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paigect

input on patio design

20 years ago

I've been lurking and reading posts here for awhile, and I really value the professional and almost-professional opinions offered on this forum. I'm hoping some of you will help me out with some issues with respect to a patio I want to build in my front yard. I posted this on the Gardening With Stone forum, but got no response so far.

I know it's somewhat unusual to put a patio out front, but my backyard is tiny and secluded and not amenable to entertaining. We live in a close-knit neighborhood and we always end up in the front yard.

Here is a photo of my house from the sidewalk, to give you some context:

{{gwi:32752}}

The fenced in area in this picture is where the patio will go:

{{gwi:32753}}

Last weekend my son and I cleared out a bunch of roots from a large tree and several shrubs, and I put a truckload of topsoil in for these beds, and planted these shrubs and some lavendar:

{{gwi:32754}}

I want the rest of the fenced area to be a patio. I will put a planter or two on the side opposite the new bed.

I'll add these caveats: I will be using mostly found material because my budget is under $300. I'm a single mom with considerable DIY experience - - I installed my own kitchen with a little help from my dad, so I'm fairly handy. I will be doing all of the labor myself, with the possible help of a neighbor and my 11 y.o. ds. The $300 has to include the rock dust for the patio base, but I will get that at a good price because I have a friend in the business who will use his discount and deliver it for free, so I'm pretty sure I can get it for about $75. If I can use found materials for everything and max it out at $75, I can put the rest toward patio furniture.

I have enough rectangular bluestone in an unused area behind my garage to cover about 2/3 - 3/4 of the patio area. It's mostly 12x18". I was planning to bring this all up to the front yard and use it as the center of the patio. I also have one 18x36" piece and one 24x24" piece, which I thought I could use at the entrance. This will leave a border of approximately 18" to 24" most of the way around for which I will need to either buy more bluestone or use another material. I feel like I should use something else, since the stone I have is very weathered and the new stone will look too, well, new. Also, I think the bluestone will be too expensive.

A friend suggested that I take up the flagstone walk that is pictured above leading up to my front door and use those stones around the border. It is a pretty treacherous installation (done by the PO) and should probably come up anyway. But I'm not sure how much I like the idea of having a very regular bluestone center with a very irregular flagstone border. Any opinions on this?

I would love to find salvaged bricks or something like that at a good price, but I have researched sources and haven't come up with anything in Connecticut. I could wait and save more $$ and buy some concrete pavers, but I'm not sure I want concrete around the bluestone anyway. If I did do that, I don't think I could get away with "brick look" concrete pavers, since they would abut my clay brick front steps.

I would welcome any suggestions for another material to use, or any advice telling me I'm completely off base in my plan for any reason. I could still forget the whole thing and just level the area and thrown down some grass seed.

Have at it, I can take it! And thanks in advance.

Comments (17)

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    seems well thought out ..go for it!

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    A couple of questions...why is the picket fence located where it is now? And, how much of the property in front of the picket fence is truly yours and not easement etc.? The fence looks appropriate to the house and provides some sense of enclosure, but the area enclosed by the fence seems kind of skimpy and the placement seems arbitrary in relation to the location of the large tree in the foreground. All things being favorable, you might get the most bang for your buck by moving the fence to enclose an area that is more suitable in size and shape for the patio. Also, I'd make sure that the enclosed area is sufficient in size for not only the patio but a generous planting bed inside and outside the fence--the fence would then be a backbone for plantings that would add to the enclosed feel. You can start with an inexpensive patio made of crushed rock which could then be used as a base for your bluestone pavers or brick as the budget allows for improvement. A mixed media patio with both the bluestone and brick might suit your budget. Check out the frugal gardening forum--they have lots of ideas about finding free/inexpensive building materials.

    My amateur .02

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Paige,
    Freecycle can be a great source for used bricks or stone. If you are not already a member, find your local freecycle email group at freecycle.org.

    I have only been a member for about a year but I have gotten plants and other things, as well as had folks take away unwanted, but useful, items such as a bread maker, kitchen stools, books, and videos.

    It's FREE.

    Patty

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Be careful doing this, because it can get very expensive very quickly if you blow out the car suspension, but are they doing any road regrading near you? We live where stone grows wild, and often when they do the blasting to widen a road, they'll be a pile of split rock. The flagstone from the front walk may be better, but take a look around and see what is there. We run to poor quality bluestone. Further south there seems to be some slate.

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    millrace, thanks for the vote of confidence!

    sammie, the yard as pictured above is pretty much the whole thing. I was standing on the sidewalk when taking the picture. Thanks for the suggestion, but I wouldn't want to move the fence. I'm the only one on the whole street with a fence in the front yard, and the yards all run together (as do the kids). So if i moved the fence forward it would break up the feeling of neighborhood unity.

    There is room for a planting bed on the outside of the left side of the fence, and there are already some black-eyed susans there. I will likely expand the area at some point and plant more wildflowers. There are new peonies planted in front of the fence, and I will be adding a clematis I just purchased to the corner as well.

    Patty, thanks for the tip about freecycle. I had forgotten about them!

    mad gallica, my suspension is alread tired! I do have a friend with a truck, but I have been testing the limits of her generosity lately I'm afraid.

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    OK, so I checked freecycle and there is nothing available. I figure if I want to get this done over the weekend, I can either buy some brick or use the flagstone from the front walk. I'm leaning toward using the flagstone.

    I sketched it out on graph paper and it looks a little funny with a thin flagstone border all around. So now I'm thinking I will put the straight rectangular stone right up against the beds in a large rectangle shape, and mirror the beds on the opposite side with an "L" of the irregular flagstone all along the fence. I sketched that out and it looked great, sort of like I could have done it that way on purpose rather than running out of materials. And I will put planters of some kind over in that area to make if feel more garden-like - - maybe even plant herbs for cooking. What do you think?

    Of course, I will have to put something else in the walkway but I could just mulch it for this year.

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    You can run the flagstone through the bluestone as a path, or mix it randomly within the bluestone if you are amenable to having some gaps that you fill in with groundcover or pebbles. You can also stretch the material if you leave openings within the patio that are actual planting holes for bigger plants - but it limits use of the space more. And don't count out buying or finding more rectangular pieces in the future.

    I agree about adding concrete pavers to the mix with the steps - that's a no go.

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    karin, I love the idea of the path, but I should have told you what I will be using the space for. mea culpa. I will be putting a table that seats 4 comfortably and 6 in a pinch, with smallish chairs. I'll probably try to find something round and with a wrought iron look to it - - I think that will fit in well. I might store my fire bowl under the table, so when dinner is over we can just move the table and lounge around the fire. Thus my plan to use the flat stone in the center, so that the table and chairs will sit level. I do know this is a tiny space for dining, but we're used to that in our neighborhood. The houses are all small (+-1300 sq. ft.) and my dining room itself is only 9x9, so this will be even bigger!

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    I used a mix of old granite slabs, used brick, and new bluestone for my patio. Here's a picture to show how they look together. You could do something similar with brick. Note: They're uneven because the photo was taken during construction.

    {{gwi:28020}}

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    saypoint, that looks great. Thanks for posting it. I love the beds behind the patio, too.

    What did you use to build the patio up at the bottom of the picture?

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    That's a stone wall, and the patio area was filled with crushed stone under the sand base. Professional installation, not DIY.

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Hi Paige,

    Where do you live in CT? I'm in North Branford and will be replacing a 30 year old collapsing brick patio with natural stone. The bricks are in great shape, and I'm giving them away. A friend of mine has claimed a good amount, but there is more than enough to go around. I have about 900 square feet! The clincher is that you have to remove them. It doesn't seem like you'd need tons and since the patio is already falling apart, they shouldn't be too difficult to lift. If you're interested, contact me via email and we'll make arrangements for you to check them out.

    dccnm (from kitchens)

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    hi dccnm,
    Thanks so much for the offer! I'm in central CT. Branford is about an hour away. If it turns out to be too much of a hassle to move the stone I have, I will definitely get in touch with you via email. I'm starting the digging tomorrow, stone dust should be here in the afternoon. I'll keep you posted!

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    dccnm, I moved the stone up from my backyard and had just enough. Thanks so much for your offer. I'm not finished yet, and I'm going away next weekend, but hopefully I can finish the weekend after that and then I'll post a picture.

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Im a DIY gal also. Im on a budget too so Im doing mine out of 8x16 concrete stepping stones.

    Just a thought but how about using the flag stones to circle a firepit in the center of the patio. Forget about the single table and do seating around the fire pit with shared side tables. Like eating in the living room instead of in the dining room.LOL

    Im using old sewing machine bases with wood tops for my tables and wooden kitchen chairs painted wild colors. And some painted rocking chairs. I think "found" stuff has more character than the plastic stuff.

    Another idea would be to build some antique looking wooden benches and place them around by the fence. They could be used for extra seating or as buffets. Or people could place them around the fire pit for dining. I have some and I find lots of uses for mine. Right now the cats are lounging on them.

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Great job Paige--I'm happy it worked out that you did have enough materials. Can't wait to see it. I'm taking the easy way out and having it done for me. It's a pretty large area and since we live near a pond and there's a lot of wetland-type conditions in my backyard I don't want to take any chances that it's not done properly. At my old home I did a slate walkway over Memorial Day weekend once--must be the time for those projects!

  • 20 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Just posting an update, several months later. I finally finished my patio project and redid the flagstone front walkway while I was at it. I also planted a bed along the side of the patio with a Japanese Snowbell tree, a Limelight Hydrangea and a Mohawk Viburnum. Here are some pictures:

    {{gwi:32755}}

    {{gwi:32756}}

    As you can see, I am using my copper fire bowl as a table. A friend found the black marble table top on the side of the road on trash day. I will be replacing the plastic chairs with wrought iron when/if I can find some second hand.

    Here is a view of the walkway:
    {{gwi:32757}}

    Since taking the picture above I have also planted along the foundation to the right of the steps in a fashion to mirror the plantings in the patio bed. In other words, knockout roses and Chameacyparis pisifera 'Cream Ball', along with one Juniperus 'Gold Cone' at the end for height.

    Interesting anecdote: while digging the stones out of the walkway, I found that several were actually pieces of a grave stone from 1846. I did not reuse those stones and we are currently searching for the cemetery from which they were stolen.

    Thanks to all who posted their advice and encouragement.