The original purpose of recessed ceiling lighting was to hide the light source. If you would rather see the light source, you might as well use the wafers instead of recessed housings.

Is the builder designing the house?

I have no issues with the proper lamps in recessed cans, the correct lamp recess avoids the glare typical of the shallow wafer light while providing pleasing illumination. But I find most builders and homeowners don't do their homework and match the bulb size/shape with the installed cans & trim (the can/trim specs will list the proper lamps to use). Then you end up with lamps too recessed and/or insufficient recess and glaring lights.

We had to delay our electrical by 4 weeks when the electricians finally showed us the recessed lights they planned on installing. What they had was basically bottom of the barrel technology from 15 years ago ... their lighting supplier probably has a warehouse full of old stock he is giving away!

We went to a local lighting showroom and looked at what they offered. We picked a product from Elco and tied it into low voltage Crestron switches in the public spaces and regular switches in private rooms. Elco offered high lumens, high CRI and choice of Kelvin. There was a 4 week lead time, but well worth it to end up with better lighting.

We used their Cedar System, but here are all their offerings.

https://elcolighting.com/recessed-residential

"We are also exclusively using Lutron Caset[t]a switches, which has some limitations on low-voltage lighting."

Lutron Caseta products are for standard, 120 volt circuits. Are you purchasing Caseta so you can add the hub for use with the Lutron app? If not, Caseta is an expensive way to go.

• Lutron Caseta Original Smart Switch ($55) vs. Leviton Decora Switch ($2/each)
• Lutron Caseta Diva Smart Dimmer ($70) vs. Lutron Diva Dimmer ($30-$23/each)
• Lutron Caseta Smart Fan Speed Control ($68) vs. Lutron Diva Fan Control & Light Switch ($33)

HU-867564120: "the correct lamp recess avoids the glare typical of the shallow wafer light while providing pleasing illumination."

Yup. Plus if you use a recessed housing with socket, trim, and PAR bulb (e.g., PAR20 for a 4"), you can replace just the bulb when it fails rather than the entire fixture. If you install recessed housings, use a maximum diameter of 4", not those old 6".

DMF is another option for cans. Home - DMF Lighting. Designed by electricians for high performance and ease of installation/servicing. You can match lumens to type of use. For a counter work zone 450 lumens at the counter is a recommended minimum. A fixture is located 6" in from the counter edge. Two offset to either side of the center is better.

No reason to pay for fixtures that are low voltage and require a transformer to step down the voltage. Of course, there may be the odd chandelier that requires this but low voltage transformers and dimmers if not a perfect match can buzz and why borrow trouble? Wafers are for remodeling and ONLY IF YOU MUST otherwise, IMO they look cheap.

You want can lights with LED bulbs that can be replaced, though you may never have to do that in your lifetime. These are reasonably priced. They have been around for decades and work well. You'll want to at least consider HALO lights. They have all types of cans you might need, the quality is there. They have been around for decades. You can even get them at HD and Lowes, (but not all the trim kits that are offered, so check the website)

A can light comes in two pieces, the housing and the trim kit. Here below are a variety of trim kits offered. Just depends on the appearance you want on the ceiling. From an angle, you should NOT see the bulb. You want the light spread.

The cans and trims you select should be able to accommodate on of these PAR LED bulbs. These will provide you with the best quality of light for a home.

Do not purchase fixtures without knowing the bulb you plan to use. They have to be compatable in terms of size.

What I'm suggesting might be viewed as old-fashioned, but it has worked for decades, the company is still in business & and you don't require an engineering degree to pick or install them.

Will there be any ceiling fans?

Interestingly, recessed ceiling downlights with screw base sockets for PAR bulbs are prohibited in California: 2022 Single Family Residential Compliance Manual - May 2022 pages 6-4, 6-5, 6-6, 6-7, 6-8.

Your concern using a traditional housing is not liking the depth of the recess for the 'bulb.' However, a deeper recess is the first defense against glare. But a solution is physically adjusting a generic housing's socket bracket to lower the 'bulb' closer to the face of the ceiling. Note this will cause a wider gap around the 'bulb' because the baffles are tapered.

Your husband's concern is not liking gimbals, assuming that is referencing the adjustable trim where there is sort of a "disc" of a 'bulb' that you can rotate and see one side angled below the ceiling. However, using a gimbal is the best defense against glare on a sloped ceiling, because the light throw should be perpendicular to the floor. You could instead spec a gimbal housing, where the rotation is up inside the housing itself. You would have to go with higher priced fixtures for that style. Note using traditional housings in a cathedral or vaulted ceiling should have more attention paid to insulation methods at each fixture.

What an incredible thread for me to learn from. Too often I see these threads and the OP disappears. I just wanted to pop in and say thank you for all this and keep it coming.

To answer the questions I see above:

The Caseta switches are already purchased. My current home is 90% Caseta and integration with Alexa and we love it. We will be doing the same in the new home. Their comparability (or lack thereof) with low voltage is what sent me down this path to begin with.

The only rooms with a ceiling fan are some of the bedrooms.

Again, thanks so much everyone.

Ps - I am the OP. Not sure why it showed up under that odd name initially.

We had Halo recessed installed and got the 4" with square black trim and love it. However, over our kitchen sink, we had to get ones that angled down to direct the light right over it. It's a bit bulkier, but necessary. Form over function....