I don't like stuff I have to throw away the first time it has a problem.

Just remember what Mrs. Barnum said as she filled the baby's bottle!
In case you don't know: "There's a sucker born every minute!"
Of course, she learned that from her husband, old P.T.!

The way i look at it--if we don't buy that Chinese-made junk, maybe they'll make stuff here in the USA again!

"I've heard the phrase "you get what you pay for!".
But I'm considering the purchase of a new $250.00 mini bike from Quality Farm & Fleet. Just something to putz around the yard with (3 acres) and for my little son to ride as he gets a little older. "

RB> I can't see how you can go wrong at $250.00

"My question: Does anyone have any experience with these little Chinese made 4 stroke motors? I do maintain my equipment pretty well and would hope to get at least 4 or 5 seasons out of it, at which point I could re-power it with a newer B&S or Honda, etc. The frame looks nice, the welds look pretty clean, it has a cable operated disk brake. I think the value is there at $250.00 if I can get 4 - 5 years from that motor then replace it. "

RB> I'm guessing there is more than one manufacturer of four stroke motors in China so you might get a meaningful response by posting the makers name.

I'd like to hear any of your thoughts on this.

RB> I'm not surprised that the overall build quality looks good on that mini bike. The chinese have shown they are capable of producing good quality consumer goods. If it looks good I would give it a try.

Name some good quality chinese made goods------------
go ahead---i'm waiting-----

rustyj14, You're fooling yourself. Many excellent products are made in China. A lot of cheap stuff comes from there too. The country of origin has little to do with quality. I for one do not want to go back to the days when many tools and items like the mini-bike mentioned above were priced so high a normal person couldn't afford one.
You want an example of a great product made in china? Here's one. There are many others too. Porter Cable Lithium Ion Drill. Link below

Here is a link that might be useful: Porter cable

I agree with the last post. 1/2 of the stuff in my house / shop appears to have come from China, whether I approve or not.

The original question still remains:
Does anyone have any real world experience with these little Chinese made 4 stroke motors?!?

Jim R (original poster)

In reality it is not important where something is made, but what standards, specifications, materials (etc) it is made too. Having said that; there was a time, say the 60's back, when 'Made in America'was a very proud statement to have on a manufactured product. Generally respected around the world as almost a gurantee of superior quality.

The real horror is we continue to lose our manufacturing capability, in no small part to our trade policies. For limited access to their markets they get unlimited access to ours.

We are a nation in debt, pushing financial paper around and consuming things made elswhere many of which we do not need.

Well, i may be fooling myself, but go ask the folks who used to be employed by Porter-Cable how they are making ends meet, since the company they worked for started having the chinese make their tools, which put the American worker out on the street-so to say!
there's a big argument for the chinese and other off-shore companies makin goods to sell here in the USofA, in that it has given the unions some pause. Everything i have read and heard about Chinese made products has been bad, so, i'm not buying any of it! Most of my tools have been made in the USA, except for several sets of sockets, made in Korea, or Taiwan. Those were bought back when the USA went to metric tools and bolts, and measurements. But, they still are in good condition, and i use them whenever i need them.
Way back, when i was a child, the USA bought toys made in Japan. They were the most crude things i had ever seen, and were soon labeled as junk. But, as soon as the Japanese had re-educated us into buying stuff from them again, after WW II, they saw the light and improved their mfg processes, and look where we are today!

rusty you live in dream world or at least you talk like you do. I doubt that you are actually not going to buy anything made in China. Sounds good to say though....As far as Porter Cable goes..I bought a drill and circular saw from them for $350 a few years ago. There owners saw the hand writing on the wall and got there stuff made in China. Funny thing...that's how free enterprise works. Either compete or be put out of business. If government steps in to control all this then you simply end up like the old Soviet Union with state controlled goods and income. I understand that you are pro USA. Me too. But don't tell me you don't buy from china. If you really don't you probably don't have any clothes, tools, or anything else either. If Porter Cable or any of the good old USA companies put a product out on the market that's competitively priced and made in USA I'll be the first in line to buy it. That's how our economy works. There's no way around it.

Well, i reckon, if you had been working at a job, with any of the companies that have closed their US plants, and run off to China, Mexico, or anywhere else, and laid off all of their workers---just what would you have done?? Where would you have been able to make the same pay as you had gotten used to living on? --as a counter person at McDonalds, or a dish washer at some restaurant? I don't think so. And, you could have sat looking out yer front window as the repo man hauled away the nice Sport Utility that you couldn't keep up the payments on. Your union couldn't keep the company in town, and it couldn't keep your payments up on yer car, house, whatever!
Hershey candy Company, in Hershey, Pa. sold off its plants in the USA, and moved most everything to Mexico--leaving a ton of faithful workers holding the bag! If you think that was the right thing to do--wait until your job takes wings and flies the coop-so to say! (By the way---how are your stocks doing???HMMM??) Do i buy Hershey candy now?? Guess!!

You make a good point and nobody is arguing that. Labor problems have been at the root of the US economy from the beginning. The slave owners didn't want to lose the edge they had but they did. Sweat shops gave way to powerful unions and unions proved that they are not the perfect answer either. Now with giant trade deficits to other countries like China and so forth we once again have the dilemma you pointed out. As an individual I have day to day decisions to make. I will gladly buy US built things if possible. No problem there. In reality these problems are on a massive scale and as an individual I feel as though I'm just along for the ride. If government changes import laws then so be it. We can only vote to help change happen. It is disheartening to see all this happening though and one wonders what to do. One person boycotting Chinese products isn't the answer. Time will tell. I wonder what the next administration will bring?

I can't remember just where the toy company--Ertl--was located, i think in Indiana or Illinois. They made nice affordable replica toys, such as farm tractors, cars, trucks, and others, and a lot of collectible toys, for many years.
Then one day, as i, being a collector, of sorts, was looking at one, and there it was---made in China!
Back on the shelf! I told the man i didn't want anything that had put all of those American workers out of jobs! And left the store! I haven't bought anything since, unless i got it at a flea market. And it was made in the U.S.of A.
No, as far as i know, i have nothing in my house made in China, except the tools i mentioned before, but they were made in free China (Korea or Taiwan--not sure which it was.)

Back to the OP's question....

I got one for my son for Christmas last year -- It's run flawlessly -- I do the normal stuff I do with my other small engines, you know, I add sea foam to the gas can that I use to fill my mowers & his mini bike...etc

I'll link a video of it I put up on youtube....

Dan

Here is a link that might be useful: Doodlebug Minibike

THANK YOU okcdan! Someone actually answered my question! I appreciate that.

It looks like good cheap fun.

I use the excuse that it's for my son, but really it's for me. He's still a year or two away from riding.

Thanks again.

Jim R

Did you ever get a name for that engine. What is it or if no spec sheet can you get any numbers off the engine.
There are scads of engine makers and the quality as expected is all over the place. They can and do make fantastic engine. The Chinese use mini-bikes for daily transportation and the motors simple and quality. They make many motorcycles and the standard size is 125cc. The better makes of motorcycles are inexpensive $400 US and last forever. China has a zillion motorcycle taxi's and it's pretty easy to tell which motorcycles are for the price break the best.
There are a number of makers there who are making Honda clones legally in partnership with Honda. The parts are interchangable. One of the best makers is LiFan. Their engines are on many produces there and Harbor Freight is carrying a line of their OHV's branded Central Machinery. I've put a couple on snowblowers.
HF generally does not sell the best quality so exactly what level product they have gotten from Lifan is unknown. Go Karters here in the US have class races for these engines and the reports on them are excellent.
David

Thank you David.

The engine says "Hensim".

The manufacturer is listed as "Chongqing Hensim Group Co. Ltd."

2.8HP, 97cc.

Any info would be appreciated!

Jim R

Whether they are built right or not, the problem with Chinese made small engines is there is no major parts distribution set up in the USA for repairing them.

At least this is what the owner of my local small engine shop complains about. He'd be more than willing to try and fix this stuff when it comes in, but he just can't get parts quickly and easily.

Doug

Jim,
I don't know Hensim specifically. They are a decent size player in China's massive motorcycle city Chongqing auto belt, Chongqing (I think it's China's largest city). They as almost all Chinese makers do not have supply chains established here. It's silly to think they would. Generally they stock at warehouses in big US cities and source from there (B&S and Tecumseh do the same).
If you're only looking to get 5-6 years out of the motor then it's not so much of a chance. The motor will probably have a gaurentee and parts available by UPS. That would be about the same if you bought an American made mini-bike from ABC in Michigan and needed a head gasket or piston. You arn't going to get that from your local dealer. Most of the time when I need a B&S or Toro part I have to order it from my dealer out of a centeral warehouse of order on line from another warehouse.
You should ask about the parts source though and what you have to do to get parts. The engines I buy are Honda design engines and made with a contract with Honda. Parts are interchangable with the GX series so no problem i.e. I can get them through a dealer in a few days or possibly he may have on hand stock for the common parts. So far I have not had to get any parts.
The chances are pretty high that in 5-6 years you won't need any parts if you keep up maintenance. There are sum that will say it's a tin-foil engine and will fall apart shortly needing parts & etc. Checkout the motor and bike quailty (as you noted the welds), ask about the guarentee and parts source. Call the distributor or ask how it's done. I did that for my motors with Harbor Freight.
Hensim seems to make many motorcycles, mini-bikes and ATV's. Their motor may be a partnership motor with Yamaha or someother better known maker and have interchangable parts. If no check the chain.
I would not be too worried about it if the store is part of a big chain or the mini-bikes sold in other places. It is possible to go to the economic zones in China and buy limited quantities of something and import them. A small dealer may go there and buy 20 mini-bikes and not have a decent supply source - stay away from those. Do a little homework to be on the safe side in the unlikely event the motor needs a head gasket or carb maifold.
David

This "DoodleBug" mini bike that is distributed by Farm/Fleet & Pep Boys (among others) is one bike in a lineup of many, produced by Baja Motorsports -- Take a look at the link I'm providing below & you'll see that you can order parts such as bearings, carbs, chains, ignition coils, brakes, etc etc....

I wouldn't worry too much about not being able to get parts...

My 2 cents..

Dan

Here is a link that might be useful: Baja Motorsports

I would still be leary about spares;I bet some are hard to get.........I try not to buy made in china also,small stuff is not too bad,but anything over $100 I go out of my way to try and get US made..........but that's getting harder and harder to do.....

I would still be leary about spares;I bet some are hard to get

Hmmm... the link above shows em in the warehouse in Arizona....

I don't know bout the 4-strokes, but i've had a couple 2- strokes come my way (40 & 51 cc)...hi & lo speed jets, easy chain-adjust,etc. decent anyway. Both had carb problems (cruded up)& neither had ANYTHING stamped in ENGLISH. Made gaskets outta cereal box carton,soaked in kerosene overnite...leaned out & they scream. Little Marvel added every tank full & no problems since.BTW i could get no info on parts or schematics at the time anywhere.

Will this thread ever die?

from the original poster:

This thread can't die yet.

We are still snowed in in West Michigan and it'll still be a month or two until i get the mini bike. At which point I will ride and review for the forum.

To be continued...... : )

Cool. I hope it works good for you. The key to machines like the Doodle-Bug is to make sure the cables are routed properly, adjusted right, and everything else is kept tight and lubricated. Even USA built mini bikes were maintenance intensive if you wanted them to last. Keep us posted.

I stumbled upon this review of a similar product made by Baja Motorsports

Here is a link that might be useful: Baja Scooter

People roll into my shop almost every day with a super looking, shiny Chinese made scooter that most often is just weeks old if that. When I ask about warranty or possibly some support from the seller I hear pretty much the same story...he's no help, doesn't seem interested or they only sell them and some far away mystery outfit is supposed to take care of the problem. I completely stopped taking this stuff in even though the engines at a glance look like standard fair. What I have found is the starter recoil units are so poorly made they could never work for long. Valve train parts are complete joke though some do interchange with the engine they stole the design from. Dive into a carb and the main jet will twist off with the slightest turn of a screwdriver. At that point I have broken the mans part and look toward MAKING a jet to get me out of this mess. I could go on and on but there is little need. Don't try to get your 250.00 worth out of this machine. Your chances are so slim its unbelievable. Do I have any ideas for you to get 800.00 worth of good for 250.00....of course not.

mike merritt

MMMHHHMMM! And now, since the bottom has fallen out of everything good and true, and China is having problems, and Ceasar is having problems, and everybody is just waiting for us to get it back in operation, has anybody learned anything?? The main question has been answered!
What question?? How much of this country's manufacturing can be exported, before the bottom drops out?
I only hope the Govment doesn't run out of the paper they use to print money! We'll all be in deep doo!
If a whole bunch of folks aren't working and paying taxes, how long can things go along as it has? And, i sincerely hope your foreign cars and tractors, and other stuff made off-shore, doesn't break! OOOPS! Let me rephrase that--If it breaks, maybe i'll be able to fix it--maybe not!
Cheers: Rusty Jones

"How much of this country's manufacturing can be exported, before the bottom drops out?...And, i sincerely hope your foreign cars and tractors, and other stuff made off-shore, doesn't break!"

There is one reason and one reason alone that the manufacturing of cars, mowers, clothing, shoes, etc., etc., continues to be shifted overseas. The reason is that we like to buy as cheaply as possible. We buy our goods in great droves from Walmart, Home Depot, Target, Kmart and over the web after shopping for the lowest possible price. Retailers are only too glad to oblige by continually leaning on their suppliers for ever lower prices.

We are collectively driving the shift of manufacturing oveseas by our purchasing habits. If enough of us would decide to buy more expensive and possibly lower quality goods from the USA then the tide could be turned around. So who is ready to pay more for their consumer goods in order to move manufacturing back to the USA?

As Pogo said, we have met the enemy and he is us.

Well said roadbike! The retailers are giving us exactly what we are asking for......mike

"So who is ready to pay more for their consumer goods in order to move manufacturing back to the USA?"

Today I was at Home Depot to get a cutter/crimper for coax cable. I bought the slightly more expensive US made tool.

I quite often spend a little more for the US products. The other day at Autozone, I passed on the Chinese brake pads even though they were lifetime warranty and moved up a step and bought the American made ones. They also had a lifetime warranty.

look at this link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LgDkts8_8E