What kind of hay?

How big a problem is Johnson Grass in the hay fields in your area?

Here, Johnson Grass is a major invasive that spreads readily by rhizomes around the first seed grown plant and the danged roots can go down eighteen inches into solid red clay. In New Orleans, the woman who had owned our house thought it was corn and IF she'd fertilize it enough, she'd get ears of corn. She bragged about her good idea to all the neighbors from whom we heard the sad, sad tale, Which explained why we found vigorous rhizomes growing under an eleven foot wide, six inch deep cement slab in the back yard. You don't want Johnson Grass in your flower beds.

Nor do you want Cogongrass (link below). It is visible from planes flying into Nashville's airport several thousand feet up, it gets so wide.

The problem is: hay is out there. We have several abandoned rounds that I'm tempted to use, but not on the roses. I think I may use them this fall on a garden bed that is as yet unplanted- so that next spring I can nuke anything there that I don't want

There's a second similar grass called

Here is a link that might be useful: Cogongrass (PDF with more than you want to know)

It is alfalfa hay. I wondered if you put it on think enough if it would work. Better yet put some cardboard underneath

Countryrosegirl, I've had roses bedded using both prairie hay and straw for years; I prefer the prairie hay, but alfalfa would be the cat's meow and should break down to be a real boon to your roses. If you have square bales, I just bust up the bales and use the "leaves" to make a 4-6 inch solid mulch bed between roses. No ill effects that I can tell and the soil stays moist in the worst of drought summers. The only real drawback is the appearance; you have to ignore the gray either will fade to.

Here is a link that might be useful: Garden Musings blog.

If alfalfa hay prices weren't so high (we feed our horses 50% alfalfa) I'd be using it for mulch. Instead I use the manure. I haven't tried it directly, but I imagine it should be good. It'll take a bit to integrate into your soil - perhaps mix some in to the top layer of soil and the water will eventually break it down. It shouldn't reseed like oat does, should help deter weeds, won't look bad ... heck, why not. I'm curious to know how it goes!

I gather up the hay my horses scatter all over their paddocks (horses are terribly wasteful). It usually has manure mixed in with it, and I just lay it on top of my beds over the woodchips. Also, if I have leftover unused hay at the end of the year I put it in my beds. Once it gets wet, you don't even notice it's there, and I really think it's enriching my soil when it rots down. My hay is not even alfalfa. It's just a high quality grass hay. Alfalfa would be fabulous.

I started a cutting bed this year with larkspur, poppies, baby's breath, Queen Ann's lace, delphinium, etc. I put down this hay and manure mix on top of the soil (this was green manure) and threw my seeds directly on top. This bed was absolutely amazing this year with really dark, rich colors in the blooms compared to my other beds. I plan on doing it again next year it was so successful.

Why not use straw? It is cheaper than hay and doesn't have as many seeds. If you want to keep the weeds down, use that black fabric weed guard available at Home Despot. Another option recommended by Burpees is to put down newspaper first, wet good with a hose, then put straw on top. This will keep the weeds down for this season and provide organic matter for the soil.

I have two square bales of coastal hay (I picked them up in Zephyrhills when I went down to the feed mill to get my alfalfa, soybean, and cottonseed meals. I'm in the middle of Florida horse country and none of the feed places here have meal -- only pellets). I'm going to use to sheet compost a bed I won't be planting until the fall, at the earliest. Peat moss, newspapers, topsoil, hay, composted cow manure, then landscape fabric on the top and let it sit.

In the end, I have regretted it the few times I used landscape fabric. To me, it causes more trouble in the longrun than it's worth. I now use newspaper under the mulch instead.

I LOVE the idea of newspaper under straw (may use hay or mulch) to keep down weeds. I'm going to try it this year!

Floridarose, the landscape fabric is only temporary -- and it's going on top of everything, to kill weeds and increase the heat of the bed to speed up decomposition of the organic matter. I'll remove it when I'm ready to plant.

Hi there countryrosegirl. I was waiting to see what kind of hay you'd say. I've used alfalfa hay here and it's great. If you have a good source of horse manure, put that on too. I bet your roses will be gorgeous. The other kinds of hay (like Ann said) don't use because of pestiferous weeds...but alfalfa has been great here. It doesn't look as nice, but I think if you put manure over it and the rain fell on it, it'd all break down and enrich the soil. I'm not in your zone by a long-shot, so maybe others in your area have better advice. Alfalfa worked here in California.

Ah, excellent idea, Kathy.

I use alfalfa hay on my roses. It breaks down with lots of nitrogen and good stuff. I make my own compost and put that in new each year (in the rose bed) and then add the hay on top and let it work its way in. Very nice!

Straw doesnt really replenish or compost in. It is good for keeping moisture in though.

Hay has lots of seeds. I use straw. No farm either, I have to go out and buy it by the bale at the feed store. I just put straw around most of my roses the other day. Works well for me.

DesertCubster,

Me too, I am using using alfalfa hay as mulch on my roses. This is my first year doing so. Question: The hay turned yellow quickly, did you just leave them to decompose or you change them every year? If I would to renew them, should I do it once the season is over or next spring before the growing season?

Just a point about the seeds in alfalfa hay. When alfalfa sets seed, the protein content of its leaves falls drastically. Consequently, farmers make every effort to harvest alfalfa before those blue heads of seed form. If you find that your alfalfa hay has lots of seeds, it just means bad weather or some other adverse conditions delayed harvest -- and you got a bum deal.

Can you compost it first?

Hay is for horses
Composted manure after the horses eat the hay
is for the garden
LOL!

Interesting Mike, thanks! I never knew that about the seeds indicating weather or something else delayed the harvest. Kim

I used hay once. Never again! I had bales left over from a Halloween display and thought I'd try it. Ugh! The stuff was a mess to get up in the spring and I had terrible problems with weeds that whole season. Some people say straw doesn't have the weed problem but my guess is it would be just as hard to get off in the spring so I've never tried it. I use my abundant, free supply of finely mulched leaves. In the spring I take off the top layer and the bottom, which has already begun to decay and is filled with worms usually, gets turned into the soil.