Thanks so much for your response! I guess I had been under the impression that I could walk into Benjamin Moore and choose a paint color, but from what my friend said, whatever is normally used, they try to mix a color that is close but is not an off the shelf Benjamin Moore color.

I assume this is the case with a 2k poly as well? How close does the color come to what you see on a Benjamin Moore paint swatch?

Can you get any sheen with these products as well? I think I prefer less sheen, satin or even a little less -- is that all customizable?

Thanks so much again!

Depending of the brand of 2k some offer sheens from 5% to 80 %  5 would be flat then 20% satin 35%semi gloss and 80% gloss. Some of that is interchangeable with other companies some offer 10% to 15% which they call matte. Any colors from any company can be matched into 2k poly make sure they use a wet sample. They have already made formulas for colors but sometimes don't match 100%

Mass cabinetry manufacturers that offer lifetime warranties on their finishes are using two-part, post-catalyzed conversion varnishes. ]...] I know of one custom cabinetry builder in California who uses exclusively ICA 2K varnishes.

So far as I know, ICA doesn't make a 2K varnish.

In my opinion sometimes the discussions on coatings lose perspective. there are lacquers that look almost new 1,300 years later, and lacquer would be considered a substandard coating by most. I think it is important to find a cabinetmaker who is informed about coatings and doesn't treat them as an afterthought, rather than looking for someone who uses specific brands or types of products. Having said that, I wouldn't use conversion varnish in my home.

@Aglitter, some of your information is incorrect. First of all "INSUL X" is not a paint - it is a line of specialty primers & paint that Benjamin Moore now owns. There is Insul X Stix primer - a waterborne primer - great for adhesion. There is Insul X Cabinet Coat - a urethane acrylic - it leaves a nice finish, probably good for a DIY cabinet paint job. One issue is that it mars easily - like from your ring. I don't think it comes in a matte, so not sure what paint you were referring to.

Benjamin Moore has Scuff X, which comes in matte, but that is not rated for cabinets, as it has no chemical resistance.

Envirolak.com is the Canadian company. There is also CIC/Centurion, based out of Texas. They have a 1K product (that meets the KMCA standards) - the 400 Series.

They can "match" Benjamin Moore, as well as most other colors. You can also send them a painted sample, and they will do an "exact match".

@steph2348, not sure I would want my custom cabinets to be the test case if someone has never used the product before.

Go to this FB page, and check out Dennis Rodriguez' work - he's in Southern CA. He's VERY good and will answer if you post a question for him.

CABINET PAINTING & REFINISHING | Facebook

Yes, the amount of information regarding paints & coatings is overwhelming. The marking that occurs from everyday jewelry, or even just kitchen utensils with the Cabinet Coat has to do with it being a "urethane acrylic". PPG Breakthrough (high VOC version) and the California Ultraplate, both the same type of paint, as well as, Benjamin Moore's Command (from their commercial line) share the same issue. It happens when it is barely touched with something metal. Not sure if it less of a problem with a semigloss vs. a satin finish.

I think we've decided to go with the Centurion line of coatings - most likely the 400 pigmented series for cabinets, and the 400 clear for topcoating a refinished dining table, and a few other projects.

A few corrections. There is no such thing as ”oil based” laquers. What you are referring to is ”solvent based” much different than oil. The only oil based product I know of and have used is Fine Paints of Europe. In LA we have a lot of products to chose from dispite the rumors being pused by poeple who don’t live or work here. Personally I use mostly ICA, sometimes Ilva or Milesi all bi-componet can be catalyzed which makes it 2K. For the finish OP is looking for (hand painted deVol) I would probably do F&B sprayed then thin top coat brushed and sealed with a dead flat 2K clear coat for durability. CIC also has some good products that I’ve used.

Coatings arguments, can lose sight of the greater picture on occasion. Lacquers t nevertheless appear to be brand new, and most people regard lacquer as a low-quality covering. It is more vital to locate a cabinetmaker who knows coatings and does not regard them as an afterthought rather than looking for someone who employs a specific brand or type of product. I prefer conversion varnish.

I find some of these things a bit ridiculous.

"I have one of the most durable finishes in the world on my kitchen cabinetry, Loba's ceramic-infused 2K AT, and I take care of it. Even my cabinetey pulls were selected with room to reach around them without touching hands or fingernails against the cabinetry coating. Keeping everything but a microfiber dust rag away from cabinetry surfaces is both common sense and best practice if the owner intends to have a cabinetry coating hold up for a lifetime."

Or how about you find a satisfactory coating for your cabinets and utilize your kitchen as a functional workspace...

I am building some cabinets for my home this year, I have a UV spray booth big enough to paint a vehicle and could use a great UV coating which has certain advantages. I am not going to, because they are kitchen cabinets and that is overkill.

"I have baseboards painted with BIN primer and three thin coats of INSL-X Cabinet Coat semi-gloss in my own home. The finish is durable and resistant to impact."

BIN is not resistant to impact. Shellac in general tends to be brittle and BIN is one of the most brittle. It also can bridge on corners if you do have movement. INSL-X is just another version of a waterborne alkyd paint. It is durable, because alkyd paints have always been durable.

However, while it might be great for a DIY project, it isn't satisfactory in a production environment, which was what the original question was about.

Your defense of INSL-X effectively reinforces my point. Even a coating that is objectively weaker than other coatings can work great. That is largely because there is a coatings arms race now, every coatings company is trying to out engineer the competition and have now far exceeded the needs of most consumers.

hi all so our cabinets are about to be sprayed in a conversion varnish and im suddenly reading all this and worried about the chemicals!

Also can these ever be repainted if one wants to change the look?? At 50k for cabinets we arent going to remake them ever again... but should they need painted, can you hire a painter to do it in the house? Sounds like it would be too toxic? not a good feeling when your family is breathing in this air

@jen south Curious where you landed with this project. I am in the same boat with every cabinet-maker telling me CCV is the industry standard.