I do not have a guess, sorry. However, would just like to comment on what a nice rose that looks like - it is so happy!

Jackie

The foliage and mossing looks very similar to common moss to me, so I'd look in that family.

I wanted to add, that's an early bloom and slightly deformed, and doesn't show the flowers at their best, which is what they usually are.

RBEHS, you may be right about foliage and mossing, but the habit is very different from 'Common Moss', which I grow. CM has a lanky, open habit and gets tall; my mystery moss is low-growing and suckering, with upright growth. In habit it resembles a Gallica, but its general bristliness and mossiness, and its foliage, are entirely un-Gallica-like, at least to my eyes.

Jackie, you're right: it is a happy rose.

I'm bumping my post up in the hopes that someone will yet respond with a guess. Really, no one has any idea?

buping up again - this is such a lovely rose - I am hoping someone who knows a lot will have something to say about it.

Jackie

The habit suggests it's a Gallica. The height and the suckering... Now if it grows best in sandy soils in drainage ditches, that would fit gallicas as well.

About the mossing: I don't remember where I picked this idea it (it wasn't original with me) but something about the mossing coming from/ appearing in two different classes of roses. Does this strike a chord with wnyone else?

Ann, I've read, don't remember where, that mossing appeared spontaneously in the Centifolias, leading to 'Common Moss' and, presumably after that, to any number of lanky, gangly Moss varieties; and also appeared in the Damasks, with, I've heard, stiffer moss. Which Moss roses are of Damask origin, I don't know, though I seem to recall that 'Comtesse de Murinais', which I grew in Washington, is of Damask origin, and the comments on CdM's entry in HMF also suggest this.

I don't follow modern roses that much, but have an impression that 20th century hybridizers did a lot of work breeding mossiness into modern rose lines. But the 19th century breeders seem to have been active, too. My mystery moss has its Gallica-ish habit; 'Capitaine John Ingram' has always struck me as having a good dose of Gallica in its ancestry, and 'Mme. Moreau', taller in habit, has modest, neatly striped blooms that, moss aside, look like Gallica flowers. And of course you have busty 'Mme. Louis Leveque' which strikes me as very much like a mossy Hybrid Perpetual. There was quite a bit of variety already bred into this group. I don't know of another Moss, though, that looks like this one.

By the way, if anyone has any corrections to offer to my account, please do so! I pick up things here and there, and may make some errors.

Oh, yes: our soil is heavy clay, not in the least sandy, but Gallicas, and my mystery Moss, grow well here, as well as native R. gallica. The latter does tend to show up a lot along the edges of ditches, though.

I still have an undefined impression that there's some similarity between my rose and certain Hybrid Damasks.

I wish I could help, too. I only have Soupert et Notting from Rogue Valley at the moment, and yours doesn't seem to be that based on the few flowers I've seen on mine. If you could determine if it repeats that would help eliminate a good number. Also, there's the possibility, depending on the location it was collected, that it could be a random seedling.

Beautiful old Moss, Melissa! Could it possibly be ’Pelisson’? As I recall that one suckers quite a bit, even in clay, and it has something of a Gallica habit. Fragrant and quite mossy like your rose, and I think the petal count is at least close to your rose’s petal count and the form is close. I’ve read that ‘Pelisson’ is called a ”red“ Moss, but in my opinion, it is distictly medium pink. Suckering Moss roses: My ‘Nuits de Young’ is the reigning monarch of suckering Mosses. Fortunately, it is a lovely, purple thing and I have a sharp spade! My Gallicas aren’t blooming yet, but it looks like you’ve already begun Old Garden Rose Season 2024! Carol

Would love to know what you think of portlandmysteryrose's suggestion, Melissa. Maybe when more of the blooms on your mystery open you will have enough info to compare them. I love mysteries!

Jackie

Looking through the Sangerhausen Moss roses, I would guess 'Marechal Davoust' [Robert, 1853], would be closest to what you have there, taking everything into account. Description by GS Thomas also seems to conform to your rose somewhat [attractive, pointed leaves, brownish moss, button eye, green centre].

Might be worth taking a look at that one.

I'm glad this thread is finally moving.

I went down this morning to have a look at 'Pélisson' and my mystery moss, both of which have been in the garden for years; in fact, I got them from the same gardener (brilliant, generous man). I think they're different roses. First, I've never noticed a resemblance, and given enough time I do see these things. Then, 'Pélisson' is very short, about 20cm compared to MM's meter, and it has a general Gallica air to it that MM does not, in spite of its Gallica-style suckering. DH mowed 'Pélisson' to the ground last year, which makes comparisons difficult, and it hasn't formed any buds yet (and may not).

I didn't look at 'Maréchal Davoust', which is somewhere down there, but I remember as one of the lanky Mosses, habit different from that of MM.

I continue to have a feeling that MM has some relationship to the Hybrid Damasks. Is it the clusters of plump buds with the funnel-shaped ovaries that appear at the top of short, upright canes, or the thick growth of thorns? Also its cane growth may be somewhat stouter than that of the Gallicas (I may be fooling myself here).

In any case it was pleasant to be out piddling around with the roses on a mild sunny morning. I did get soaked from the overgrown wet grass.

By the way, nice to see you here, Carol, along with everybody else, of course. Another thing, MM has an old rose style perfume--Damask--and the pink is quite a brilliant shade.

That’s convenient you have a ’Pelisson’ for comparison, Melissa. Your collection is impressive! So, Damask perfume, brilliant pink, and those daunting bristles…the mystery continues. Thank you for the spring welcome! Someday, I’ll show up for fall, winter and early spring threads. :) Carol

Huh. I added a final comment that for some reason didn't post. 'Pélisson' is about 1 1/2 feet/45cm tall, NOT 20cm!!! Conversion failure.

Hello to you, Carol! I always enjoy your old rose threads, though, having posted extensively last year, I may not contribute to this round. I hope you and yours are doing well.

This chronic fatigue is a pain. My couple of hours of piddling around in the garden yesterday morning cost me the rest of the day. I couldn't get warm again for hours, and once I did warm up, couldn't get myself off the sofa before finally going off to bed.

Another (?) dwarf moss. https://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=21.135795

WOW, monarda, that really does look similar, doesn't it? I would love to have the plant itself for a side by side comparison. Let me say, I'm not convinced the two varieties, mine and the "Belmont Pink Powderpuff Moss" are identical, but they would certainly be worth comparing if that were possible. I'd like to see photos of young growth, and have an impression that my rose is a richer pink. I notice that Celestial too speaks of a Portland style in her found rose. Thanks very much for the suggestion: it's a good one!

Rambling on: these two kinds look like close relatives at least, possibly with a common origin but with sporting leading to slight differences, if there are differences? I have a number of Mosses, but no other with this habit.

I went out, this rainy May 1st, to check the color and form of my mystery moss's blooms. Conditionally, as this has been a gray, wet month which could have influenced the flowers, I think mine is a stronger pink both in bud and in bloom, with pale reverses to the petals of the open flower. The opened bloom is fairly flat across the surface, and the flower is flat, not domed--I wish the photographers of "Belmont Pink Powderpuff Moss" had taken more pictures from the side of fully open flowers to see them from that angle--and I haven't noticed any reflexing outer petals as I see on some of BPPM; but, the weather. If it ever stops raining here, I might be able to see it under different condtions.

At present, my best guess is that the two varieties are very similar, possibly related?, but not identical.

P.S. Though generally enjoying excellent healthy foliage, it does get a trace of Damask crud.

Note: there was a comment, since deleted, to which I wrote a reply. I thought I'd delete my reply, too, as under the circumstances it made no sense.

Your Moss is quite the lovely mystery! I’ll have to hit up HMF to check out BPPM. I’m completely unfamiliar with that one. I am so sorry to hear you have chronic fatigue, Melissa! What is it with all the autoimmune ya-ya these days? I have to dodge sunlight (I know. As if one can while in the garden, right?) and also pay for dedicated industry with pain and inflammation. Ah, well. My Gallicas give me a lot in return! How’s the weather at your place? We flared up to 91-94 (!) but dropped back down into the 70s and 60s. Cardinal de Richelieu, Indigo and I sure got crispy for a couple days! Carol