Can’t speak to actually using it yet, but we have an order in for the new 48” French door SZ, panel ready. I’m not aware of another French door panel ready model at that size. We preferred it over the SxS, but if we had done a SxS, I liked the thermador one. We also previously had a thermador. Once you get up there, the price differences really didn’t seem to be much. Nothing can beat finding a high end appliance store and looking at everything in person.

Dacor panel ready french door - freezer is a little bigger than the SZ but SZ has a little more frig space. Dacor has a better warranty, cocktail ice, filtered water pitcher, flex space lower right - freezer or frig... certainly better looking interior. I'm leaning toward the Decor.

Patricia’s SZ bashing, has been a tired shtick for a long time now. She’s never owned a Sub Zero, and has no first hand experience with the brand. Having such a strong opinion about something you have no experience with, is just plain, well, ignorance. Not to mention the disservice she’s doing to any prospective clients, who may be wanting a SZ.

Btw, has there ever been a posting by Ms. Colwell, that doesn’t have at least one ” IMO” in it? Is that supposed to make us value what she says, more? It has the opposite effect on me.

My experience with Sub Zero spans 37 years. The first SZ, a 36” over/under, was still going strong at 25yo, when we sold that home. That fridge saw us through Hurricane Sandy, remaining cold for 8 days after losing power. Even the ice was still frozen. All the homes with other brand fridges, had to dispose of the contents of their fridges, on day two without power. Why? Because SZ has the best insulated fridges in the industry.

We moved 7.5 years ago, and purchased a 42” FD SZ, for the new kitchen. It has performed flawlessly. I expect this fridge to have a similar lifespan, as our first SZ.

As for Patricia’s statement that she would rather see her appliances, not hide them…she might like the visual of two honking huge chunks of stainless steel dominating her kitchen, but many of us prefer a quieter, more streamlined esthetic. To us, paying extra for panelled fridges, is well worth the price.

“Sub-Zero is so boring. The interior of the competitors look amazing and yet SZ looks like it did 20 years ago.”

Ah, @Paul F., I owned a SubZero 20 years ago, and have another now in the home we bought 7.5 years ago. I can tell you your statement is entirely false. The basket compartments alone, are totally different and more convenient, than the older generation of SZ fridges. Current SZ fridges have LED lighting, also an improvement. The door storage, is also different.

As for plastic vs stainless steel interiors…having seen the stainless interiors some brands offer, to me, they’re much darker to view. Thus, they need more lighting. The white plastic SZ uses, is extremely high quality. As such, it doesn’t crack; doesn’t discolor. It’s easy to clean, and will look the same 25 years down the road, as it did on day of install. That is my extensive experience.

”The 48" top rated french door Dacor 'cool-steel' model (samsung) has an interior camera, flexible bottom right space frig/freezer, dual ice maker - whiskey balls/regular cubes, water filter pitcher.”

Hey, if you’re going to choose a fridge because the ice maker can make whiskey balls 🙄, and the fridge part has a camera…if that floats your boat, and is more important to you than the most effective refrigeration, reliability, and customer service…it’s your $$$.

Explain to us why a refrigerator needs a camera? Really, I’m curious.

As a 30 year subscriber to CR, I take their kitchen reviews with a grain of salt. It took CR 8 years, to begin including SZ in the appliance reviews…despite them being increasingly popular. Same for soapstone in the countertop reviews. CR is consistanly behind the times, when it comes to kitchens, as they tended to review appliances that appealed more to the middle and lower end of the ecomomic public. Trust their reviews and ranking of automobiles and lawn mowers…absolutely. Kitchens, not so much.

I think that CR was at least historically not really completely unbiased, and at least they used to seem to downgrade their evaluations on products if they thought they were "too expensive". And I think their data on repair records was flawed, because of course people rarely repair cheaper appliances but will repair more expensive appliances. The nineteen year old SZ is still in the condo unit I installed it in, and I was the first owner and the only person who has had to have it serviced. (It was bought during their bad batch of copper period, something like that). We know both people who have lived in the unit since. I have a friend who has had three mid brand refrigerators in that time.

For the record I've purchased two SZ in the last 25 years and lived with a 20 year old one for the last 13 years. I've had it repaired once in that time and just dealt with a gurgling issue it had on warm days for the last several years. Now that I'm having to buy a new appliances because of a fire I find that new SZ looks exactly the same inside as the 20 year old one while other brands now have dazzling interiors. With Thermador and Bosch having better consumer report reliability records over the last 20 years and newer brands like Dacor now being rated higher too... time to branch out.

Based on these two charts there is an irrational exuberance (that I also had) for SZ that doesn't quite jibe with actual reliability. Miele frig owners seems to be really out to lunch!

It could be that the survey questions are not particularly well-designed.

The only thing I'm absolutely certain that is not particularly well-designed is the interior of a new Sub-Zero refrigerator/freezer.

"dazzling interiors"

Well, that feature didn't even make my list of things I was looking for in a fridge!

Obviously you are exactly the type of customer they are marketing to and trying to dazzle with dazzling interiors ... it worked! ;-)

Well yeah… highly rated refrigerators with dazzling interiors. Nothing to be ashamed of.

I just can’t get over the Dacor is made by Samsung, and their reputation (and our personal experience) with fridges is rough. Maybe if it was half the price of the sub zero I’d have taken the risk, but for the same or more? Definitely not for us

Yeah…those ”dazzling interiors” won’t be worth 2 cents, when trying to get service for your Samsung owned Dacor fridge. Good luck with that.

Yes, the Samsung is the one issue since I absolutely hate their washers/dryers. However, I've never gotten steered wrong by Consumer Reports in all these years. I love the Dacor feature of the lower right quadrant being either frig OR freezer. SZ reminds me a bit of Sears resting on its laurels while Target and others blow right passed them. I hope they can get it together before more of us get lured away.

The Dacor warranty is much, much better than SZ as well.

“The Dacor warranty is much, much better than SZ as well.”

That’s good…you’re going to need it.

Check out the Liebherr Monolith columns. Cost is the same as SZ 48”. Stainless steel interiors and the air is circulated behind the door so the door storage is the same temp as the back of the fridge. Produce drawers can be maintained at a different temp than the main compartment. The drawers seemed much sturdier than the Bosch/thermador integrated product.

@allisonstasney To answer your question. We've had both stainless steel and panel ready refrigerators and we prefer panels. Not cleaning stainless is a joy and we prefer the way the panels and custom handles look. We had Thermador columns in our old house for 13 years and they never needed service. We have the same columns (bought just before they updated them and raised the price) at our beach house for five years and so far so good. My one complaint is that the 18" freezer isn't laid out very well. Our new kitchen has a Thermador 36" over/under integrated and again, I don't like the layout as much as the SZ but I didn't have to wait a year or more for it. (It replaced a 20 year old 48" stainless SZ built-in that was still going strong that we liked very much). Hopefully you can fix you current fridge and kick the can down the road a bit. Good luck.

Couldn't have said it better myself, @darbuka!

As I say to my friends that wear large brand logos on their clothing. You should be getting paid for that.

PS I also wanted to say if you want Thermador columns, make sure you ask how long it takes to get. Last I checked it was 12+ months.

I have never seen a real estate listing mention the kitchen has a Dacor refrigerator. Sub-Zero, on the other hand...

FYI there's an ebay seller called alsurplus with panel ready 48" thermador in stock. I have used them before with good success.

The Dacor warranty is much, much better than SZ as well.

A warranty means nothing if you can't get it serviced.

As an FYI, Dacor was bought by Samsung a few years back. Not sure the quality is still there; I'd look at Consumer Reports for reviews.

Yes, we have the 4 door Samsung version that we bought about a decade ago (now in our basement). I will say it still works and we’ve never serviced it, but the ice maker stopped a long time ago, which has been a common complaint. I liked the idea of switching the flex door, but we never did since that would have so little freezer space. I will say, we are currently in a rental during renovations and the fridge has an automatically filled water pitcher with diffuser, and it’s a nice feature that I’ll miss when we move back. I also make whiskey ice, so I’d probably enjoy that too. So agreed that those features are better and it looks lovely. But since we are investing in the custom panels, I felt like SZ was a more sure thing for the long haul.

Folks, ”IMO” means ”in my opinion,” yet you bash her for having strong ones AND labelling them. Skip what she says if you don’t like her.

Here's the 'new' 'updated' Sub-Zero 'design'. That is one sad looking expensive refrigerator.

Come on ... now show us the happy looking expensive refrigerator ... show us that "dazzling interior" !

I love the new black interior of the Jenn Air columns! What do you think?

Interesting thread. I’m getting a panel ready Dacor because it is the only panel ready fridge with internal water dispenser available in my area in under 8 weeks. SZ is over 12 months out for a 36” wide which is what is required for my remodel. Liebherr and Monogram are on backorder indefinitely. I am nervous about Dacor and purchased extended service plan from appliance store so they can deal with it.

Time of delivery is part of the decision-making process and for me, I could see taking delivery on something that was available sooner if it was going to stall a project indefinitely, particularly if I thought they were were more or less interchangeable. But in terms of the refrigerator, those ten months of difference will go by whether you have the new refrigerator or whether you have your old refrigerator until you take delivery of your first choice (if something else is your first choice). In the scheme of 20 years that I would expect to have the refrigerator, I might decide to wait.

I am going through this with the refrigerator and DW. The appliance rep showed me some DWs that were currently available vs. the one I wanted, and I felt like "these are available now because less people want this model"

@chispa Dazzling Thermador columns VS new "re-designed" Sub-Zero... they should be ashamed.

Not really “dazzled” by the Thermador - I just see more gray. And maybe I’m wrong here - but I don’t care what the interior looks like as long as it is well organized and works. But to each his own I guess.

The 50% of the freezer space taken up by the ice maker in the Thermador is truly dazzling. The sturdiness of the bin mechanisms is not.

I don't want to be dazzled by the inside of my refrigerator.

But I also crossed Rolls-Royce off the aspirational list when they started doing headliners with LED lighting like a starlit sky. Who wants a $400K car that is decorated like a Junior Prom inside? Maybe somebody, but not me.

I don't buy a fridge to be dazzled by how the interior looks. I buy one that will keep my foods at the correct temperature and have a good track record.

I am not anti-good industrial design but I seriously am not understanding the issues of the SubZero design. It seems clean and functional. Once my food is stored in the refrigerator I really don't focus on the interior.

And there are even some "famous" SZ refrigerators like Yolanda Habib's refigerator which was made famous (or infamous) on Real Housewives of Beverly Hills. As I recall, she had at least two refrigerators - one had stainless doors but the one with glass doors had beautifully arranged food which could not possibly exist in real life but only if curated by multiple assistants and housekeepers.

The refrigerator even had its own instagram account

I don't think there's anything "real" about any of those housewives.

Thermador and Bosch are rated higher than Sub-zero by consumer reports, they're CHEAPER and dazzling inside. SZ 4/5 stars, on par with LG in terms of reliability. It's time to let go and let Bosch.

It's just sad to see a great company fall prey to the 'Sears' syndrome and refuse to innovate and change. Apparently, if they have reliability issues issues now then a complacency has set in.

The Thermador’s interior is dark, dark, dark. Sub Zero’s is white and bright.

I guess we all have our own definition of ”dazzling.” That dark Thermador interior sure doesn’t dazzle me.

Funny you should mention that. I was joking with the salesman at Best Buy earlier today when I took the picture on how bright the Thermador interior was and that I'd hold all my zoom meetings in front of the open doors.

I have a new Thermador fridge and really don't like the stainless interior, but I knew that when I ordered it. I'm with Darbuka, I'll take white plastic over stainless any day.

@Paul F., thanks for the photos, but I'm not dazzled by that stainless interior and it seems I am not alone in that feeling. The important thing is that we have choices and the freedom to make them. I hope you enjoy a dazzling life with your new fridge and kitchen! 🙂

Ok, finally some rational feedback albeit unnecessarily snarky...haha. Sub-zero might be sticking with white because women don't like stainless interiors... at least the majority of women here. So much so they are willing to buy a less reliable refrigerator in white... as long as its fixed quickly. Nothing wrong with that... to each his/her own. Sub-Zero is then genius for standing their ugly ground in the face of the fierce competition.

Let it go, Paul.

I really don't want my refrigerator to be sexy. I want it to fit snugly into a recess with trim that seals it off so it doesn't get dust sucked in along the sides and the cat can't shove stuff underneath.

I want it to be shallow so things don't get lost in the back. I want paneled because I don't want stainless in this kitchen.

I don't want it to impress people, I don't want people to notice it. And if I could get this for $3000 I would be all over it, I am not impressing anyone least of all myself to have to spend $10,000 for it. I actually think it's a little embarrassing.

Just as an aside, believe it or not, lots of people don't even know what a Subzero is. (Or any built-in fridge for that matter). My last apartment I put a Subzero in because my refrigerator was technically in my living room right outside the kitchen.

When I put the unit on the market, some of the feedback I got was "Could not find the Refrigerator in the kitchen(?)" and "Did not like that there was no DW" (also paneled). This happened a number of times.

I ended up putting Post-It notes on them saying "This is the Refrigerator" , "This is the DW"., so people could find them. Then I had people say "Oh that's really cool, how did you take the front of the regular door off?"

That was seven months ago. One of us needs to let it go.

Well this is weird because this thread popped up at the top as having new responses this Morning long before Diana posted, earlier today. So maybe another response or responses has/have been removed.

You may be right, palimpsest. Otherwise, Diana’s response…6 months after what we now see posted, doesn’t make sense.

I’d given up on Paul’s ”dazzling” nonsense before the 6th month old thread ended. But, when it popped up today, I just had to bite. Oh well.

I gave up on rude darbuka months ago as well.

Dear Darbuka,

I'm sorry, old sport, for the way I've been talking about something you hold so close to your heart. I know I've got this habit of shooting off my mouth without thinking, and sometimes it stings, especially when it's about something some treasure from the good old days. If you can find it in your heart to forgive me, I swear I'll try to be more careful with my words, not let them fly off the handle so easily.

You see, I was brought up to speak my mind, but over the years, a certain bitterness has snuck in, and you, in your own peculiar way, are helping me see that by bearing the brunt of my thoughtless outbursts. I'm asking for your forgiveness, but don't let it slip from your memory.

Paul F.

Written with ChatGPT in the style of JD Salinger.