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sailorbarsoom

Another newbie, knows nothing about soil prep.

19 years ago

I have looked through the forum, but I can't find a topic like my situation:

I want to plant a salsa garden in the large, sunny corner of my backyard. This corner has been largely untouched for the last ten+ years. It is covered with weeds, grassy stuff, and some crunched up leaves that I dumped there last fall. The only testament to my gardening skills is the fact I have managed to keep a jade plant alive for the last year.

I see that a lot of people here think tilling is Bad, but I'm pretty sure I'm going to have to turn that soil over- it's pretty hard packed. I'm looking for the least time-consuming and easiest way to prep that area (of course!), and I'm not expecting my first foray into gardening to be a huge success. But some tomatoes, garlic, peppers, and onions would be lovely.

So, should I just throw some compost on that spot and till it? Should I do something to kill the weeds first? Am I supposed to remove the top layer of soil and then till it? I'm sure you all get tired of answering these questions, but any advice (or warnings) would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Jenn

Comments (10)

  • 19 years ago

    We talk about this all the time, so maybe you just aren't familiar with the term lasagna gardening. Lots of people have crappy soil. If you want to till, till. That won't kill most of the weeds, though, just get rid of some and divide some, although it might fluff your soil up a little. If you want to save time and effort and get excellent dirt, just build a lasagna garden on top of your crunched up leaves. Or maybe rake the leaves off, build the lasagna bed and have them as one of the layers. Just read all the threads here with Raised Bed or Lasagna in the title. You get the best darn dirt in the world and with little effort. Tilling for small scale gardens is becoming a bit passe. You can till if you want, but generally no need to. Over time the worms and bugs and roots mix the soil under and over the cardboard/newspaper layer and you get one happy soil.

    Marcia

  • 19 years ago

    Hi Jenn,

    Lasagna is the easiest way to get a garden going that I know of, and it is super productive. Below is a link to a thread one of our members submitted that you may enjoy. Best wishes in your adventure, and have fun...

    Blutranes

    Here is a link that might be useful: The First Book of the Lasagna Bed

  • 19 years ago

    Since you are in California the type of soil your have will determine whether tilling is something that is needed or not. Start your new garden by contacting your local office of the Universtity of California USDA Cooperative Extension Service about a soil test. The do not do them but will know where to have that done. While that is going on dig in with these simple soil tests;

    1. Structure. From that soil sample put enough of the rest to make a 4 inch level in a clear 1 quart jar, with a tight fitting lid. Fill that jar with water and replace the lid, tightly. Shake the jar vigorously and then let it stand for 24 hours. Your soil will settle out according to soil particle size and weight. A good loam will have about 1-3/4 inch (about 45%) of sand on the bottom. about 1 inch (about 25%) of silt next, about 1 inch (25%) of clay above that, and about 1/4 inch (about 5%) of organic matter on the top.

    2) Drainage. Dig a hole 1 foot square and 1 foot deep and fill that with water. After that water drains away refill the hole with more water and time how long it takes that to drain away. Anything less than 2 hours and your soil drains too quickly and needs more organic matter to slow that drainage down. Anything over 6 hours and the soil drains too slowly and needs lots of organic matter to speed it up.

    3) Tilth. Take a handful of your slightly damp soil and squeeze it tightly. When the pressure is released the soil should hold together in that clump, but when poked with a finger that clump should fall apart.

    4) Smell. What does your soil smell like? A pleasant, rich earthy odor? Putrid, offensive, repugnant odor? The more organic matter in your soil the more active the soil bacteria will be and the nicer you soil will smell.

    5) Life. How many earthworms per shovel full were there? 5 or more indicates a pretty healthy soil. Fewer than 5, according to the Natural Resources Conservation Service, indicates a soil that is not healthy.

    which will help you understand what you do have and what needs be done to make that soil into something that will grow strong, healthy plants.

    Here is a link that might be useful: UC CES

  • 19 years ago

    Thank guys. Sorry to bug you with such an oft-asked question, I just couldn't find what I was looking for. Don't ask what I thought all those "Lasagna Garden" posts were talking about! I will definitely be lasagna-ing.
    -Jenn

  • 19 years ago

    Bluetranes, what a great link. :)

  • 19 years ago

    Jenn: You mentioned that the area to be "lasagnaed" is covered with weeds and grassy stuff. If will help the process if you first run a lawnmower or weedwacker over that stuff and cut very short. It's OK to leave it there then as it will just be another layer as it rots. Cover that stuff with layers of newsprint or corrugated cardboard, wet it, then add your layers.

    Karen

  • 19 years ago

    You have inadvertantly done the right thing with your area: you left the weeds growing (and rooting) and you cover it in leaves (mulch). PERFECT! Your soil under the leaves should be nice and soft. You are ready to mow the weeds down and lasagna.

    I think some of the plants you want to grow get planted in the fall, but I'm not sure.

    Where in Cal are you?

  • 19 years ago

    Yes, it's late for garlic. Typically I plant that in the fall and harvest in June.

    Onions will be OK from sets. Basil, tomatoes, and jalapenos will all do well. Cilantro would also do well. Tomatilloes are nice and can make a lovely salsa verde.

  • 19 years ago

    Hurray, I inadvertently did something right! This must be a good omen.
    In my searching earlier today to find out how far apart to plant these things, I discovered that I'm way late on garlic. Oops! Next year, for sure. We've decided to prep a 12' x 12' section this year, and use the whole 20' x 20' next year, for salsa AND pesto. We're a very food-oriented household. :-)
    One more question: How much manure and compost and soil should I need to lasanga a 12' x 12' space? I have NO compost of my own, and I'm not having any luck finding some for free, so I think I'm going to have to buy some. Any suggestions?
    Good idea on the tomatillos. Of course, I don't even know what kind of plant they grow on. A bush? A tree? Under a cabbage leaf? Don't worry, I'll figure it out. This simple idea of sticking a few things in the ground is turning into quite a learning experience. (Avocados grow on trees? You must be joking!)
    Also, is it grammatically correct to use lasagna as a verb? That could keep me up tonight. :-)

  • 19 years ago

    How much you need depends on how much might be there already and the only way to know that is with those soil tests, dig in and look at what you have. The simplest way to "clear" that area for a garden is to cover the weeds, no mowing needed, with newspaper or cardboard and cover that with a mulch to hold that in place and hide it. The weeds that are growing there will be deprived of access to light and that will cause them to die and when they die they become food for the soil bacteria that are there who will convert the nutrients that those weeds took from the soil into "stuff" new and desireable plants you put there will need to grow.