I just kept refreshing thinking Silas Marner would populate since its a newer release, but it never did. So I called, and the customer service representative told me that they didnt have inventory for that one. It never went on sale because it’s sold out. I also asked about the older roses that have a jan 2024 restock date and she told me its an error and they are retired.

Wow. I hope the actually have the other ones we ordered today lol. If not, I am getting refunded when the time comes and not substitutions like I did last year.

They seem to have a pretty sophisticated and elegant site, so I don’t know why they can’t figure our a way to indicate that retired roses are listed for reference purposes only or something like that.

Echo -- Now I just have several months to figure out where they will go! So weird about Silas. I got it late last spring when they were trying to unload their last remaining bare roots with a discount, so they clearly had a lot last year. Maybe something unexpected happened with the crop.

Sultry — Thanks for the info on Sharifa. I never mind crouching on my knees to smell her at the botanical garden, as it‘s well worth it! Bolero is my favorite rose, so I’m looking forward to seeing how one of its parents does for me. I know this is off-topic, but how are your adorable pigs doing??

@Elestrial 7a Rogue Valley has Jude in stock but it’s own root.

I ordered Mill on the Floss, Eustacia Vye, Young Lycidas, and Penelope Lively.

I wish I had known about Sharifa Asma. I don’t understand why there was no indication about this beforehand.

It looks like Jude is still in stock on the DA site.

@knightsgambit agree with you and others -- it's frustrating, especially because if you look at the Sharifa Asma product page, it doesn't include the typical box that allows you to sign up for restock notifications, implying that it has been retired. Some sort of separate listing for retired varieties would make more sense. And, I'd love to see them include every retired Austin in that section.

Such cuties Sultry. I have not eaten pigs since I was 4, I just think they are too cute and smart. I wanna squeeze your babies.

Okay so what do you suggest ladies for a yellow rose. Golden Celebration, Roald Dahl, Vanessa Bell, Charles Darwin or Bring Me Sunshine?

Sultry -- Penelope and her piglets are too cute for words! That's wonderful she's such a good mama. And of course they want to stick their cute snouts where they don't belong during gate painting lol.

Z10. I think everyone knows how much I like Golden Celebration, which I've grown for nearly 20 years. This is a big rose that can be grown as an upright shrub, or a climber. It is self supporting, but has flexible canes. Mine is grafted and very vigorous, a near continuous bloomer. Bring Me Sunshine looks good, too, though I don't grow it. Diane

@Z10Socal although not a stunner, Vanessa Bell may be one of the easiest roses you will ever grow. Light yellow, almost no backspot, vigorous, beautiful shape. I feel it’s a more complementary than center stage rose. Poet’s Wife is just as good, bigger blooms, more deeper yellow. Roald Dahl is more orange but has more issues with BS.

Diane it's gorgeous but that does look like a climber. How long does a cutting last in the vase? Oh guess what, I purchased one of your favorites Carmel Antique last spring.

Knightsgambit, I heard Vanessa Bell is like bolero so she does sound reliable only thing I noticed was that it scores low on fragrance. Ok I will skip RD.

DA says Charles Darwin has 120 petals =)

Here is Golden Celebration in its entire width. It does not look like a climber. I only showed you a section of GC above. It is self supporting. Diane

Roald Dahl (for me) has a smaller bloom size. its grafted and has been in my garden for maybe 2 years. does get some BS. bloom size is probably 2.5-3 inches.

Sultry, your piglets are so adorable.

I can’t make up my mind here… so I put Penelope Lively, Charles Rennie McIntosh, Eglantyne, and Huntington Rose in my cart, but haven’t checked out yet. I don’t know why I always do this with rose orders… it’s like I have to sleep over everything because I hate buyers remorse so badly that I can’t make up my mind. Someone please scare me out of at least one of these roses. I wanted to keep it to three.

@Z10Socal my Roald Dahls are lovely mounded shrubs with repeat flushes, but the bloom itself and the scent isn't anything to fawn over. I have a small Charles Darwin that smells like diapers / baby wipes to me. The blooms have been lovely. Teasing Georgia is my biggest yellow. I wish it had a stronger scent. My golden celebration is too young to comment on, but is healthy and putting out buds so far.

@judijunebugarizonazn8 I can't argue with any of those! You and everyone on this thread are making me regret not getting a Penelope Lively.

@sultry_jasmine_nights (Florida-9a-ish) Love those pigs!!!

Diapers? Okay clean diapers. My mind went to dirty diapers and was horrified.

@Z10Socal haha, clean diapers! But diapers nonetheless. So a bit odd.

Judi, I think if you have 5 roses you will get free ship haha..My first order, I wasnt paying attention and I had 4 roses..I don't recall the total but I paid shipping. I was just hurrying, trying to get stuff before it sold out grrr. The 2nd order, (because a few more came back into stock..(grrr-again) I had 5 Roses in my cart and the shipping was free. I should have paid attention the first time because I think the shipping was close to $30. Almost the cost of another rose :/ None of mine were the new roses which cost a bit more though...

Thanks everyone about Penelope and her 3 babies 🐷 They are a lot of fun. 2 girls and one boy.

Diane, Golden Celebration is so lovelÿ! Your pics made me try again and buy GC last spring. I also got The Pilgrim. It hasn't bloomed that much yet but is a clear yellow. The GC has far outbloomed TP so far. GC also smells amazing.

Does anyone have Cup of Gold Climber? I saw it at Jackson Perkins. It has large cupped blooms with wavy petals.

I am still thinking about Penelope! Not the pig but the rose (P. Lively) I am so tempted to put in one more order...I really do want her. I really shouldn't though. Maybe she will go out of stock soon so I will no longer be tempted and tortured :D

Diane in this pic from DA website it looks like a climber. It's so pretty but I'm scared its going to be too big.

Sultry I get the struggle. I did not know about Penelope lively rose and now I'm debating it too.

I have a question for you guys about ordering from DA in cold zones. (I'm in zone 9B, so I've never had this issue). Someone on the NGA rose forum in northern Michigan said today that almost always, DA runs out of the roses she orders by the time it's her shipping time in May. She orders them right when they open, but says that DA doesn't hold your roses when you order. Is this true? Sounds crazy. I've seen people post here that some of their roses got removed from their order, while friends who ordered later got them, but I always figured it was some weird glitch. Just curious...

Susan does that mean in Cali we are safe in not getting our orders canceled?

Was going to buy 3 max and now purchased 5.

I have these in my cart and I’m hovering over the checkout button:

Somebody pleeeease tell me how terrible they are and that they smell like *dirty* diapers lol

SD, I don't grow any of them, so they don't have the Brakefield Seal of Approval--hahaha. Yes, they are terrible. Do not fall prey to these roses. Diane

Diane I ended up getting GC because of your bad influence 😜

Z10, I'm in Santa Barbara, and (IIRC) you're in San Diego. I've always requested first ship date from DA and have always received them on promised ship week, or close. I'm still curious about those poor really cold zone folks. I'm used to getting charged when I order, but I can't remember if DA does that... it's been ~3 years since I ordered from them. Getting charged at order seems like it should secure your order!

@Diane Brakefield hahaha thank you, you’re a real one <3 Although, I do blame you for several of the purchases I’ve made in the past :P

@SD Shine -Z10a Bay Area I grow Sceptre d’Isle. Very easy to grow, no real disease problems and vigorous. My only knock is new growth is top heavy and wish the blooms were a bit higher petal count.

Elizabeth feels under the radar….

@sultry_jasmine_nights (Florida-9a-ish) Can I ask you which DAs you've found perform best for you? I'm slightly lower in central Florida 9B. I'm thinking of growing Eglantyne and Port Sunlight. I'm looking for more apricot/orange that isn't Lady of Shallott (which has done well) and LEH (which has performed badly).

If anyone knows where to source the rose Tea Clipper, please let me know. It's been discontinued but I love the color and shape.

kinghtsgambit, I dont spray and am in one of the worse areas for black spot up in the Panhandle. Our summers are really rainy (not this year lol) and can go to 100+ although its usually in the 90'sF. So if you spray etc. You might have better results.

The Austins that I grow (or have grown) that do best as in least blackspot and best for me blooming-wise would be:

-#1 Spirit of Freedom..this rose grows in the worst spots on my property, blooms all the time, thrives on neglect. I had a smaller FL property (zone 9B) before and much sandier soil and it thrived there too..even the own root. M new place has much more clay in the soil especially a few ft down. Some areas are more sandy. All of my SoF that I have now, at the new place are are grafted. It does get HUGE though. For me,this is a plus since I am out in the country and everything wants to eat roses. Honestly, it should be voted an earth kind rose and marketed to Southern Gardeners imo lol.

The rest aren't in any particular order..

-Teasing Georgia is also a huge, bs resistant, good bloomer.

-Pat Austin & Lilian Austin (own root) are both great here.

-Bathsheba, Tess of the d'Urbervilles (spelling?) (own root), Munstead Wood, Jude, Abe Darby (although it gets some blackspot during summer), Bishop's Castle, Lichfield Angel, James Galway, Mill on the Floss, Olivia, Boscobel, Fighting Temeraire *(blooms can get 7-9 inches here!!!) Princess Alexandra of Kent, Jubilee Celebration (gets some blackspot), Sharifa A is a good bloomer but also gets some blackspot, WS2000, is also very good here.

I have some that are very healthy but don't bloom as much. That could just me not giving the right conditions (fertilizers, sun, cutting back, etc) but I think they might be worth trying..Lady of Shalott, Wedgewood, Young Lycidas (does get some black spot), Evelyn (gets some black spot), Crown Princess M., Charles RM (does get some blackspot).

-Eglantyne & Graham Thomas got a lot of blackspot here. I might try again sometime not sure.. lol.

The Generous Gardener stays green but seems to give mainly spring and fall blooms..not sure if thats normal for him. He's thriving but I probably wouldnt grow it again because its so hot here that the blooms fade and blow quickly.

Carding Mill: I had in the past and it got lots of black spot in summer. Trying again lol.

-Strawberry Hill- does get black spot but I love the unique colored blooms and fragrance so worth it for me.

Last year I got Woolerton Old Hall. So far its doing well but too soon to tell on the bloom frequency. Same for The Pilgrim.

Golden Celebration is a good bloomer but does get summer blackspot, I know, from growing it previously. Totally worth it though!

-I had Falstaff in the past and it was doing great. It had an unfortunate accident with the hose and it died. If I found it grafted, I would definitely try again.

I am probably forgetting a lot that I am growing or have grown. I will add them if I think of them.

ETA: ok thought of a few more to evaluate lol.

-Eustacia V..Lots of black spot. Blooms are faded and kinda small. She is in the ground and hanging in there. Maybe she will get better with age. The pretty blooms that I did get, were in much cooler weather.

Darcy Bussel: Got black spot and not the greatest bloomer. I might try her again..dont ask me why lol. The blooms that she did have were gorgeous.

@sultry_jasmine_nights (Florida-9a-ish) thank you for this, it's very helpful. The two things you hit on about the soil and the rain are what always trouble me so I'm wondering if I should just lean toward the newer roses because of their vigor and disease resistance vs. the old roses.

With Spirit of Freedom and if you're growing it, Crown Princess Margareta, can you train these ones as shrubs?

They might be hard to maintain as shrubs. They really get huge here. If you stayed on top of it, it might be okay. I've never tried to restrain SoF or CPMs growth.

True Antique or True Old garden roses are more disease resistant in the south, in general. The classes Noisettes & Teas are especially good for hot humid areas.

Also, some Hybrid Musks and Polyanthas do well here. Nurseries like Rose Petals Nursery and A Reverence for Roses are both in FL and carry many of them.

Although David Austins are in the Antique Rose or Old Rose Catagory on many websites, They aren't technically true 'Antique' or 'Old Garden Roses' which can be very confusing lol. They are mostly (or all? ) Hybrid Teas of some sort. Some other folks here are more knowlegeable than I am on this subject so maybe they can chime in.

Many Kordes Roses do well for me but they also tend to get large here. They can be managed somewhat by cutting back and then fertilizing after flushes.

The best thing you can do for sandy soil is to constantly add compost. Another trick is to do slightly raised rose beds. Even digging down 18 inches, then add 2x6's around the perimeter, thus raising it 6 inches, making a rectangle & mixing your regular soil with compost, leaves, pine fines (shredded pine chips), the cheap heavy bagged 'Garden Soil' etc will help alot. Another trick here is to use a very large pots and bury them halfway. Put holes in the bottom and low down on the sides. I've had all kinds of roses, tropical plants and even small trees do really well that way.

@knightsgambit I have Tea Clipper and am happy to try to root it for you, just lmk. I'm in California.

@SD Shine -Z10a Bay Area that's so incredibly kind of you. I'd love a rooted cutting if that's possible. I live in Florida, maybe I can exchange and grow something for you?

@sultry_jasmine_nights (Florida-9a-ish) really appreciate your suggestions, I will definitely follow your tips next time I can plant something in the ground. I think last time around I just didn't amend the soil enough and should probably use a whole bag of soil.

knightsgambit, I was thinking... a few hybrid teas that I have, that do really well here and stay smaller (4 -5 ft-ish) are:

-Like No Other

-Plum Perfect

-Queen of Elegance

-Molineux (an Austin- forgot about this one lol

-Distant Drums

-Fire Opal

-Miracle on the Hudson- this one can get very wide but ou can keep it in check easily.

-Peach Swirl

-Princess Charlene de Monaco..Now this one can get huge but you can keep it cut back smaller. Very very fragrant too.

I decided to go ahead and get Penelope Lively just in case it sold out. I also ordered a few others lol.

Does anone have Gabriel Oak? I decided to get that one because people said it has black spot resistance and great fragrance. I was deciding between her and James L Austin. I never hear anthing about James L Austin. The both seem very similar looking. I'm not sure of what the actual differences are lol.

James L. Austin really is fantastic, Sultry. You may need it too. I do not have GO so I can't compare.

I have Gabriel Oak which has great disease resistance and almost non-stop flowering during our long season in California. It gets huge also.

close-up view of GO:

Your GO is indeed splendidly beautiful and huge! I love mine as well, but didn’t realize how big he would get. Mine is fast on its way to that size.

Sheila, I had the hardest time choosing! Maybe next year I will also add James. I have been looking at photos online of both and in some photos, James looks more cupped and pinker. Then, in others, it is the reverse! I ended up choosing GO mainly due to the reported black spot resistance.

Rose Lai, Wow! Your Gabriel photos are gorgeous!! Thank you for sharing your photos. I am floored by the number of blossoms. I am so happy to hear that GO is a good bloomer too. Large/ tall is great in my book, due to all the critters around here. Shorter roses here, like 3ft and under, really have to stay in pots or in raised beds.

The dark blooms are James in the Spring, but he is a good rebloomer.

Sheila, all your roses are so stunning! Your property is so pretty too. James also looks like he gets large and is healthy. What is the fragrance like?

Sultry, I have Gabriel Oak. Many years ago I bought James L Austin and it didnt break dormancy as a bare root and they refunded me and I havent tried it again.

Gabriel Oak for me is a very healthy shrub, very fast rebloomer which sets a lot of blooms as well. moderate to strong fragrance. the only criticism i have of it is really more of a personal preference, the blooms kind of open up to be kind of disc shaped, not all the way flat, but the blooms are not cup shaped, and after the first flush, it seems the blooms can be on the smallish side, like 2.5 cm for me. I cut them early in the morning when the blooms are still semi closed to give the illusion of shape. but very healthy, good bloomer, good fragrance.

Sultry, my nose is impaired by allergies. I'll try to check.

Me, too, Sheila. I'm a mess. Diane

Echo, what a fabulous bouquet of Gabriel Oak. Diane

Echo, I love the color of your bouquet! What a beauty! I am really excited to be getting a Gabriel next spring! I just realized my male livestock guardian dog's name is also Gabriel duh..I will have to clip some of GO's blossoms into his fur and take some photos lol. Im sure he will love that haha.

For me, James L Austin is nearly always in bloom, uber healthy, great bush about 4’ high . But not super fragrant (more than love song). GO has smaller blooms, but more fragrant. Doesn’t bloom as much as James. I’m more bothered by rust & sometimes mildew, but both of these roses resist these. My GO has not taken off in size. Still a Munstead sized bush.