is a no-brainer.

@bry, I don't really understand your last paragraph. Are you saying that dealing with a buyer you know takes precedence over an anonymous buyer found by my RE agent? I'm concerned with not having the hand-holding provided by that agent. For example, I don't know how to ask for a credit report on this buyer I know professionally; the agent clearly can do this. My RE lawyer doesn't do this (I've asked).

This is exactly why you need a realtor, so they can take care of this stuff. You shouldn't have to ask for a credit report, but you should have their pre-approval letter in hand, are they pre-approved?

I'll say it again... there is no way I'd sell w/out a realtor in this market. House up the street just sold for $236k OVER asking, with 23 offers. This house last sold 8 years ago for $750k & is now worth 1.6M. It's absurd. You'll never get the best price dealing with a few people, open it up to a wider audience & get a bidding war going, that's what I'd do.

Get a real estate agent! In this market, you will reap far more with a good agent. Many offers in this climate are cash and the buyers waive inspection. This is the ideal situation. Take a breath and wait for your agent to get back from vacation. The market will still be there. I just hope you didn't pick the agent based on listing price but rather by their exprience, marketing plan and actual sales performance.

Are you saying that dealing with a buyer you know takes precedence over an anonymous buyer found by my RE agent? I'm concerned with not having the hand-holding provided by that agent. For example, I don't know how to ask for a credit report on this buyer I know professionally; the agent clearly can do this. My RE lawyer doesn't do this (I've asked).

Selling a house is not that hard and you don't need a full service brokerage to handle the sale of a house. In fact, with a few internet resources you don't need any brokerage. You don't need a credit report. You need a purchase agreement (most states will have a standard purchase agreement available for free) and you need a closing date.

The purchase agreement will have contingency clauses that the buyer may select to enact or not. For example, a financing contingency is common, which says the contract is only enforceable if the buyer is able to obtain financing. Which is why you may ask the buyer to provide a preapproval letter from a bank.

If I sell a house without a realtor, which I sometimes do, I get a purchase offer with earnest money and a preapproval letter, then I wait. In my area the buyer's bank will provide the closing attorney. He will send me the required settlement letter before closing and I am done.

If you really want the hand holding without the marketing then get a limited service agent to sell the house.

----

As for what I meant... Yes, I prefer to sell a house to people who know the home and neighborhood and want it. The people who drive by the home daily and say, "if that house ever goes up for sale I am going to get it," are the easiest to deal with and usually offer a fair price.

The best offer is the best offer, it is the one that nets you the most money in a timeline that suits your needs. I don't care if it comes from a realtor or not.

Many people here seem to be creating a false dilemma, don't fall for it. Your choices are not (1) take this offer, or (2) list with a realtor.

If you really believe that you can get a better offer by listing the property with a realtor then simply communicate with the interested buyers and let them know your concerns and that you plan to list it with a realtor but with an exclusion carved out for them. Take the highest offer you get from the listing, knock off the realtor fees, and see if the current buyers are interested at that price.

I recommend that you simply communicate openly and honestly with the people who currently want to buy the house. If you are concerned that you are leaving too much money on the table then just tell them that and let them know that you will give their offer first and favorable consideration. Most of all, don't let them work towards a deal that you know right now that you may not accept. If they are truly interested in owning the property they will understand and appreciate your honesty.

Good luck.

First, this is New York State. Everyone in the rest of the country will not understand how the process works in NY. It's an arcane situation. Only lawyers can draw up purchase agreements and sales contracts. Realtors are prohibited from "practing law" by utilizing forms provided by the Board of Realtors, as is done in most states. That makes the process very different with as many as four attorneys needed to complete a sale. It's a guaranteed nightmare. Been there and done that.

mtvhike, Your buyer's offer is not "as is". He is requesting an engineer's report. That takes this out of the "as is" category. You are more than willing to give him access to the property, but he needs to stipulate that this is an "as is" contract. Otherwise, wait to put it on the market when your agent returns. You do not need to go out of you way for this purchaser.

You don't need a credit report. You need to ask the buyer if he plans to seek financing. If no, you need a proof of funds document showing the sales price is deposited in a financial institution and a sizeable deposit made out to your attorney's trust account. If they want to finance, then you need a pre-approval letter from his lender and a sizeable deposit to your attorney's trust account. If the buyer finances, there will most likely be an appraisal contingency.

You can write a simple letter of agreement between the two parties if this is acceptable. Both of you need to sign it and date. You may want to get it notarized. But, if you get the money and the signatures, you don't have to notarize it. The agreement can be very basic. It should include the parties involved, the address, tax number, property description, price, and time of closing. Your attorney will do the rest as part of their fee. That's how NY works. It's all that an agent in NY can do.

Or, you can wait for your agent. Or, you can use the #2 agent and get this on the market asap. The ball is in your court.

Success - I think! Our realtor did a good job of advising us on how to stage the house, and had an open house last Saturday. She kicked us out, and apparently there were hoards of potential buyers, but only two offers, which were less than that from the earlier, excluded buyer. To her credit, she advised us to accept that one, even though she isn't getting a commission.

On Monday evening, we contacted that excluded buyer saying that we accepted his offer and he said he was immediately going to engage the an engineer's inspection, so we await that report. Of course we expect that there will be deficiencies discovered which we plan to remedy. But, should we point out any that we know about which the inspection misses? These are items which we have lived with for 20+ years, but are aware of. For example, there is a chronic plumbing freezing problem which I remedied with a switch-controlled pipe heater, which needs to be disclosed (in my opinion). There are speaker wires running from my basement workshop to the attic home theater room; they are 12Ga building wire, but (of course) are not carrying any current or significant voltage.

Congratulations. Hopefully, the offer will result in a contract. Don't be surprised if you receive additional offers, too. I would advise my realtor of the amount of the offer and that you are still open to receiving and considering offers. This way she can continue to market the property until the NY contract is signed. She may still bring in a superior offer. This is what is different about NY real estate processes from much of the rest of the country.

Regarding disclosures. No you don't need to disclose either of these items. They are both very minor.

Warning a buyer that these pipes may have a tendency to freeze and what to do to prevent that is part of the care and feeding process and not the sales process. The inspector may ask about it. Just tell them what you did to prevent it.

Again, don't be surprised when another excellent competing offer appears. Some people need to think about things.

I would disclose the pipe freezing issue.

For the wires, there's nothing to disclose since it isn't a problem. But as a courtesy, I'd probably attach a label to each end of the wires to describe what the point of them is.

What does the realtor advise? IMO, you don't have a pipe freezing issue, you have an added feature the ensures you don't have a pipe freezing issue. If a pipe freezing issue had been found during a inspection, the remedy would be to do what you have already done. It's an older house in NY where it gets below freezing. When I lived in the Chicago area, we had frozen pipes often in our old house. I would have loved to have purchased a home with the remedy you have in place.

Homechef, yes, I did inform my realtor of the offer - in fact, as I said, she said I should accept it because it was better than any of the ones she has. But it's not a done deal until a contract is signed, so the two she has are on hold.

Got an email last night from the buyer saying that the inspection went well, but there were a few small issues. He will send a full report later. My question for you Houzzers, is how to respond? Let's say it's the roof needs to be replaced (not a "small issue"). The roof is 25 years old, which was disclosed in the listing, so should I assume that it's covered in the initial price? It doesn't visibly leak. How about other issues? If these are things I can fix (or pay to have fixed), should I do that or lower the price?

I still have to return to this home and have an estate/garage sale, clean out the basement, and hire a mover to transport the furniture we're keeping to my new home. And, of course, to sign the sales contract. My attorney can handle the closing.

Send the buyer an email telling them that you do not want a copy of the report and do not send it. If they send it anyway, don't open it.

Instead of the report, you want them to send you a list of the items that they want you to repair or replace. Limit your future discussions to those items only. Tell them you will consider the items and get back to them.

Because you do not have a realtor, you will need to deal with the roofing issue, should it prove to be one of the requested items. It was an apparent item and it's condition should have been obvious to the buyer when he made the offer. But, they will more than likely ask for a concession of some kind. This could be a monetary credit or a demand for a new roof. It is entirely up to you whether you concede money for this item. You do have two competing offers. You may want to share this fact with your neighbor/buyer. Y

This is the stage where having a realtor would have been of help. They would have handled the discussion and kept it arms length.

Most people would prefer a pricing concession rather than letting the seller repair because the work can be done to the buyer's standard. If they ask you for a roofing concession, remember that you aren't paying a realtor's fee and it's the highest priced offer to date. You can afford to be generous in order to keep this potential superior buyer happy and on the hook. Don't be pennywise and pound foolish. It will be a judgment call on your part.

Good luck with your negotiations.

Homechef, here is the exact wording: "quick update: House inspection went well. We didn't find any problems, only a few minor things the engineer wants to put into his report. As soon as I get the report I will let you know."

I was wrong about his sending me the report, but I'll take your advice about not opening it if he does send it; also thank you for your other advice.

Agree, ask for what they want fixed, not the whole report. It really depends on how badly you want to get out and how much the buyer wants the house. Personally, I would not replace the roof unless it was leaking. Advice from my realtor when I was buying once was to ask for a lot to be fixed and then negotiate some things away.

When selling a house once, the buyer asked us to replace a flat roof that was older but still providing full service as a roof. We told the buyer no replacement but we'd have it resurfaced. They declined the offer but kept asking for many other details that in our opinion were just crazy. One morning my husband got so annoyed, he called the realtor and told her to reject all offers and take the house off the market. Next thing we knew, the realtor called with a full contract from the buyer asking for nothing to be be fixed. We didn't intend to call their bluff but apparently we did.

In the end, you should know the bottom line price you're willing to accept. Figure out if costs to repair what they ask for will dip you below that. If so, negotiate but be ready to walk away.

When I was selling my first home the buyer wanted me to replace the roof - a slate roof in good condition with no leaks! Someone had told them that such a roof was a bad thing to have. I said no, and the sale proceeded anyway.

Homechef and Tozomo, the roof was a hypothetical example, never mentioned by anyone except as an off-hand remark a month ago.

I was going to comment earlier but homechef and others beat me to it, so I will reiterate... Don't accept the engineer's report.

Typically, and despite popular belief otherwise, you don't have disclose things from a report by an inspector who was hired by the buyer. There are general issues with the credibility of a report prepared for the buyer's benefit by an inspector. Many of those credibility issues go away with a licensed engineer's report. So it becomes harder to avoid disclosure of those items. Therefore, until the deal is done, that report belongs to the buyer and they need to keep it.

I would proactively communicate with the buyer and let them know that you want only his/her summation of the issues s/he wants addressed in future negotiations.

Good luck

"To reiterate the conditions of the sale we would buy your home as is, and in cash - to simplify the process. The only contingency would be the engineer's report."

This really makes little sense. You can't have both unless the contingency was based on financing or selling their present house. I would not hesitate to use the engineer's report as leverage or a reason to cancel the agreement so be prepared. The contingency should of be been item specific such as foundation or structural in nature. What's done is done so don't spend the down payment.

A house I sold in February had no contingencies in the offer but they still wanted to pay for an inspection. Sure, go for it and guess what? I still ended up paying for a Radon mitigation system. I could of said no but agreed because we wanted the house gone and it wasn't unreasonable.

Update (sorry I didn't post an intermediate step). The buyer did come through with his offer, in that he agreed to our selling price, with the caveat that he wanted an inspection. Two weeks ago, he reported that the inspection was fine, with only a few "small" issues. I asked him to get an estimate for correcting those issues and one week ago he agreed. Of course, my plan is to deduct that estimate from the selling price. So far, no response. I'm wondering if he is just having a problem getting an electrician to make the estimate (the biggest issue is an electrical one). How long should I wait before I move on?

Get an agent, list it openly for best price, and pay their commission. Ask for a small discount if you end up with the buyer you know. Regardless though, you need them to help you with all of these questions. The small price you pay relative to the cost of the house will be well worth your peace of mind — and you won’t be stuck listening to the advice of random strangers on here. ; )

@elisejames you should read the entire thread. You are essentially advising what the OP already did. The real estate agent advised him to take this offer.

I suggest communicating in writing that time is of the essence. Let him know you will be forced to proceed with other offers soon. Lie a little if you want... e.g. we have had another offer come in.

Ooops. That didn’t all come in on my comments. Weird.

Reach out, ask why he hasn't respond. If you don't hear back from him in three days, then send a friendly, "Hope you're still interested in resolving this, but I have two other offers waiting for us to close our deal or move on. Please present estimate by (7 days from letter) so we can begin our closing. If a response is not received by that date, I will terminate our agreement and re-enter negotiations with the other waiting buyers." In sales terminology, you are doing the "take away." It forces him to make a move. The longer this drags on, the more buyers remorse he is going to have and the more housing options will pop up that may be more attractive to him.

Tozmo, I did essentially that late last night, via email (without the deadline). I'll wait until the weekend is over, then ask my attorney to contact his attorney.

Excellent. Deadlines force the issue, especially when coming from an attorney. The whole thing might fall apart but at least you'll know where you stand. All the best to you on this!

It may just be the way it was stated. "my plan is to deduct that estimate from the selling price". The buyer is not aware of this since it is your plan. Depending on what was discussed both parties should be made aware of this. I can see several problems including if the buyer is expecting for you to make the corrections. Wait an see what the estimates are. I would have the estimates done by companies I trusted rather than by the buyer's companies.

I don't understand though, if the potential buyer stated that he was buying the property "as is" , and the issues he found are "small", why wait around for estimates and give him a price break at all?

The buyer has indicated that the issues that the inspection found were minor. His initial offer was an "as is" offer. If nothing was major, it's time to turn it over to the attorneys. You should always include the fact that time is of the essence and you need to move forward with or without him.

It's time for him to fish or cut bait.

homechef, On Saturday, the buyer contacted me informing me that he couldn't get an electrician in a timely manner, so he offered a reasonable figure to cover the problems, so we arranged for the attorneys to meet with tomorrow as a contract signing date.

If you are amenable to this arrangement, proceed forward. You want those two attorneys on top of this asap.

Now for the next hurdle. I found in my NY real estate transaction that I was the only party that was motivated to get to closing. Coming from another state, this dynamic puzzled me. The attorneys dragged their feet with getting their closing documents together, exchanged and approved. Be prepared to have to become a pain in their backside. You won't be a priority. You will have to make yourself a priority. Hopefully, that won't happen to you. Good luck.

They sure will drag their feet, at a $100 a step dragging. I just got another bill from my lawyer (unrelated to real estate) for an informal conversation with a court administrator for $435.00. It wasn't even the lawyer who did the talking but one of his aids.

I contacted my attorney on Saturday, and she said it usually takes a week to schedule a contract signing. I will contact her today and see if next Monday, 5/17 would be possible. I don't think I have to be present (I am living 6 hours away). Then, a title search and other issues will have to be solved before a closing date, hopefully within a month of the contract signing.

They should be able to send you contracts by email. You can sign them electronically. It's pretty easy. No need for any of you to be present. The paper just flies around and wham, it's signed.

Got a call last night from the buyer asking for a registered copy of the survey. When we bought the house in 1989, the survey we had was from 1977 and that is the one which is registered with the Town. We also have a newer one, which we never registered, and I gave him a copy of that one.

My response to his call was that his attorney should be able to get it from the Town (is that right?), but I can give him a copy when we are back in town tomorrow (we are mostly at our new house).

This brings up another question: how much, if any, documentation from our purchase should we give him? I'm contacting my attorney when her office opens today, and ask these same questions. The closing has not been scheduled yet, but June 23 is the best estimate; the timing is all in the buyer's attorney's hands.

Just to mention for those of you who haven't been following this entire thread, this is a cash offer without the benefit of an RE agents.

You aren't required to give them anything. Giving them a copy of your survey is a courtesy on your part.

I suggest giving them a copy and telling them exactly what you said here. It's their choice if they want to order a new survey and also their choice if they want to register it.

Registration simply involves taking a certified, stamped copy down to the Courthouse and paying the filing fee to enter a copy in the Court's books. It doesn't require an attorney. You could do it yourself if you were inclined.

If you are sure that there haven't been any changes to your ( or possibly your neighbor's) property since the 1977 survey, there really isn't a need for a new one - but you do have a newer one so that is nice. It is up to the buyer if he wants another, or to have yours registered.

By changes I mean things like fences, outbuildings, patio/deck, house additions - possibly a neighbor added something and encroached on your property - perhaps there has been a change to a utility easement of some sort.

By documentation from "your purchase" you mean when you bought the place? Only something that is pertinent to the current condition that wouldn't show up in the title search or on the survey, and/or that you are required to disclose (like, when I bought my house Ohio didn't have a real estate disclosure law in effect, so the seller didn't have to - and didn't- disclose a couple of issues that are now required to be disclosed)

Follow your lawyer's advice for any of these issues. Part of what you don't have when you don't use an agent is someone to act as an intermediary with the other side. Realtors aren't the smartest animals roaming the forest but their motivation is to get escrows closed and to do that they almost always need to work through and resolve impediments or delays to that happening. Was a date for the close of escrow negotiated and put into the contract?

"Just to mention for those of you who haven't been following this entire thread, this is a cash offer without the benefit of an RE agents."

Unless a seller carries back paper (finances a part of the selling price themselves), all transactions at close are cash transactions. If you mean to say the buyer put in no contingency for the appraisal or loan approval, that's different but these aren't that often a problem but for sketchy buyers.

Good luck.

As I may have mentioned, I have two surveys - the 1977 one when I bought the house in 1989, (this one is registered with the town), and a new one (2015ish), when we going to apply for a rental permit (which we never did). Never registered that one because of the onerous requirements for code compliance for rental properties. When we last met with the buyer, we offered copies of both, but he only wanted the newer one (because it has more detail). Now, his lawyer wants the older, registered one. I am returning to the house today and have arranged to give him a copy of the one he wants tomorrow.

Unfortunately, my lawyer is "on vacation" (according to her answering machine), but is supposedly returning tomorrow. The sales contract specifies a "tentative closing date" of June 23, and I hope this survey issue is the only one left. The title search turned up no problems.

This is the responsibility of the buyer's attorney. Unless you are inclined to do his work for him by providing a copy in order to grease the skids and get'er done, the attorney is well aware that they can obtain a copy of the registered survey through the online portal for your county or in person at the courthouse. They are just being lazy.

Bottom line, only do this if you want to do it. Don't go too far out of your way.

Don't you just love someone trying to make you responsible for them doing their job?

A demand from the buyer for another concession is coming IMO, and a survey is usually requested by Mortgage companies because of issues. They don't have a Mortgage, cash as I remember and I suggest you ask when you deliver the survey why it's needed and any issue they're concerned about. My analysis of this latest request is suspicious and think psychological negotiations are in play with the latest request.

They've used the "foot in the door tactic" with a good cash offer and "as is" offer. The sale could of been done in a couple of weeks IMO, but now it's in the third month and my suspicions think it's by design. They're interfering with your rational decision making process using time as a tool. Over time they're negotiating with you to agree to lose money in small installments which is easier to accept than a lump sum loss from the beginning, but may end up being the same.

When they hit you with a large request for a price drop based on a silly issue related to the survey the goal is to have you split the difference because at this late date in the game you've become motivated to avoiding big losses over potential gains and will concede.

Unless you use the "door in the face tactic" with any new concessions the psychological negotiations will continue, just my opinion and hope I'm wrong but they have time on their side with nothing to lose, and can use it to they're advantage.

kevin9408,

I 100% agree with your assesment.

mtvhike,

It is time to dig your heels in, get a firm closing date or move on and list your property. If this is truly a cash offer with no contingencies it should have closed by now.

Not so fast. Under most circumstances, I would agree. But, this is New York. It is so different from any other state that it's astonishing when you are from another state and try to do business. At this point, you are dealing with attorneys and not realtors.

It's common at this stage for the attorneys to show their basic incompetence. Their ability to schedule a closing is entirely based on how well their secretary runs the appointment book. Real estate closings are low on the list of office priorities.

This is being thrown in the seller's lap because their attorney is on vacation. The standard answer should be call my attorney when she gets back into town on Monday. If there is nothing different from the oldest registered survey and the newer unregistered survey, I wouldn't worry.

The seller needs to light a fire under their attorney to schedule the closing appointment. That's when things get done in NY.