I was going to suggest you post your question to the thread, The Rose Doctor: Diagnosing Rose Problems, which I see you have done. Here are some options while you're working to improve your drainage.

Grow roses in pots. You can place the pot in the flower bed, where you wanted to plant it in the first place. On top, not buried. The only down side, is that you must over winter pots in the garage.

Plant in raised beds. If you don't want to build them with wood sides, use rocks. or other material to build up the sides, or mound the soil. Just get it deep enough, and don't over water.

Use grow bags. You can disguise the bag with mulch.

In the meantime, you can work on your soil so it will be suitable for planting in the future. Search "drainage" in the rose forum.

Let me throw some questions at you and maybe we can come up with an answer that makes sense. Some will be dumb but who knows we may stumble onto the answer.... lol

First, have you tried digging some other holes, say 50 feet away to see if they fill up with water and not drain?

I’m thinking your property sits on what I would call a big saucer that is filled with dirt. The saucer fills up with water until the water runs over the edges. The edges being below the ground surface. Thus the water never quite makes it up to the top of the soil that is in it, even if it rains hard. The hard soil you ran into while digging is most likely clay (ie. the material that makes up the saucer) That clay could be many feet thick so I’d forgo trying to dig down past it.

Does your home have a basement? If so, does the sump pump run just about all the time? If you do and the pump does not run then I suspect the edge of the saucer is far away from you home or something is blocking the water getting to the pump. (maybe the foundation of the home)

You could also have an artisan well on your property. Do you live in a city/town or country side? If not country then are you connected to the sewer system? If not then you may have a blocked system that needs checked out.

Can you post a pic further away of the landscape. Seems like you're digging on top of a huge rock area. Maybe a few feet this way or that. Maybe building somewhat of mound may work, if not in this area, somewhere else?

Mehrin: I click on the Amazon link you posted, and that spade IS NOT THE BEST since it doesn't have a triangular notch at the top for firm grasp while digging out rocks, plus it's too short. What you want to dig out rocks is sharp & long spade, with a hollow-triangular handle for firm grasp., like below:

https://www.amazon.com/Nupla-SS16D-Shooters-Hollow-Handle/dp/B004N85294/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=sharpshooter+spade&qid=1624728509&s=hi&sr=1-2

How old is your house? If the house is less than 30 years old like mine then poor-drainage is a problem in clay. When my house was built in 2000, the builder stripped away the fluffy top soil, then dug the deep basement, they threw the icky-sub-clay from digging the basement around the house. I got 4 feet of icky-clay plus rocks (dug out from the basement) around the house. It's good to prevent soil erosion but it's bad for planting. When the house was done, the builder put 1 foot of black top soil on top, then put sod down.

When I dig, I got only 1 foot of black soil, and below is dense yellow clay plus large rocks that water can't drain off. It rained heavily last night, 6" of rain in the bucket, and this morning as I watched the heavy rain coming down, it was flooding at the low end of my garden where the top soil is very thin, with rocks below.

All, I am sorry for the delayed response. A bit old fashioned in that I have to sit in a laptop to type responses.

@flowersaremusic z5 Eastern WA Thank you- I am growing in pots for now and asking the doc for rose specific issues :) The doc suggested I dig up and fix the soil, which led me to this post. As I have tried doing that and failed. M dilemma is whether to try to dig for drainage or just plant as is.

Btw, I have been reading on the rose forum for the past few months, trying to chose roses for my small backyard. Came across your many comments which helped me a lot, as I am in zone 5 too. So thank you for sharing all your roses here!

@gawdinfever Z6 Please tell me more about the 'mound' idea? Just letting the water flow to other areas? Here is pic from last year. Will try to post a different view tomorrow.

Someone else has the same problem of high water table. High water table is common with houses near a lake or a pond. See below discussion:

https://permies.com/t/58493/High-water-table-house#:~:text=%20High%20water%20table%20near%20house.%20%201,a%20drainage%20issue%20and%20not%20at...%20More%20

From above link: I like underground gutters to direct water away from the house, but I don't agree with planting willow tree to suck up the water (too big & invasive roots). A French drain (filled with gravel) can be installed underground to direct water away from the location. Low-thorn Austin roses can take flooding better than thorny roses.

@toolbelt68 Hi. Taking you up on your kind offer! There might be something to your saucer theory!

So here is some context -

No basement. Urban/HOA area - with city sewer. Small 0.2 acre lot, beside a pond. This bed area was part of lawn; in fall 2019 used a rented tiller to loosen up the soil, mixed in some compost and put in some landscape edging.

There is a very slight downward slope as we move away from the house. So I am thinking the water naturally flows out and not directly down. And this bed kind of broke this slope and has a barrier (edging), so the rain that falls right on it is going down where there is no drainage.

Yes - to same issue in other bed- kind of. In another bed (made by previous owner,), when I dug a whole the water won't drain for hours. I scooped the water out, added a lot of compost and planted something ( i can't recall).

I have lots of perennials in this older bed though... generally I don't dig deep as I buy small plants online. So that's part of confusion. The problem seems to manifest if I dig big holes!

One last thing. I am very new to the whole world of gardening - so ask whatever you want - do not assume I know anything!

Mehrin, if you run out of ideas on how to fix your soil, have you look into the option to do a raised bed for your roses?

I'm small so digging holes for roses in my clay soil was such a hassle until I got Bosch SDS-Max hammer drill with clay spade and digging holes is a fun activity. It's expensive but it's worth every penny. it's also a necessity for me because my roses in one section of the house are having a drainage issue and don't perform well so I will need to dig the roses up, dig bigger and deeper holes then put the roses back.

I got the SDS-Max hammer drill by using the combo gift idea in which it's my combo gift for my Christmas, birthday, anniversary... I recently used it to dig a big 5-year old Olivia Rose Austin to give to a relative. I had one extra. Normally it would take me half a day to dig a rose that big. With the SDS-Max hammer drill, it took me 15 minutes. Helen

12 Amp 1-9/16 in. Corded Variable Speed SDS-Max Combination Concrete/Masonry Rotary Hammer Drill with Carrying Case ($419 HomeDepot)

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bosch-12-Amp-1-9-16-in-Corded-Variable-Speed-SDS-Max-Combination-Concrete-Masonry-Rotary-Hammer-Drill-with-Carrying-Case-RH540M/204823328

4-1/2 in. x 17 in. Hammer Steel SDS-MAX Clay Spade ($59 HomeDepot, $44 Amazon)

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bosch-4-1-2-in-x-17-in-Hammer-Steel-SDS-MAX-Clay-Spade-HS1922/301380085

I agree with Straw that a French drain is a possibility. We had a drainage problem in a specific area of our yard (not due to a high water table), and after doing much research, my son in law decided a French drain would be the best solution. He put it in himself, and it has worked perfectly for years--no drainage problem anymore. Diane

Mehrin, I too live in the midwest (central Michigan). Our land used to be a corn field -- and I later found out that it is tiled for drainage because this area was all naturally swampy heavy clay that is impossible to dig into with a shovel by summer. Yes, I garden in a mostly drained swamp -- I should have known by looking at what trees grow around us naturally (silver maple, red maple, swamp elm -- no sugar maples, no beech, no wild cherry).

Here's what I've learned:

1. raised beds are your friend -- see " a garden bed grows up" for a current example: http://www.coldclimategardening.com/2019/03/24/a-garden-bed-grows-up-the-evolution-of-a-flower-border/ )

and here for her first attempts: http://www.coldclimategardening.com/2008/09/30/the-no-dig-garden-experiment/

2. you will make your life easier if you think long-term -- where you think you might want to garden in a couple of years, put down a layer of newspaper (I got mine from the public recycling center), a 3-4 inch layer of coarse sand or coarse perlite ( I like coarse perlite because I can buy it in 4 cubic feet bags for $14.00, and it is so light I can easily lift it) and then a very thick (4-6") layer of organic matter in the spring and then again in the fall. Gently fork it in if you're up to it, or just leave it be if you're not (the worms will plow it for you). Repeat the organic layers the next year -- no need to add more sand/perlite. By the end of year two you will have a lovely raised bed of lofty soil. I've been known to place large pots with annuals on the areas, or a bird bath to give a planted look while I wait for nature to work on the soil.

Just adding organic material without adding the perlite/sand just creates muck on my property.

Start this fall -- August is not too early!

Raised bed is ideal but it takes ungodly amount of work. Decade ago we did 2 raised beds, ordered a $160 pile of dirt. It was 2 days of back-breaking work shoving the dirt into the raised beds.

In contrast, husband fixed the river birch tree from turning yellow (poor drainage clay) by installing a French drain (filled with gravel) in less than 1/2 hour. Countless roses died in my raised bed with lesser winter-survival. Raised bed is great for veggies & other flowers, but not for roses (roots need to stay deep underground to survive zone 5 winter). Underground gutter or French drain is easy to dig & install, but raised bed is major work.

Straw, I agree that raised beds are good for annual veggies. I put up with a wood one for a few years, and then bought a high quality resin one that my son in law put together on ground he had leveled. I have grown hot peppers, cukes, and tomatoes in it for years. Right now, it's just tomatoes. I use a special raised bed mix, plus compost for this 4X4 foot, extra deep bed. It was worth the investment, and not much work. (I'm 75, so you can do this, too--ha). Diane

Below is one of my resin-raised beds, took me less than 15 min. to put up (it has sections that can stack high on top of each other), bought from Home Depot for less than $100. But it needs lots of top soil to fill the bed. Nice brown color. I also installed a second one twice taller for tomatoes.

@strawchicago z5 The house was built in 2013. Though it has no basement (ranch style), I am sure builders did something similar to putting the construction debris around. Even the topsoil for the sod is neither good quality nor deep. I have not yet found very large rocks though.

Thanks for the shovel suggestion as well.

Well, thank you all for your ideas. I really do want to plant roses in this bed and I am not fond of raised beds. Also in my zone, as strawchicago says, it is not likely to help with rose survival. So here is plan of action:

1. We are having a rainy streak too. A day after the rain is over, I will dig a hole in nearby lawn area, and observe if there is water logging, seeping or wetness. If I see that the area is just moist and no water accumulation - this means the tilling or edging (when making the bed) has created some sort of heavy abnormal water flow into the area. I will have to try to adjust the slopes and also look into french drain.

2. Also, I will get my lazy DH to dig the existing hole further low and see if that fixes the drainage. In that case I will again look for some garden help or consider the Bosch hammer. @bayarea_girl_z9ca How deep have you dug with this? Thanks for sharing it.

"No basement. Urban/HOA area - with city sewer. Small 0.2 acre lot, beside a pond."

The HOA area brothers me. Do you have to get permission to make changes in your lawn? Best check with them or you may have to undo everything.....

@toolbelt68 Yes...i got the permission before I started making the bed.

I am North of Chicago and our backyard is very heavy clay. It flooded every spring after rains of a few days. The flooded area was toward the back corner of the yard, following the general flow of runoff for the neighborhood. I decided in 2019 to make that area a rain garden, which has now achieved the goal of limiting the flooding to that basin.

The rain garden basin needs to allow infiltration, so I needed to amend it. I dug out some of the clay from the basin and moved it to an area that needed to be raised outside the basin. Then I amended in large amounts of straw and compost. Then I removed some of that amended materal as the basin filled up, and kept adding more straw and amending down into new clay.

Now the rain garden fills up after the rest of the yard becomes saturated, but drains within 24 hours.