Hi Larry.

I'm going to follow this discussion because I have a Liberty and I did a lousy job of pruning it and "it's an issue for me"- but I don't think you have major issues with your tree if you're happy with central leader pruning. What you've got so far is well on track to being what many people seek in apples. BUT:

Don (Jellyman) often makes good arguments for vase pruning, and if my Liberty were the size of yours I'd be looking to make it over that way. I am going to stick my neck out here (and I fully expect to be corrected, so don't hold back!) and say that you could cut the central leader above the branch at 36 inches. You'd have three good branches in your vase, and might get another candidate or two below after the pruning.

Larry, I'll be the first to admit I'm just feeling my way through things here and trying to get educated, so don't put too much stock in my suggestions. I'm just hanging around the water cooler seeing what I can learn. :-)

Good luck with your Liberty, and I hope you keep us informed as to your results.

:-)M

Larry:

It looks like your tree was already whacked once at knee height to try to force lateral branches. However, heavy pruning of a young tree delays bearing, and your M111 rootstock is already slow to bear.

I would continue to tie down the bottom two branches, and then in April take a knife and notch above every bud on the lower trunk to stimulate branch development. As they sprout keep the ones you want and rub off the rest.

If one branch becomes too vigorous tie it down to horizontal or past horizontal. The top whorl of branches has too many opposite one another, so you need to prune off a couple of them.

Applenut

Larry:

I would have to say your Liberty looks a little leggy, but no worse than some of my trees did after 2 years. I noticed the same thing as Applenut: Your tree appears to have been whacked at around 30 inches by somebody in the fairly recent past. Either that, or is it possible your tree is on M-111 with an M-9 interstem? That section looks very long for an interstem, but some trees on M-111 have been sold like that to provide dwarfing with good anchoring.

I agree with Applenut that you can induce branching by nicking above a bud, if you can find some that are well located on the main trunk. I have had about 60% success with this technique, and the time to do it is very early spring before the tree starts to bud out. As for the multiple vertical whorl at the top, the general rule I follow is to remove them all except for the weakest. Then you still have a central leader tree, but somewhat discourage its upward vigor.

Mark is correct that I have pruned many of my apple trees to a vase shape, but I did this only after they were close to maturity, using the central leader to support branch spreaders until I got a nice circle of scaffolds established. But if you are going to tie your branches down, you don't require a central leader for this reason, and you could start sooner if that is the shape you want. Certainly, tying down the branches or using spreaders is the right thing to do, but you need several more well-placed branches lower down on the trunk, and nicking above a bud is the best way I know to encourage them.

Once my trees had roughly the desired shape, I have had much better luck at inducing fruiting wood by pruning in late summer (August/September here) than during the dormant season. This also helps control vigor and discourages a lot of excessive waterspouts and busy internal growth. But your Liberty tree is not yet at that stage.

Don Yellman, Great Falls, VA

Thanks very much for the feedback on this. I _really_ appreciate it.

Yes, the tree was cut off at about 30". I think probably when I planted it in March 2005. But maybe in March 2006. I live close to Virginia Tech and in 2006 I had someone from there come out and show me how to do some pruning. I remember at that time that the tree had the two lower branches opposite each other, it was pretty ugly, and we wondered what to do with it. It's possible that there were two vertical branches and we cut off the _more_ vigorous of the two, and left the one you now see.

Regarding nicking or notching above the buds on the main trunk, I've never heard of doing this. I'd like to try it. How do you do this? What does it do to the tree to induce branches?

Thanks again for your help. I don't post much to this list because I'm still a newbie and learning, but I read it a lot and continually get good information.

Larry

Larry:

Take a sharp pocket knife, and cut out a narrow horizontal strip about 1/8 wide and maybe 3/4 inch long right through the living cambium layer and just above the bud you wish to stimulate. This traps nutrients and maybe hormones (I'm not so sure about this) rising from below in early spring and stimulates the bud to wake up.

Don Yellman, Great Falls, VA

I have decided to purchase a Liberty apple, as it seeems the most suitable for my location (Zone 8, sandy soil, 3 blocks from the ocean.) However, I would really appreciate seeing a photo of it..... can't seem to locate one in any of my books.

A few words about nicking and notching:
By "nicking" above a bud, you prevent the branching/shooting hormone produced at the growing tips from reaching the bud in question. Without the influence of this hormone, all buds will grow into branches. The hormone suppresses bud growth. It makes sense, when a branch tip is cut, no hormone is produced so buds below the tip will become branches. The hormone travels slowly down each branch from the tip and loses strength as it gets farther from the source, so braches will eventually form, but only some distance from the tip. The migration of this hormone thru the tree greatly influences its form.
"Notching" is cutting below a bud to suppress branching. This type of cut prevents hormone form continuing down past the bud and tends to concentrate at the bud, which suppress branching of that bud.
Your tree when it was headed back at about 30 inches formed a very strong replacement leader, which is OK for a central leader style tree. You have alot of energy devoted to that leader reaching for the sky. I would have spread that leader down closer to horizontal if I wanted a more vase-like shape, which is the way I personally do my apple trees.
I really don't like the legginess of this tree and I would attempt as suggested to get some branching going wherever you can. You could even lop off the top half of the tree if there are viable buds that you are confident will branch out. Even those long lower side branches look too gangly and I would consdier heading those way back to encourage branching lower down and get this tree to "bush up" a bit.
That's my two cents, your mileage may vary. Whatever you do, keep an eye on the results as experience will become your best advisor.