When I first started shredding mail for the compost, I wasn't separating out the windows... because I had read that most were made of cellulose and they would decompose.

However three years later, I am still finding little bits of window plastic in my compost... grump.. grump. So if they were cellulose, its the nondegradable kind. :-(

So I have since started pulling the windows out before I shred. If I see a label that says biodegradable window, then I will go ahead and shred it...

I rip out all the windows. I've never seen what you just posted. That's great. I hope to see more of that - sure will make it a lot easier to shred the envelopes!

Dee

Gives me a (tiny)little bit of hope for the future. At least some companies are finally "getting" it. Wonder if this will spread to other items, like pasta boxes, that have "windows" in them. We go through a lot of them, and I always remove the windows from them too.

Sassy

I sAw a flower sleeve with the same info on it. Trader Joe has some compostable bowls packed with noodle dishes. They're still hanging around in the pile tho. I think those need to get pretty hot.

I am wondering how much of the window is actually organic. A few years ago I ran across an article bemoaning the huge amount of plastic that has made it into the environment that can never be removed. The author was talking about plastic particles that were the size of sand and smaller. There are some places in the world that these particles are beginning to make up a significant portion of the "topsoil," for lack of a better word.

One of the causes of this, he said, was the demand by many citizens and governments for plastic bags that degrade naturally. The way the bag manufacturers solved this was not to make 100% biodegradable bags (those weren't strong enough), but to make the bags out of a mixture of plastic and UV degradable and biodegradable corn products. The problem is that the bags are still 70% plastic and that plastic is still left as tiny plastic particles in the environment after the corn part of the bag has disintegrated. People can't see the bags on the side of the road anymore because they disappear from view after a little while, but the plastic is still there.

I hope they are not doing the same thing with these windows. Industry has a long way to go before they earn my trust on these issues.

Steve

Doris, if you come across a flower sleeve like that again, do you think you could e-mail me with any brand name or info? I sell bouquets at a farmer's market and have been searching for a compostable sleeve. A few companies advertise them, but when I contacted them they told me they were still "in the works". I'd appreciate any info you can send my way regarding these.

Steve, that's not too encouraging. At least if something is completely plastic it may hang around but at least it will not break down and mix with the soil like that. It will certainly make me think twice about using anything labeled this way and make me do a bit more research into the products.

Dee

It's called PLA or corn plastic (or other names). It is made wholly from plant starch, not petroleum. Making it still involves a complicated industrial process. Our credit union started sending out envelopes with windows made from it. You can buy 'plastic' mulch made from it. The grocery store here sells some produce in clear boxes made from it. One of these has been sitting deep in one of our compost piles since last fall. I'm looking forward to digging it up - I filled it with damp horse manure, to encourage it to decompose. But it needs more heat (or time) to break down than what I'm giving it, I think.

If we didn't have a wood stove I wouldn't hesitate to put shredded envelopes with these windows into the compost pile.

Here is a link that might be useful: pla corn plastic

Interesting. I haven't seen any envelopes like that, but I did put one of those compostable bowls in last year, and it hasn't shown any signs of decomposing whatsoever. Granted, my pile is pretty cool, so I am hoping it eventually decomposes, but I won't be making a habit of using them. (Dh had bought the pre-made meal thing on an impulse, and it was just ok, anyhow.)

Yeah, I have one of those compostable containers in my compost pile too. Got some pasta salad for my daughter at an organic foods store and realized when I got home that it was PLA. Still in the compost after about six or eight months, but my pile is pretty cool too.

I've known about PLA for quite awhile, but now I'm wondering - is this the same stuff Steve is referring to? And is it mixed with plastic? Or are the "biodegradable" plastic bags different from the "compostable" PLA products?

Dee

The Smithsonian article addresses two issues raised here (I just finished reading it myself). Sounds like the boxes may not dissolve like magic, even in a year. Not for me, anyway, with my slow/cool composting. But I bet some people here get their compost at 140F for ten consecutive days. Maybe I'll put any we get in a dedicated pile, along with plant stalks and other tough material. Kind of a nuisance.

"The polymer has had to get over some cultural hurdles. In the mid-1980s, another bio-based plastic appeared on grocery store shelves: bags made from polyethylene and cornstarch that were said to be biodegradable. "People thought they would disappear quickly," recalls Steven Mojo, executive director of the Biodegradable Products Institute. They didnÂt. Will Brinton, president of Woods End, a compost research laboratory in Mt. Vernon, Maine, says the bags broke into small fragments of polyethylene, fragments that werenÂt good for compostÂor public relations. "It was a big step backward for the biodegradability movement," he adds. "Whole communities abandoned the concept of biodegradable bags as a fraud."

According to a biodegradability standard that Mojo helped develop, PLA is said to decompose into carbon dioxide and water in a "controlled composting environment" in fewer than 90 days. WhatÂs a controlled composting environment? Not your backyard bin, pit or tumbling barrel. ItÂs a large facility where compostÂessentially, plant scraps being digested by microbes into fertilizerÂreaches 140 degrees for ten consecutive days. So, yes, as PLA advocates say, corn plastic is "biodegradable." But in reality very few consumers have access to the sort of composting facilities that can make that happen. NatureWorks has identified 113 such facilities nationwideÂsome handle industrial food-processing waste or yard trimmings, others are college or prison operationsÂbut only about a quarter of them accept residential foodscraps collected by municipalities."

I was at the farmers market yesterday and saw some compostable forks. They are more heavy duty than most plastic forks, I imagine they would take quite a while, even in a hot pile.

These biodegradable utensils are made from 80% non-GMO corn starch and 20% other biodegradable fillers and can handle hot foods and liquids up to about 190-200 degrees F.

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This cutlery maintains its strength in foods up to approximately 165 degrees (F)...
...Made from U.S.-grown corn, our cutlery is biodegradable in commercial composting conditions. The utensils will completely decompose within 100 days in a commercial composting environment.

There are a bunch of products out there now as alternatives to standard throwaway plastic that are supposed to be compostable. Don't know if they work but it's at least an attempt in the right direction. Below is a link to one such company.

Here is a link that might be useful: Compostable Cutlery

I love the idea that those wasteful and harmful windows are gping compostable

Nature will consume the paper from the envelopes. I'm experimenting with composting junk mail and must manually remove the cellophane windows after the paper is digested. It appears that the cellophane that goes to landfill will be there forever. So many of the envelopes that have these windows would function just as well without them. We need mindful consumers and legislators to nudge things in the right direction.