Even dried manure should be composted before it is put into the garden, unless it will be 6 months before you plant food there.

Does that mean the practice of steeping garden water in manure to get liquid feed is also dangerous and that this manure also needs to be composted first?

Yes it is. I realize they have been doing exactly that in agriculture for 100,000 years but it is just that type of practice that leads to the E.coli infections we occasionally read about.

Are you talking about animal manure? My question is not about e.coli infection but as to whether neat animal manure that has soaked in a barrel of water can be used as a liquid feed without damaging the vegetables themselves.
But if it does damage them is it better to steep well decomposed manure?
And is it OK to steep nettles in a barrel of water for liquid feed and must it also be given a certain length of time to decompose in the water before using it?

(That e.coli risk is completely new to me.
I take it that if you wash your vegetables the risk would be small and would apply especially to salad vegetables? And the risk would be even less if you avoided getting the liquid feed on the leaves or the fruit? )

FDA Finalizes Report on 2006 Spinach Outbreak

The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) and California's Department of Health Services (CDHS) today released a joint report on an extensive investigation into the causes of an E.coli O157:H7 outbreak last fall that was associated with contaminated Dole brand Baby Spinach and resulted in 205 confirmed illnesses and three deaths. The inquiry was conducted by the California Food Emergency Response Team (CalFERT), a team of experts from FDA's district office in San Francisco and CDHS. They were assisted by experts from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service of the U.S. Department of Agriculture.

The investigators successfully identified the environmental risk factors and the areas that were most likely involved in the outbreak, but they were unable to definitely determine how the contamination originated.

"The probe was a notable effort by federal, state and local officials," said Robert E. Brackett, Ph.D., director of FDA's Center for Food Safety and Applied Nutrition. "It yielded valuable information we can use to determine how best to reduce the likelihood of similar outbreaks."

The report describes the painstaking detective work of the investigators following the first reports from CDC in September 2006 of an apparent outbreak of E.coli O157:H7 linked to the consumption of bagged spinach. The probe initially focused on the processing and packaging plant of Natural Selection Foods, LLC in San Juan Bautista, CA, where the contaminated products had been processed.

The next focus of the inquiry was the source of the spinach in 13 bags containing E.coli O157:H7 isolates that had been collected nationwide from sick customers. Using the product codes on the bags, and employing DNA fingerprinting on the bacteria from the bags, the investigators were able to match environmental samples of E.coli O157:H7 from one field to the strain that had caused the outbreak. Potential environmental risk factors for E.coli O157:H7 contamination at or near the field included the presence of wild pigs, the proximity of irrigation wells used to grow produce for ready-to-eat packaging, and surface waterways exposed to feces from cattle and wildlife.

Because the contamination occurred before the start of the investigation, and because of the many ways that E.coli O157:H7 can be transferred -- including animals, humans, and water -- the precise means by which the bacteria spread to the spinach remain unknown.

FDA continues to work closely with its federal, state and local partners to keep produce safe from bacterial contamination. In August 2006, the agency announced an initiative called "Leafy Greens" that focuses attention on the produce, contamination agents, and other areas of potential public health concern associated with such products. Recently, FDA recently issued a draft final guidance, "Guide to Minimize Microbial Food Safety Hazards of Fresh-cut Fruits and Vegetables", which recommends measures to prevent microbial contamination during the processing of fresh-cut produce.

Earlier this week the agency explored issues involved in the safety of fresh produce in a public hearing held in California, and it plans to hold a similar hearing on April 13, 2007 in Maryland. The goal of both events is to solicit and share information about the recent outbreaks, the involved and associated risk factors, and measures the agency could adopt to advance the safety of fresh produce.

Although washing produce would not have prevented the recent E-coli outbreak involving spinach, washing can reduce the risk of contamination from some other causes. FDA advises consumers that all produce should be thoroughly washed before eating.

The report on the probe of the Dole spinach contamination, titled: Investigation of an Escherichia coli O157:H7 Outbreak Associated with Dole Pre-Packaged Spinach, is posted at http://www.DHS.ca.gov.

Actually, the washing step in the packing plant spread the E. coli around more, and it doesn't easily come off of infected leaves.

It does help to be careful when watering, but you have to remember about splashing hazard.

Ya, I heard about the pig-poop hypothesis. I shot a pig out in central CA a few years ago. messy, nasty critter- but she was extra delicious in chili (well cooked).

As far as I know you can steep fresh manure in water and use the tea without much risk of 'burning' the plants.

I am not addressing the e coli thing at all, just the fertilizer aspect.

Seeping anything in water and removing the solids before use will result in water, nutrients that have dissolved in water (a minority of them in most cases) and various critters working on the organic matter that were caught swimming being applied.

If it's in the water then it's water soluble and will take effect rapidly and likely be gone rapidly as it leeches down the soil column.

The outbeak of e coli on Spinach was not such a big story over here in Ireland.
Reading through the article above it seems that animal contamination is the chief suspect.
That surprises me as I might have thought there could have been raw sewage in the water supply!
That happy event has just occured in Scotland (the Firth of Forth)and here in County Galway in Ireland the drinking water is similarly polluted at present.

The E-Coli pathogens, along with many others, are present in all mammal manure. Due care in handling of any mammal manure and composting that manure before applying to the garden is simply common sense.

It is my understanding that the various forms of E. coli. bacteria are one of the more common gut and ground bacteria around - almost all animals, including humans, have them, and therefor almost all waste water would as well. The problems arise with toxins produced by only a few, mostly mutated, forms of the bacteria, such as the one in the recent scare. To my knowledge, so far, that one has been found mostly in cattle and pigs, and mostly in confined/crowded environments, such as feed lots. That doesn't say it can't or won't exist elsewhere, only that that's where you are most likely to encounter it.

Meat that is contaminated with that particular type is usually done so during the slaughtering/butchering/cutting up process, when manure accidently gets splashed onto the meat. Vegetables are usually contaminated by manure contamination of irrigation water, and from splash occuring there. These aren't the only possible means of contamination, but I believe they are the most likely.

E. coli. contamination in and of itself means little, it's only the varieties that form harmful toxins that are dangerous. That's not to say that you can ignore it and all the other bacteria out there, but it does mean that due care is usually enough care, and rampant paranoia is usually excessive. If I am mistaken, please correct me.

Burning of plants is mostly a question of dosage. Just like with strong chemical fertilizers. A little works, but too much kills. Composted manure is more slow release and less likely to burn.
E. coli is another issue. The 0157H7 strain is normally found in cattle. Washing works, but spinach is very hard to effectively wash - especially during mechanical processing. A smooth solid vegetable that is easier to clean is less risky. The E. coli scare is WAY overblown, but the list of bad things you can get from manure and sewage is long and ranges from worms and parasites to hepatitis and giardia. Always wash your food. Birds and bugs are pooping on it even if you don't use manure.

Ziggy

One of the arguements for turning manure under or mulching over it in the garden in the fall is that many vegetables will not need fertilizer of any sort the next year. Ecoli etc are greatly diminished in the process. Mulch further reduces splashing of disease from the soil onto plants (along with all the other incredible benefits that it bestows).

Many of the ecoli problems in the public are symptoms of how our food is processed. Cows fed hay for the last few days of their lives effectively flush much of the offending ecoli from their systems but that costs more than the factory farms can afford with their slm profit margins. Contamination is spread throughout processing machinery- both listeria and ecoli. Wild animals can get into your backyard garden- but think about the numbers in giant veggie fields that are not as intensively managed. That's not even getting into runoff from overuse or careless use of manure or chem fertilizers.

So in addition to watching out for burning plants- using manures early, wisely, washing veggies, etc can make them a valuable amendment. Later in the season- using manure will also cause issues with flowering of vegetable plants. Either compost it (usual recommendation) or use it early as a slow release fertilizer.

A plumber once told me that thanks to his trade, man's life span has lengthened in direct proportion to the progress made in developing two water systems - potable and waste. There seems to be much truth in that. Now, although each system appears to be contained and separate, here and there, 'cross-connections' do occur in unexpected ways and places. We must be on guard.