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andrelaplume2

small engine repair iii...it started but....

17 years ago

I think I am in the home stretch here, thanks to everyone for the help.

http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/lmower/msg0923020724185.html?17

Ok, my 1996 Simplicity single stage snowthrower with a Tecumseh snow king HSK 600 engine has the top cowl off. I located the carb bowl. I was able to remove and clean it and the screw with the hole, I re-attached the bowl and it still would not start. I figured what the heck and dropped the bowl again and removed what I believe to be the float....or the copper donut as we unskilled non mechanics call it. To my horror, when I did so by pulling the pin in the hinge, I heard a clang and found this miniature plumb bob looking thing which is likeley what you refer to as the 'needle'....? Note its hard to see what I am doing because the back cowl is still on and the only way to get it off involves disassembling the auger area etc. and to me, I doubt my abilities to get all that back together. Anyway, using a handbook via alink in a prior post that showed a variety of carb pics, I located one that I think was similar to mine that showed this 'needle' hanging on the float going into a 'port'. I sprayed carb cleaner in this port and put everything back together...to be honest I am unsure if I had the needle right...I just sort of hung it on the float, stuck it in that port hole, held everything in place with my finger and put the bowl back on. It seams the only thing holding the needle in place is the fact its in the port.

I gave it a few pulls and the sucker started! It seamed rough at first and stalled. It started right back up though, I knocked the choke off and it ran....I saw this lever/arm on the engine moving itself open/closed or left/right as the engine revved. I put it under load in the grass to see if it would stall...which was the original problem. When I did that the engine actually seemed to run smoother and that little arm stopped moving so much. When I stopped the auger it started moving and revving again but it kept running. I have never seen an engine running or takennotice of the revving ...not sure if this all normal or not...never thought about it in the snow before. I put some goggles on and let it run and just watched it for 5 - 8 minutes.

Then........I noticed gas dripping from somewhere. I remmebered a gasket around the carb that I did not notice the last time I removed the carb bowl. I shut the engine. I again dropped the bowl and sure enough the gasket was mangled inside the bowl a bit. I took it off and carefully put around the area on the engine the carb bowl seats itself into...the engne was hot. I put the bowl on again. It started but stleed and stalled. I was out of gas! Iadded more gas and a shot of seafoam again and it started, it did not seam to run as well this time and stalled but restarted but is still leaking gas. To be honest I really did not want to run it since it was dripping. I shut it tried to determine where the leak was coming from...I am figuring the bowl but can not be sure.

So.....do you thing its the gasket? Could I have inserted the needle wrong and thats letting the gas leak...other suggestions?

I never felt so proud as for those 8 minutes where it seemed to be working...I feared I messed it up by opening it back up...

THANKS!

Comments (13)

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    It sounds like you got the carburetor assembled correctly. The engine runs more smoothly under load, than it does while idling. This is not unusual with small engines. Our snowblower, also with a Tecumseh engine, runs better while it is working, not idling. You might have to buy some gasket paper and cut a new gasket. Also, you can pick up some gasket sealer while you are at the parts store. I have no idea where the gas leak is coming from.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    You would need the proper rubber bowl seal. There is also a gasket around the bowl nut. If it was leaking out the upper bowl seal area, you may as well put in the needle and seat as well. If perchance the float has the feel and sound of liquid in it when shaken- that needs replacement. Also, the needle wire hooks through the tab on the float pointing to the choke side of the carb. When you test it for power, lay the auger into the blacktop to put a load on it. Go get 'em...

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    ok, so can I just buy a new bowl gasket? It does not sound like the needle could have anything to do with the leak right? I do not recall a gasket by the screw that holds the carb bowl in place...maybe I lost that one...I hope I can find these parts!

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Yes, you can buy them individually. The new needle and seat sets come with both gaskets as well. If you are saying that fuel is leaking out the top of the bowl area, then you need a new valve or float.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    what is a valve? I am thinking there is no gasket on the screw...perhaps I lost it.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    From your description, I'm thinking that the upper rubber seal is damaged and fuel was coming from there? Or is it more likely it was dripping out the bottom? If it is coming out the top, that would indicate to me the float valve (silver needle) is allowing fuel to continue coming into the carb and overflowing. If it is just dripping out the bottom, then maybe the little gasket missing is the culprit. Sometimes they choose to stick to the bottom of the bowl. 631021B is the kit part # for the 2 seals and needle/ seat kit complete.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    thanks. As far as needle installation, I simply hung it on the float with the long end poitning towards the choke level. I held it in place with my finger...so far as I know it does not snap into place on the float...does this sound right? It sort of hung 90 degrees perpendiculart to the float which aligned it with the port. I held it to the float, slid it into that port alingned the holes on the hing and slid the pin back thru securing the float. Physically speaking, I do not see how that little needle in the larger hole would stop the gas from coming through. All I know is if I stand the sucker up so that the gas tank is higher than the carb, it starts to drip. I will look for that kit and maybe a better picture of how to install that needle.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Re: the replacement parts....

    http://www.mfgsupply.com/m/c/22-12263.html?mv_pc=Froogle

    Well.... I do NOT have the little tiny thick washer or the medium size one. Where do they go...this may be part of my problem!

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    In trying to look at some pics it looks like perhaps there should be a tiny gasket (the seat?) that should be stuck on the tip of the needle before reinserting it? Or pushed into that hole before inserting the needle? I do not seam to have this piece unless, maybe it flew off when I removed the needle or got blown away when I shot carb cleaner in there or is stuck in the hole and not alinging with the needle. Looking at the parts in the prior posts for the needle kit...whats the propper order to rebuild this thing.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    To install the seat, you will likely have to remove the carb. You could try installing the seals and new needle and make it easy on yourself.BTW, I would suggest the OEM Tecumseh parts. It appears the link goes to an aftermarket. Any Tecumseh dealer should have them plus no need to pony up for shipping. Proper order: W/ seat install- you will have to either blow the seat out of the hole via the fuel fitting or dig it out. The new seat goes up into the carb with the ring up. It fits tight. You can use the back end of a drill bit if it is smooth. Hook the needle wire under the tab pointed out as you did before and install the float and pin. Check the float level as shown in the manual. Remember they are doing it with the carb off. Slide the new upper bowl seal on, the lower seal over the cleaned nut and away you go. I'm sure this is in the manual as well for something as a reference.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    thanks, I am stopping my local guy to get the parts in the morning. So basically I need to make sre the seat is out and then push the new one in. I am guessing it was blown out when I did the carb cleaner and perhaps its missing and thats why the gas is leaking....not sure. Was there a gasket with the screw? So does that needle go up into the seat or does it move freely...I am learning a lot....would be much easier if I could get the back cowl off an see what I am doing!

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    I got the OEM parts...hoep t try this tonight or tommorow. Now that I see the seat (?-tiny little white gasket that goes in before the needle) I seem to recall seeing it somewhere before....it likely flew out.

    Question, it says to push the seat in with a flat drill bit or the like. How far do I push it in though? Also, there is one gasket, the size of a dime...where is that for?

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    It will hit bottom easily- you will know. The dime sized gasket goes over the bowl nut before you thread it on.