Let's go in order here. Most soil can be tested by a university that has a turfgrass program or your local extension service. Just do a google search for soil testing in your area and you will find it no problem. Kentucky Bluegrass (KBG) is a cool season grass, and Charlotte (I'm assuming North Carolina) is not an ideal location to be growing it. Not that it can't be done, it just isn't ideal for the heat there. You should see what KBG cultivars tested best in the NTEP trials in your climate (www.ntep.org). Keep in mind that KBG is a thirsty grass, and likes fertilizer. It is too late to seed now. The only thing I would recommend planting now to combat erosion and dust would be an annual rye grass. It will die off in a year, but it will provide a temporary ground cover until you can wait to seed in early fall when night temps are lower and the humidity is lower. Tall fescue isn't a bad idea, since it does well in the transition zone, is drought and shade tolerant, and requires less fertilizer. Some of the new cultivars are very dark green, and have a fine texture, but it is a bunch type grass, and won't spread. You can mix tall fescue and KBG, in which case the KBG will fill in bare spots. If you want a KBG/PR blend then again, look at what performs the best in your area on the NTEP website.

SBNC,

Some of Tiemco's information is wrong, here's what you need to do:

1.- Soil test (click on the link below)
2.- since you have irrigation, you can seed now; BUT, you must follow very strict instructions which I can provide if you decide?
3.- Stick with Kentucky Bluegrass and leave PRG out for now. You can grow PRG, but its long-term survival in your area in full sun might not be expected, unlike KBG.

NC State University has a research facility in here in Raleigh where they test Bluegrasses, your weather/summers might be more or less the same as here; so I expect your results to be the same. I know of 1 McDonals off of I-85 in Kings Mountain that was sodded a few years ago with Kentucky Bluegrass and it looks great. If you are 20 miles north of Charlotte (Huntersville maybe?) then that McDonals is about 40 miles or more south of you; however, they have irrigation.

Don't read too much on Kentucky Bluegrass being a waterhog, my experiences tells me that in our clay soils they are about even; however, some of my pictures can prove Bluegrass more drought tolerant than Fescue. But that is not a concern for you because you have irrigation.

No concern about heat, Charlotte has mild summers for the most part, with occacionals heat waves. The Kentucky Bluegrasses of today can handle anywhere from 60 to 90 days of 100 degree temperature as long as some rain/water is provided and with cooler nights between 65-70F.

One of the best performing varieties of Bluegrasses in the Raleigh area are:

1.- Emblem (very dark green color according to NTEP and excellent performance in Raleigh)
2.- Alexa II (Disease toleran, dark green and top rated in Raleigh)
3.- Ryth (quick establishment, dark green color, disease tolerant, heat tolerant)
4.- Bewitched (very disease tolerant and low growing.

You can order some of those from Simplot (mailorder) or www.turf-seed.com.

You can substitude any of the above 4 grasses with Midnight.

The Best of the Blues will work as well, but they are older varieties.

How large is the area you want to seed?

You should know that there are a few sod farms that carry Kentucly Bluegrass sod and order directly from them. If you are not working with a large area, sod might be your best bet.

Here's picture of my monostand Midnight II Bluegrass (NOT watered) next to my neighbor's Tall Fescue under drought conditions earlier this year:

{{gwi:101975}}

Here is a link that might be useful: Mecklenburg County Soil Testing

"Don't read too much on Kentucky Bluegrass being a waterhog, my experiences tells me that in our clay soils they are about even; however, some of my pictures can prove Bluegrass more drought tolerant than Fescue. But that is not a concern for you because you have irrigation. "

I think there's a misconception about water use for KBG and tall fescue.

Tall fescue will use from 70-90% of the water that KBG uses if conditions are right. The right conditions are a deep water table and soil that allows the fescue to develop roots to use the water.

If the soil is such that the fescue can't develop deep roots or there isn't water lower in the soil, tall fescue can use more water than KBG.

Another thing to consider is that in the right conditions, tall fescue will stay green longer than KBG, but once it does go dormant, it is less likely to recover from dormancy than KBG. And if there are patches that don't recover, KBG will self repair, but tall fescue will need to be reseeded.

BPgreen, your statement is right on, except Fescue will stay green longer than KBG.

You wrote: "Another thing to concider is that in the right conditions"

Please define "right conditions"

If the soil allows the fescue to develop deep roots and there is water deep in the soil, the fescue will develop deep roots and be able to use water that is farther below the surface. But if there is a layer of rock or hard soil that blocks the roots or the water or if the lawn is watered shallowly, the fescue won't have the deep roots it needs to stay green longer.

As an example of how this can work, last year, I stopped watering my lawn at the end of July and left the water off for the full month of August (very hot days). Most of the KBG went dormant, but much of the fescue was unfazed. If I had been watering shallowly, the fescue would have gone dormant as soon as the KBG or maybe even sooner.

Not sure if turfstar prg is any better at drought tolerance from what I read.

I personally don't like the look of PRG so I don't know why someone would mix it in with KBG. Only reason I can think of is because it germinates faster.

Earlier his spring I did some overseeding with Johnathan Green Sod Maker KBG. Took a while to germinate and I had a bare spot for unknown reasons. Since the weather is cool and there was a ton of rain in the forecast, I used a cultivator and threw down some seed in that spot about a week ago. Didn't water it but like I said had rain almost every day, and I already have shoots about 2" tall.

So hard to seed in the spring. Too early, soil isn't warm enough, too late and you're too close to summer.

Thanks to everyone who replied.
Auteck:
Is the NC State Research facility the same as the NTEP? Is it possible to go look at the different varieties there?

The area is about 8500 sq ft.

How do we make a decision between the four varieties you mentioned?
Is Raleigh in the same zone as Charlotte?

Thanks for all the help

SBNC,

You don't have to make a decision amongst the four varieties, you need all four - it is called a blend - it's used to fight off disease and compliment one another.

Yes, Raleigh is in the zone as Charlotte, zone 7.

Yes, NC State Reasearch facility is the one used for NTEP, Raleigh is NC1 on the reports.

Yes, it is possible to look at the different varieties, the problem is that you can't tell the names. I think is all coded, meaning, they only know what is what. I've been there several times, it is nice to see all the different types of grasses under research, Zoysia, Bermuda, Bentgrass, Bluegrass, Perennial Ryegrass, and Fescue of course.

The best time to go there is on the weekends because noone is there and you are free to walk around as you please; you can even take pictures.

Click on the link below and look at the report from NTEP, NC1 out performed all of the neighboring states, Kentucky included...

Here is a link that might be useful: Transition Zone KBG Report from NTEP

BP, you're spot on, however, in your climate seems like rain does not fall on a constant basis and therefore you can water your lawn deeply and at the right times. Of course, soil makeup can either stop or let the roots of the grass grow deeper and be more drought tolerant.

Unfortunatelly for us here in the East, we get plenty of rainfall, but doen't always fall at the 1 inch rate per week, like I asumme most places in the U.S. So as a result, most fescue lawns in here are anything but drought tolerant; specially if the soil is hard red clay.

Auteck,
Does the blend with the four varieties have a specific name, or do you ask to have the blend made from those four?

We went to both of the web sites and they appear to be only for the trade. Can non-trade people like us order from Simplot or www.turf-weed?

Thanks for the help

I made that blend up, you can call it the Auteck KBG Blend! lol...

You don't have to have those, you can easely go with the Best of the Blues, its got Midnight Star, Prosperity, and Moonlight - all great blends for our area.

You can order directly from Turf-Seed, you don't need to be a professional. I've never order from Simplot, but I have a very good friend that works there; I'm sure he can help you if I tell him.

Are you going to wait until August for seeding or are you going to do it now?

Thanks,
We'll ask them to name it for you!

We're going to go ahead and seed in the next two weeks. We know it's risky, but we have irrigation and we can't stand the dirt!

Once it starts to grow, we'll probably have many more questions!

Thanks again for all the help.

So you know, 1 pallet of Kentucky Bluegrass sod with coverage of 500 sf is $100.

If you're still going to seed, then make sure you get Siduron to prevent a weed explosion. You can find it at your local Lesco/John Deere dealer, or at HomeDepot in the form of Scotts Starter fertilizer WITH Siduron (expensive). The weed prevention barrier will only last you 30 days or less, so you need to re-apply.

Don't use any of the DNA-type fertilizers, like Halts, Dimension, Barricade, etc. They will prevent crabgrass from germinating as well as the Bluegrass seeds.

Set irrigation to go off everyday for 30 days max for at minimun of 3 times, 7 times will be preffered but only for 5 minutes each time.

Are you going to mailorder the 4-seed blend?

Auteck,
Does the sod come in the blend you described, or are there only certain varieties that come in sod. We have approx 8500 sf, so that would be around $1700 for sod. That might be worth it to have "instant" lawn.

Would we still have to use the Siduron with sod?

Do you know sources in our area for KGB sod?
What is the success of sod vs seeding this time of year?
With sod will we likely have to reseed in the fall?

We are grateful for all the information.

You're very welcome.

The "local" Bluegrass sod farm for us in Raleigh is 40 miles away toward the coast, the closest to you I think is in Morganton.

1.- Bellevue Manor Turf Farm
828/433-5071
Greg Craver
744 Bost Road
Morganton, NC 28655
bellvuemanorturf@bellsouth.net

2.- Slater Turf Farm
828/894-5113
800/737-TURF
Dave Slater
5554 Hunting Country Road
Tryon, NC 28782
slaterturf@slaterturf.com

3.- Turf Mountain Sod, Inc.
828/685-3642
888/685-3642
Fred Pittillo
3277 Chimney Rock Rd
Hendersonville, NC 28792
turfmountain@bellsouth.net
Bentgrass: L-93, Kentucky Bluegrass, Tall Fescue: Black Beauty

They all have their own custom blend, call them and ask them exactly what it is.

I will still apply a bag or 2 of Scotts Starter Fertilizer with SIDURON and water every day in the morning and mid-day to cool the turf. Avoid watering at night at all cost, always in the morning for about 10 to 15 minutes each time.

If you can afford the sod, that's the best and fastest way to do it; specially Kentucky Bluegrass (it take forever to get the seed to germinate and mature)

The biggest problems with seeding vs sod are the weeds and the amount of water you're going to use to keep the baby grasses alive during the heat of the day. Sod is mature grass, but the roots still need to grow which is difficult during the summer, but very possible with irrigation.

Don't put any pre-emergent prior to seeding or sodding, starter fertilizer with Siduron at 1 lb per 1,000 sf of actual nitrogen, and water, water, water...

Post emergent herbicides can be used after 30 days or so, then in September you can apply a soil pre-emergent to prevent POA Annua and other pesky weeds from germinating in your new sod.

Make sure you grade the soil properly and remove all construction debris and rocks, stones, etc, prio seeding or sod installation. Check your soil PH, now is the time to add if needed. It wouln't hurt to order a few cubic yards of screened topsoil and till it in with your existing soil. Compost will work as well.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Regards,

Auteck

You're very welcome.

The "local" Bluegrass sod farm for us in Raleigh is 40 miles away toward the coast, the closest to you I think is in Morganton.

1.- Bellevue Manor Turf Farm
828/433-5071
Greg Craver
744 Bost Road
Morganton, NC 28655
bellvuemanorturf@bellsouth.net

2.- Slater Turf Farm
828/894-5113
800/737-TURF
Dave Slater
5554 Hunting Country Road
Tryon, NC 28782
slaterturf@slaterturf.com

3.- Turf Mountain Sod, Inc.
828/685-3642
888/685-3642
Fred Pittillo
3277 Chimney Rock Rd
Hendersonville, NC 28792
turfmountain@bellsouth.net
Bentgrass: L-93, Kentucky Bluegrass, Tall Fescue: Black Beauty

They all have their own custom blend, call them and ask them exactly what it is.

I will still apply a bag or 2 of Scotts Starter Fertilizer with SIDURON and water every day in the morning and mid-day to cool the turf. Avoid watering at night at all cost, always in the morning for about 10 to 15 minutes each time.

If you can afford the sod, that's the best and fastest way to do it; specially Kentucky Bluegrass (it take forever to get the seed to germinate and mature)

The biggest problems with seeding vs sod are the weeds and the amount of water you're going to use to keep the baby grasses alive during the heat of the day. Sod is mature grass, but the roots still need to grow which is difficult during the summer, but very possible with irrigation.

Don't put any pre-emergent prior to seeding or sodding, starter fertilizer with Siduron at 1 lb per 1,000 sf of actual nitrogen, and water, water, water...

Post emergent herbicides can be used after 30 days or so, then in September you can apply a soil pre-emergent to prevent POA Annua and other pesky weeds from germinating in your new sod.

Make sure you grade the soil properly and remove all construction debris and rocks, stones, etc, prio seeding or sod installation. Check your soil PH, now is the time to add if needed. It wouln't hurt to order a few cubic yards of screened topsoil and till it in with your existing soil. Compost will work as well.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Regards,

Auteck

Hey Auteck, where is your "local" KBG sod farm? 40 miles towards the coast would put it about 30 miles away from me in Greenville. With sod as an option, I may go that route instead of seeding.

I like your screen name... You should talk to you Organicnoob some time...

Here's the info:

Perfect Turf, Inc.
252/795-5123
800/242-8873
Sammy Roebuck
1935 Rogerson Rd
Robersonville, NC 27871
sodfarm@aol.com
Blaze Kentucky Bluegrass Blend

Vandemark Farms, LLC in Nash County (about 40 from Raleigh) normally has Bluegrass sod, but not this year. They have Fescue/Bluegrass mix/blend right now.

Auteck,
We are getting ready to order the seed of the four variety blend (the Auteck Blend!) you suggested. Are there certain percentages of each we should order, or all equal percentages.

We'll keep you posted.

Thanks for your advice

Each variety should be 25% of the total amount to be applied. You have 8,500 sf, order enough seed for 10,000 sf, you always need to re-apply to compensate for rain runoff, birds, etc... at 4 pounds of seed per 1,000 sf. for new lawns.

I've been calling around to try find those varieties, but they've been very difficult locate. I ended up getting a 50 lb bag of Best of the Blues comprised of Midnight Star, Moonbean, Prosperity, and Moonlight - all good varieties rated well for our area.

Call around if you have the time, if you find them, you will have the best blend for your area.

Don't forget to take pictures before and after and keep track of what you applied and when.

Auteck,
Have been unable to find source for best of blues, or the other four you recommended (Auteck blend!)

Do you know anything about a blend that includes: It's called Bluegrass Supreme it's a product of Jacklin Seed by Simplot
34.65 % excursion Kentucky bluegrass
34.58 % award Kentucky bluegrass
29.44 % total eclipse Kentucky bluegrass
1.33 inert matter
noxious weeds: none found
This is a bagged mix that is available. Our landscaper wanted to make sure he had a mix he could find later in case we need to reseed.

Thanks for your opinion