I'll take a dozen! 😁

I think I'm the only Roses Forum member who is smitten with Austin Derangement Syndrome. Austin roses' mystical cult stature just does not charm me in the least. I cringe when I see the word Austin. The roses don't work out in my garden: black spotters, weak necks, monotonous same as the last variety blooms, and stingy with them. If I see another 'English,' style flower........enough already...... turn the page!

I've wasted enough money on Austin roses, no more. Austin Roses would go out of business if the business was dependent on me for patronage.

It gives me great pleasure to PASS on that deal, fig.

Moses.

Is this for plants from their TX facility?

I will buy $70. roses when Hades freezes over and we all go ice skating.

And didn't DA introduce 3-gal potted roses for a brief period earlier this summer for something like $90? I remember clicking on an email from them and being shocked by the price. I hope I'm not misremembering...

Fig, I just read that email from DA today, but didn't click for details since I'm not in the market for new roses. Yowza... $70? And people complain about Heirloom's prices nowadays :-D

Nothing ever changes., Mr Austin treated the US market as his personal ATM for decades and his business continues even without him. There ARE words, but not in polite society...

Moses,

A friend who used to post here from over in Asheville was also a major fan of Austins. I need to call him and find out how his gardening has evolved.

I had a lot at one time. Mine from Pickering did well (multiflora rootstock) and after a decade or so stopped doing so well.

Well, I may be the odd one out here. I don’t love all of the DA roses, but many of them do very well in my garden and rank among my favorite roses. I haven’t looked into their business model and ethics very closely, so I won’t comment on that. However, I don’t understand why anyone would think ill of a rose business because their roses blackspot in MY personal garden, even though they do well in many other gardens. That would be like me thinking or speaking ill of the Kordes rose company: in my garden, most of the Kordes roses I’ve tried don’t fare so well: they grow big bushes but seldom bloom. However, I know that many of you have great success with Kordes roses in your gardens, so I am glad they continue to breed and sell roses to gardeners who love them. Moses, I am sorry that Austin roses just don’t love your climate, but you can be happy for me that they do grow in mine and I will be happy for the roses that do well in your garden. I’m certainly not condoning the high prices of their potted plants! But it’s the way things are going: of course there’s inflation and then there are high shipping costs, because of high fuel costs, because of troubles abroad, because of politics… and let’s face it, prices aren’t going to be going back down much if at all. They will continue to rise as they have been doing ever since I can remember. So I personally won’t be making any bold statements about never paying that price for a rose, though it certainly puts a crimp on my garden spending when I see prices like that.

I've yet to meet an Austin hybrid that didn't defoliate badly from Blackspot in my climate — except maybe 'Chianti', but very few people want to grow that these days.

So funny - years and years ago, I went to the Celebration of Old Roses in the East Bay. I did not know much of anything about old roses, except that evidently I had a garden of them at our new house, and I was trying to find out more about them. My BIL and SIL had just moved up to the Bay Area From LA, and bought a 100 year old farm house on an acre of land, in Novato. They were fencing in an area that had once been its garden. I was trying to help them ID some roses which were still living there, and they wanted to add more. When they found out I was going to the Celebration, they asked me to buy them a rose. It turned out that the rose I bought them was 'Chianti', because I liked the blooms. What I did not know was that it was a once bloomer (I'm not sure I knew there was such a thing at that point). Anyway, it is still growing and thriving, and blooming prolifically in their garden every Spring. It, of course, has gotten huge, but they have plenty of space for it.

Jackie

I actually found a pic of a Chianti bloom I took so many years ago in my photo file. I DOES look like an old rose, and as I recall it has a nice strong old rose fragrance too. The color is way variable, and much of the time a darker hue than this pic.

Jackie

'Golden Celebration' is the only Austin that has passed muster here of the seven or eight I've tried and even it, right now, is completely afflicted and greatly defoliated by blackspot due to odd weather. With the others it wasn't blackspot so much (generally pretty rare here, overall). They just seemed to dislike either our climate, our soil, or the not-too-generous irrigation -- or maybe, me ;-), and never much thrived.

My Golden Celebration is one of my very top roses. It is currently blooming away as we climb to 102F today. It's been a summer long blast furnace here with wildfires all around, and still GC keeps on blooming and growing. It's nearly 20 years old in my garden and is grafted on Huey. I have a Tamora, continuous bloomer, from Pickering blooming away, also almost 20 years old. Eglantyne, tied for earliest bloomer here is continuously blooming, and ignores the heat. She is in her 22nd year. I love my David Austin roses. But most are huge, though Tamora remains just under 3X3 feet like she's supposed to.

But back to Austin prices. Locally, dear old Edwards Greenhouse is selling 5 gallon Austin roses for $49. Non Austin roses are mostly $48-49, but some are $41-43, mostly much older roses. For example, Martha Stewart is $49 and still available, while Sterling Silver was $42 and is sold out. Diane

Golden Celebration

Golden Celebration was a great rose here, despite condtions that defeated many Austins. The evil Basura who bought the neighboring property killed my beautiful hedge of it -- but we had manyears of joy from it.

@jerijen Lol..."basura". I love it. I've never heard it used that way, Jeri. I speak 5 languages, but evidently I need to get out more, lol.

@susan9santabarbara, come to think of it, they also look very nice in the rose garden in Golden Gate Park in San Francisco. The cooling, moderating effect of being near the ocean must suit the Austins just fine.

You don't have to live in California to have beautifully performing roses. They like it hot and dry here as long as I irrigate steadily with our huge drip system. It's $$$ and needs some maintenance via my son in law, but it's been worth it. We built the system ourselves using not just drip emitters, but various kinds of very small sprinklers that water the perennials. And we have no fungal diseases here, few insect pests, no RRD, or icky JBs.

Susan, what do you mean you're elderly? In three months, I'll be 81. Got you beat. It only made it up to 101F today, and I have a patio and raised bed full of hot peppers, basil, cilantro, grape tomatoes, nasturtiums, a big mess of chives, and a raised bed full of big tomato plants. I hand water all this stuff but it's looking good. These things like it hot, except for the nasturtiums. They grow on the deck. I can't plant them in the ground because our massive coveys of California quail (thanks, Cal) eat my nasturtiums and a bunch of other favorite plants. They love my garden. Diane

Harvesting the Habs a couple of years ago. I had my camera handy. I grew all of these.

I live in black spot, japanese beetle infected humid area and still love the Austins. I do not grow many since they do require extra care, but their delicate beauty cant be matched. I love all their soft colors and chaliced blooms, the weak necks too so go figure. I love all my healthy Kordes and they are the backbone of my garden, but if I lived in a dry area Austins would be what I would prefer.

top performers here with minimal extra care: They do blackspot, but not before my spring flush happens. They recover well and bloom.

Teasing georgia

Bathsheba

Benjamin Britten

Lichfield Angel

Lady of Shalott

The Lady Gardener

Olivia Austin

Jude

Boscobell (the weakest one, but my favorite bloom so I will pamper it with 3 in one granules)

cant purchase 70 dollars plants right now, but I am very tempted by Dannahue. Jude is one of my favorites and Dannahue looks so similar, but probably healthier.

I find DA to be an arrogant company, , the forced ‘retirement’ of less profitable patent-expired varieties , coercion by trademark, bullying of vendors, exhorbitant prices. If I buy an Austin, I always try to find it from a vendor than Austin themselves, so they only make the profit on the patent and not the whole plant. I joked that they needed to introduce AUSgreedy to honor one of their leaders, but probably shouldn’t speak ill of the deceased. In many rose circles their fans view them as some sort of superior class of rose. I find a good many of them are too sprawly and have wimpy petals that don’t stand up well to my heat. A few of them are quite decent, but the Weeks, Meilland, Delbard and NIRP roses are my overall favorites.

@BenT (NorCal 9B Sunset 14) add selling the "exclusive world rights" to the SAME rose to producers on each continent (knowing they will likely never breech each other's legal rights due to import restrictions); changing the standard procedure of collecting royalties on the number of plants successfully produced to royalties collected on the number of buds provided, whether they are used or succeed or not; restricting the number of new varieties to each producer and requiring royalties on each sub license to other producers on new varieties and other "sharp pencil" tactics. I dismissed them early one due to the outrageous prices being charged for those horrible plants (octopus arms, indeed) and the fact it required too many years to produce any with any real difference from the ones previously produced. I quickly tired of all of them bleaching to "beige" in my climate. Each new batch appeared to primarily differ from the previous batch simply in the number of petals. I finally gave in and grew a few selected types and quickly discovered they demand significantly greater water than any other types I've grown simply to remain "healthy". What should I have expected from plants produced and selected in a wet climate? Nope, there are none of his creations in my yard today. I'd rather use my water for types which LIKE being with me and remaining healthy without assistance. Good on you if they like where you are. They don't like it here, and I'm fine with that.

Fig -- "BASURA" was a gift. On our many trips to Mexico, I HAD to translate "NO TIRAR BASURA" signs along the way.

Since then, I've applied "BASURA" to many kinds of trash.

Roseseek,

Well expressed post above. My sentiments, too.

Moses.

Oh, basta on the Austin trashing. It seems to be a hobby on this forum. I was checking online sellers of the sorta newish and beautiful rose, Light Years Away. Breck's was selling it as a three gallon plant for $99.99 and Gracie Roses was selling it for $129. I didn't bother to check the plant size on that one. Still, Ben, dear Edwards was selling Light Years Away for $49 for a five gallon plant, along with all their Austins, so I'll stick with them. Or maybe, I could be out of space and not get anything--ha. Diane

The DA roses also do great in the heat.

MW

MW

Cressida

St Cecilia

Bishop's Castle

Cressida

Evelyn

Evelyn

Boscobel and Evelyn

@Diane Brakefield Speaking of the Austins — two years ago I found what was left of my plant of 'The Prince' out among the Blackberry brambles (thanks so much, Luther Burbank) and dug up those two 5" twigs and put them in a 2 gallon pot. I've had that plant since 1994 and it has never performed well for me, but I kinda wanted to save it (I mean, odds are I'd never get it back again if I let it perish, right?) and see if I could coax it to do something worthwhile.

Fast forward to today: I'm honestly surprised — it's still in a 20" pot on the deck, and it gets dappled shade in the afternoon, but I have never seen it look so good. Yeah, it has to be watered daily and I've fed it obscene amounts of Miracle Grow (Yeah, I know: ugh), and yes, it has to be sprayed or the foliage all dies from Blackspot. But right now, today, it is close to what I envisioned those 32 years ago, but never came to fruition.

To get back on topic: no, I would never pay $70+ shipping for an Austin rose. If a grower can bud 'Tiffany' and 'Fragrant Cloud' on Old Huey and sell them cheap enough that Home Despot can offer them for $12, then you'll have a heck of a time convincing me I'm getting my moneys worth for a $70 Austin rose.

Your "The Prince"s are doing great here too, Paul.

Up to 2 gal pots now.

The $70 per gallon plant had me spitting out my coffee. They’re capitalizing on the FOMO. At Regan’s, DA’s now go for $100 each, albeit 5 gallon monstrosities, usually. Non-DAs are $70. Has the rose-growing market always been this ‘intense’? I must admit, I haven’t really paid attention to it until 2 years ago when I had my daughter and decided to ‘retire’ for a little bit and found myself with some extra time.

@judijunebugarizonazn8 @catspa_zone9sunset14 I’ve had much the same experience re: David Austin roses in my garden! I get coastal fog at night and dry daytimes. Combine that with few garden locations that get direct, all-day sun because I live in a forest, many DA’s have been my most productive roses! I find Meilland roses, in general, need more direct sun & heat to thrive than my garden has to give and end up with terrible rust and PM. My Kordes roses, like yours, are huge and leafy, but bloom quite sparsely relative to others. One person’s trash is another person’s treasure, right? Half the fun, for me, in growing roses has been figuring out what works in my garden, and what doesn’t. And when I can find a spot where what doesn’t starts doing well, victory is mine! Lol. I take the wins where I can.

@judijunebugarizonazn8 How can you throw around such gorgeous pics of Cressida? She’s been on my wishlist for years!

@Diane Brakefield your GC is magnificent. If only we could all grow roses as well as you.

@Paul Barden I acquired Mel’s Heritage this year and have been loving it! My RVR cart is currently filled with your roses, but I have to get rid of a few of my oldies first.

I've always found it fascinating where DAs thrive or don't. I guess it's kind of a no-brainer that they do well here in a Mediterranian climate, veering towards UK climate at times. What I find interesting is how well they do for some hot summer growers like Judi and Diane. I suppose a big part of that is lack of humidity and fungal diseases.

I completely agree with Ben and Roseseek about not being a fan of the company, particularly in the past ten years. As Joe Average, I obviously have no experience with Roseseek's comments about their pricing and policies to their growers, but that's truly awful. But as Ben said, arrogant and greedy has been my impression of them recently, and it appears that they've been that way for a long time.

Paul, congratulations on your patience with The Prince. This rose takes its time for sure and has to grow in a spot that pleases him. Years ago, my The Prince was just OK, but when I moved him to his current spot, he slowly, but surely improved and grew and grew. He's a fine bloomer that does take a nap, not long, in mid July. He's one of my earliest bloomers, and he's having another flush right now.I hope your The Prince continues to prosper. I think my rose came from Palatine and must be grafted on multiflora rootstock. I've still got his tag and need to check that.

Sheila, what beautiful, healthy roses that are among my very favorites: Munstead Wood, Evelyn, and The Prince. Great color--your camera certainly handles reds well. I love Bosco as well and yours is a stunner.

SD Shine, I'm in love with Light Years Away, and you are growing a great LYA--saw your photos on HMF yesterday. Edwards is selling this rose, so the temptation to get it is terrible. What do you think of Light Years Away? And you're growing Frederic Mistral, one of my all time favorites, which I can't get locally anymore. Where did you find yours? My poor Fred is no longer in my garden. Diane

My late, lamented Frederic Mistral

I like his center in this pic.

Oh, thanks about Golden Celebration, SD Shine. He's still having his flush, right through the 100F heat. Diane

I’m very attached to my early David Austins, most of which I’ve bought from places like RVR. But I am in a very particular microclimate (just a few miles from the Golden Gate Park rose garden) and I have to grow almost all my roses in pots, so I go through a lot of trial and error too to figure out what grows well where I live. Some of the DAs thrive and some don’t!

Wise Portia has been a gorgeous and manageably sized surprise in the fog; I hope she stays that way. I also ordered a two quart Lady Emma Hamilton direct from David Austin earlier this year and it is one of my healthiest roses (also has amazing fragrance, and I love the colors of both the blooms and the foliage). Up at my community garden plot I grow DA’s Charlotte, which I adore despite no real noticeable scent, along with Duchess of Portland and Little White Pet, and they are a happy trio among my annuals and CA native plants.

Here is my Wife of Bath, one of my gateway DA roses, bought from Roses Unlimited. She was blooming non-stop and mostly mildew free in our most recent six week streak of heavy relentless fog, unlike her neighbor Chaucer, who always looks like a frosted Christmas tree (and according to Clair Martin’s book will probably stay that way).

Diane,

Every time I go to the nursery I have to resist putting ’Light Years Away’ into my cart, I think has the nicest bloom I’ve seen of the purple/mauves, and the plant looks terrific too. I should go ahead and buy it so it can live in my yard instead of rent-free in my head. I heard Christian Bedard is no longer hybridizing at Weeks so this may be last in the long line of great purple roses that includes Twilight Zone and Ebb Tide. Living the Dream is a new Weeks stunner too as well as Meilland’s Martha Stewart, but I already caved in and bought those. We get Weeks/Star roses super well grown and cheap, $35 in a five gallon blooming pot. Austins follow their usual pattern $70 for a smallish plant in a funky green pot. Selection is quite limited too, sometimes you can have any Austin you desire so long as it’s Darcy Bussell.

Kim

Exactly, and nicely detailed, their practices bother me.

Shine,

You’re so right about different climates for different roses, but we in the West do have it so much better than the East and South. I’m much more OK with paying $100 for a giant 5 gal plant from Regan than $70 + shipping for a 1 gallon directly from DA. When you buy from Regan you’re supporting a wonderful local nursery that has managed to survive in a super high cost part of the country.

Sharifa Asma from Regan in 5 gal pot.

@susan9santabarbara If I stopped purchasing from any company where the top is led by greed, I'd like have very few options.....and a lot more money in my bank account hah.

@Diane Brakefield I got my Fred from Heirloom! It's own-root and took a bit to get going (as do all my own root roses) but it has quickly climbed the ranks in my garden and has earned its prime location. Golden Celebration has been such a fantastic, reliable bloomer for me and it was yours that inspired my purchase, so thank you!

@BenT (NorCal 9B Sunset 14), oh I totally agree re: this being a fantastic place to grow roses. My mom in Canada grows in zone 5b and I do not envy her at all. I also agree with your take on Regan's. I've purchased so many huge, healthy roses from them and would much rather support my local nurseries regardless of cost, plus chatting with Kim about roses whenever I'm there is a joy. From what I understand, the city jacked up their rent by a lot last year and they were forced to raise prices as a result. I was also lucky enough to snag a Sharifa from them last year and I love her so much. My real issue with them right now is the fact that my company just moved down there and I'm now working an 8 minute drive away. The last time I had a craptastic day at work, I somehow ended up there to treat myself. Some big win at work? Treat myself. Wednesday? Treat myself. And so on.

@SD Shine -Z10a Bay Area: Completely agree about the dilemma of buying from companies. And companies should charge what they want... the point of a business is to make money, and let the market decide.

When I started my insane rose career back in 1997, Austins were readily available at my local nursery that specializes in roses for the same price as others. As the years have gone on, the Austins gradually got more expensive than the others. Which is fine... they priced their products as they wished. I guess my issue with them started when they began removing their beloved classic roses after DA Sr. died. It was obviously a way to get people to buy their new (worse) offerings. The other thing that really bugged me was that they released a statement a couple of years ago that the reason they were deleting these beloved varieties was b/c of climate change and their concern about the environment. I call major P.R. bulls**t on that. Kim's comment about their practices with their growers didn't help my opinion. I will say, however, that I've been impressed that DA's bare root grafted roses via their website have been $30 with minimal shipping charges. I ordered a couple of them 3 years ago. They're definitely not grade #1 grafted bare roots, and have the most hideously long shanks ever, but they catch up.

Regan is one of the greatest ever, whether in person, or their former mail order. It's good to hear that they're still going, despite the rent hike. A couple of years ago, the city announced that they were going to build housing on the property, and they were going to be kicked out.

@Diane Brakefield, I just saw that All My Thyme has Fred on multiflora available for fall shipping! Here: https://allmythyme.com/shop/ols/products/frederic-mistral-mf