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amy_otis21

Help with farmhouse sink

4 years ago

The first picture is my reality and the second picture is my inspiration. We are not going to be able to change out the cabinets at this time so I have to work with the existing. We are planning to put all new stainless steel appliances in. We will also change the countertops to quartz. As I understand it, I will need to change the sink and appliances prior to the countertop fabricator coming out. My question is the only option for a stainless steel apron sink going to be a retrofit? Would cutting the existing cherry cabinets be an option? We are using a contractor who has been licensed for just a couple of years. Everything that we have seen has been good work and they have great references however they are still fairly new with us. Just trying to make sure that I’m making the right decision. Any advice is appreciated. Thank you.

Comments (17)

  • PRO
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    "My question is the only option for a stainless steel apron sink going to be a retrofit?"

    Yes, as long as you aren't changing your sink base cabinet. Your inspiration photo shows a full apron sink (the apron is as deep as the sink). You have to have a short apron sink which comes to where the bottom of your drawers are now. The basins are full depth on short apron sinks.

    "Would cutting the existing cherry cabinets be an option?"

    You don't want to get into door alterations in order to accommodate a full apron sink. Your center style above the middle rail will be cut to accommodate the new sink. The sink is not supported directly by the cabinet front. The structural function of the middle rail is to keep the cabinet sides apart as the sink harness or straps supporting your sink tries to pull them together.

    Please pull a tape measure from the dishwasher across both drawers and measure to where the sink base cabinet meets the corner cabinet. It will probably be 36" or 42". Unless you go custom for $3,000.00, you'll be getting a 36" short apron sink similar to the Kohler 3943:



    If you use a 36" sink in a 42" cabinet the drawer ends will have to be cut and butted to the apron ends which doesn't look bad.

  • PRO
    4 years ago

    I suggest getting an undermount 1 bowl sink in this scenario.

    You will be able to wipe the counters right into sink compared to the current

    drop in where dirt accumulated around the seams.

    It will be an upgrade from the drop in you currently have.

    You have nice cabinets.

    There are some drop in sinks that come with useful gadgets,too.





  • PRO
    4 years ago

    "The front of the sink sits on a structural rail..."


    The linked Kohler Whitehavens and the Kohler 3943 pictured above are self rimming sinks, meaning the cabinet does not get scribed to make the sink fit on the rail, but the apron sits in front of the cabinet. The best carpenter in the world isn't going to scribe a sink apron as nicely as an apron will sit in front.


    Frameless cabinet or not doesn't matter. The function of the center rail is to act as a doorstop and to keep the cabinet sides apart while the straps or harness tries to pull them together.



  • 4 years ago

    Thank you everyone for the information. I will start to look at some of the suggestions. I am really hoping to find a retrofit workstation sink then. I do not want a white sink We have had one for the last 14 years and the maintenance of it. I appreciate the stainless steel suggestions. I assume that this will need to be done before the new countertops? And then I see the design for an undermount or the apron. Is there one that is truly better in this scenario? We are having a countertop store that specializes in granite tops and quartz countertops put in the new counters. I will take the new measurements based on the suggestions.

  • 4 years ago

    Would something like this work or would it have to be 34 or 42? I’m not sure exactly how this lines out. This is a 16 gauge sink and from what I can determine from reading would be what I would want

  • PRO
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    On a retrofit with new countertops, I'd recommend strapping the self-rimming stainless steel sink in place about a heavy 1/8" lower than where it will go for templating. After the tops are installed, squirt a nice bead of 100% clear silicone in the gap between the stone bottom and the sink flange, then tighten the straps (2) for a nice squeeze-out. I'd recommend a slight positive reveal for looks and performance, however, your fabricator will probably try to talk you out of it as he has to nail the sink center nearly perfectly. With a crud ledge negative reveal, he doesn't have to be as precise. A flush reveal is out of the question; too difficult to get right and you'll get an elongated silicone joint that frays, becomes contaminated, and turns black and unsanitary.

    If you change your mind and go Whitehaven, use a Pete's Sink Mount Kit instead of the straps please. Same procedure though.

  • 4 years ago

    Thank you. I will pass this information along. I definitely want stainless steel after all of the years of the white sinks. The house we just sold had Korean so there was no getting around the white. I realize there’s a difference in some of the newer sinks however the quartz we are interested in is mostly white and I’m afraid of trying to match varying degrees of white. Is there any advantage to a curved versus a flat apron in this case? I am learning a lot from the discussion

  • 4 years ago

    Would this be another option? I am not familiar with these two brands but so far they are the only one that I have come up with that have both the workstation and retro fit design. Are there any other suggestions? I looked at Kohler but it doesn’t appear they make a workstation retrofit sink

  • 4 years ago

    Last question. Since we are replacing the countertops with quartz, would the undermount sink solve a lot of the issues at a less costly price point?

  • PRO
    4 years ago

    "Is there any advantage to a curved versus a flat apron in this case?"


    No. It's purely a style choice.


    "I looked at Kohler but it doesn’t appear they make a workstation retrofit sink."


    Any undermount apron sink can be turned into a workstation sink by simply enlarging the positive reveals to 1/2" or so. Rabbet your cutting board and you're good.

  • 4 years ago

    Thanks so much. These are very helpful in making the decision. Are there any cons to the Elkay or Auric sinks? It does not appear Kohler has a workstation short apron. And is there any large difference between 6 and 9 inch apron?

  • PRO
    4 years ago

    "And is there any large difference between 6 and 9 inch apron?"


    It's the difference between having your doors fit or not. I'd consider that a "large difference".

  • 4 years ago

    The advantage of that Elkay sink is that it is full counter depth which eliminates the narrow strip of countertop material at the back. I believe it is the only such sink available these days.

    But it has a ledge in front, and I don’t know how that would function in real everyday life. I have this model of sink awaiting install in a remodel, where we will be installing it as a drop-in sink.

  • PRO
    4 years ago

    ulisdone:


    Are you sure you're not speaking about the Kohler 3942?



    The narrow stip in the back is very small, but not eliminated. It is installed as a drop-in or top mount sink.

  • 4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    @Joseph Corlett, LLC - I said it's structural, meaning to the cabinet not the sink. The sink will sit on the rail, but isn't meaningfully supported by it. I didn't mean anything about the sink curving out - I meant that some of them have a curved bottom cut that gets scribed for a close fit to the sink bottom in whatever wood (or particle board or ply or veneered laminated osb or whatever is being used as a sink cabinet front).

    @amy o - the sink you showed has a diagramshowing that the front bottom edge of the sink extends downward from the top of THE SINK by 6-7/16 inches. You may not be able to use it or you might not. It depends on how much room you currently have from the bottom of your current counter to the top of the horizontal rail under the fake drawer fronts in your sink cabinet. That's what you need to look at to see if a sink has a chance. If you are undermounting the sink, you need that height before you run into the doors, plus clearance for the doors and enough of a rail remaining so the cabinet doesn't fall apart. Then make sure you ask whoever is going to perform the cabinet surgery to double check.

  • 4 years ago

    Thank you everyone for all the information. I went to speak to the quartz fabricators yesterday. If we do the Undermount sink I will take care of mounting the sink and ensure that everything lines up another is No gaps. They are a family run company that is rated number one in our area. Although I love the farmhouse sink luck I think this may be the best option to go with the Undermount as I can ensure that everything will come together correctly. They will order the one that has the workstation as well for the Undermount. They told me I could go on bell.com and basically select whatever I wanted it would fit within the existing housing. They will verify that it will fit and adjust the measurement if needed. It just seems like it’ll be cleaner and they will guarantee the work not to leak anywhere. Thanks everyone for helping me make this decision. It’s been extremely tough to say the least.

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