Wow very nice pic.

Fantastic, Maryann, they look real healthy! I'm glad they're doing so well - keep us posted.
MissSherry

Oh, Maryann, they are adorable! I'm so excited for you, and I sure hope Cathy gets some eventually, too! I bet Judy would be interested in seeing these photos, too.

So, these are the cats that overwintered? You didn't find them as eggs? I wonder what the eggs look like. Course I'm always wonderin' something! I was just hoping you had an entire life process of images on them so we could see it.

You're such a lucky girl, and they are lucky little cats, too!

Susan

MaryAnn, Your BC cats are really adorable! Being that I've only raised Monarch cats, it's hard for me to picture how you raise BC cats over the winter. Where exactly did you keep them? This might sound dumb, but do they eat all winter? In that case, I guess you'd have to bring enough plants in from outside ahead of time before it freezes. Ha, my whole house would probably have plantain in it because I'd be afraid I'd run out of food for them! :-D I have the plantain here, but the BC butterflies would have to show up and deposit their eggs, and I'm not even sure if there are any in the area. I tried to start Chelone glabra from seed over the winter but didn't have any luck with it at all, so I guess they're going to have to settle for the plantain. Just how long are BC cats caterpillars anyway? So can I assume that the cats you have there will be adults before long and lay eggs of their own this year yet? I ought to read up on these and I've been so busy planting things all winter and getting ready to plant things outside this month and next month that I haven't been doing much reading on anything. Congrats on your Baltimore cats! They really are pretty!
Cathy

Okay, this may be a case of the chicken before the egg..

I first had the plantain and just thought it was a weedy patch that I had to get rid of.

Then someone told me about the BCs in a state park near here.

Then I found the cats last summer in the goldenrod and moved them to my little patch of plantain that for some reason I never got rid of. And there they stayed over the harsh NE winter, not eating because the plantain withered to nearly nothing. Then, in the spring, they woke up...right along with the plantian, and started chomping away.

They've molted at least once now, some probably twice, so the next molt will probably leave me with many ravenous caterpillars ready to pupate. (I hope)

I haven't seen the eggs yet, although this year, I hope to...

and will post pics if I do...

MaryAnn, Thanks for explaining that because I was confused (my middle name...ha). Thank goodness that you didn't get rid of your plantain weedy patch. Whew! I guess those Baltimore cats were meant to grow up there at your place. :) Wow, I guess I didn't realize that some caterpillars take so long to grow up and turn into butterflies. I'm used to the Monarchs that I raised last year. That's only about a month from egg to butterfly. I wish so much my camera I got in 2004 would work so I'd be able to take pictures of my butterflies this year. I thought Olympus was supposed to be a good brand, but mine went on the fritz last year and I hate to put money into it because chances are it will probably cost as much as a new camera. So I hope that my daughter will take some pictures for me this year; otherwise, I won't have any. It upsets me that I actually paid more money for it than I could afford and now don't have it anyway. I can't wait to see your pictures that you'll have to show us this year! I was going to plant Chelone glabra for them this year and had bought seeds online but none of them came up! I'm so disappointed, so I guess I'll wait until next year to start some or else buy some of the plants. Right now I'm in the middle of too many other things to think about it. I feel like if I have one more thing on my mind, my head will explode. lol
Cathy

Tonight I counted 132 baltimore caterpillars on the plantainpatch, penstemon, and turtlehead. And that was just those I could see readily. Cathy, I wish you were close enough to come up and get some!

Strangely enough they are staying quite close to each other. Everynight, they huddle together in groups, mostly on the flower heads of the plantain.

I thought that in the spring they were supposed to disperse. So far, they've been feeding for nearly 2 months and still seem to like each other's company. Perhaps because the food is plentiful.

They seem to particularly relish the flower heads.

{{gwi:466629}}

Maryann, did all of them just "show up" on your plantain? Or, did you get them from your original source?

They sure are cuties. You are doing such wonderful work at helping to re-establish them in PA. I hope someone knows about what you're doing!

Susan

132+ cats? WOW!! They look so healthy and well fed!
What a wonderful project - I wish they occurred here!
MissSherry

Susan,

They are all from that same nest of caterpillars that I transplanted into the plantain patch last July! Isn't it amazing that so many overwintered successfully?

Do you suppose that makes them all brothers and sisters from the same egg mass?

Perhaps I should go get a few other caterpillars from the original site (25 miles away) for genetic diversity?

I actually have had email conversations with a woman near DC who has been involved in a reintroduction of BC's in Maryland. I don't believe they've been too successful because the BC's down there haven't taken to the plantain like they have up here.

I will consider my project a success when I see adults flying, mating, and laying eggs, even if it doesn't result in an ongoing population here.

I have learned so much and like to think this forum is a good way to preserve my observations.

MaryAnn, Oh, if only we didn't live so far apart, I'd sure take some of those off of your hands. Would I legally be allowed to bring them into PA? I don't understand the butterfly laws. I don't even know where I'd be able to read about them. Believe me, if I were a little closer and I could bring them here, I most certainly would be ecstatic to take some of them. The one thing that would have me concerned though is that if the BC's didn't take to the plantain in MD, I can't be sure that they'd take to it here. If they wouldn't, I wouldn't know what to do. They are beautiful cats which grow up to be beautiful butterflies. I'm trying to get the Baltimore Checkerspot, Common Buckeye, Common Checkered Skipper, Falcate Orangetip, Giant Swallowtail, Long-tailed Skipper, Mourning Cloak, Painted Lady, Pipevine Swallowtail, Variegated Fritillary, and probably a few I'm forgetting. Even some of those on my list are ones that probably shouldn't show up until next year because if they'd lay eggs on some of my plants, I wouldn't have enough to sustain the cats. Those I mentioned are ones that I didn't see those butterflies here last year. There are other butterflies like the Zebra Swallowtail that I wish I would get, but I don't have any Paw Paw trees yet...hopefully next year. I planted Hyacinth Bean vine and Scarlet Runner Bean, hoping to get skippers to eat them. I had lots of Silver-spotted Skippers here last year but don't know what they laid their eggs on. I don't know of anything that I had here that they would have used. I'm anxious to see if I have those cats on the bean vines this summer.

I have tons of plants to put out yet. My having to hand dig the sod out to extend the garden to make room for all my new plants is hard on my hands and my back and it's slow going. I have tomato stalks I want to plant but nowhere to put them yet and other annuals I didn't get out yet like snapdragons, tithonia, mealy-cup sage, and more than my brain is too tired to think of right now.

Oh, and btw, I forgot to say to you, "WOW!" That really is a lot of BC cats! You must really have a lot of plantain to have had them for so long and they're still caterpillars. I didn't realize before you posted about them that some caterpillars stay caterpillars for that long. Yes, I think that your cats like each other's company so much that they're reluctant to become butterflies! ;-) I think you're doing a great job raising them. I just wish that the butterflies, some of them at least, would stay with you at your place. I wish you lots of luck with them.
Cathy

WOW! 130+ cats!!!!! That is amazing! That is wonderful that so many overwintered successfully. Please keep us posted! I would love to see more pictures eventually, especially when they make their chrysallis and the adult butterflies. Congrats on your wonderful find, and aren't you glad you never removed your weedy plantain? What fun it will be when they are all adults.

Elane

Elaine, I'm becoming very fond of weeds. They've been really no trouble at all, I had them covered with remay netting over the winter, but the plantain outgrew the small covering and most of the cats have crawled out into the escaped plantain.

Hopefully, no birds, skunks, or parasites will find too many of them.

That's the way the Baltos are, they lay huge amounts of eggs in a cluster and when the cats hatch they build a little commune out of silk.They eat a little in July and august then stop. They overwinter in leaf litter in one or two balls of cats held together with silk.

Cathy, it wouldn't be legal for you to move them across state lines. I've been talking to a woman in Maryland who's trying to reintroduce them there and she had to get a USDA permit to get them from NY.

You've got enough on your plate as it is LOL!

Maryann

MaryAnn, I kind of didn't think that it would be legal and so I had to make sure. So I can only get cats from someone with PA, right? Ha, you're probably right about me having enough on my plate actually.
Cathy

Actually Cathy, I'm not too bad off..

Since I work mostly nights, I have all day to garden and chase butterflies. That's the ONLY advantage to working nights in the restaurant business!

My main problem is trying not to do so much during the day that I'm not too tired for work at 4:30.

emmayct,doesn't it seems silly for the USDA to be concerned about butterflies being shipped across state lines.Don't they realize that in the wild,butterflies frequently cross state,and even national borders?
But anyway,congrats on the Baltimore cats.And yes it is unusual for them to stay together this long,as they normally feed singly in the spring.

A brief update.

Aparently the caterpillars are trying to make a run for it. After sticking together all this time, they are moving around now. And I'm finding them all over the yard and veggie garden. I found one over 40 ft away from it's original spot. The problem is that the only other plantain for them is in the yard and if they are looking to find this, it is sparse and widely separated.

I can only hope they are getting ready to pupate because now I'll be afraid to mow, and need to watch very carefully where I step.

LOL, these guys are running my life!!

I did find one chrysalis today on the remay cloth and there's another cat hanging on the side of a bucket, looking like he's ready to pupate.

Hopefully some adults to report on soon?

Maryann

Wow! I feel sure that since they're scattering to that extent, they must be going to pupate - I can't wait to see the chrysalids and adults!
This has been such an interesting project for us all to follow, Maryann! And I know what you mean about watching where you walk - I do the same thing for the same reason only for different caterpillars, mine being PVSs.
MissSherry

Maryann,

Don't know how I've missed this post 'til now. I love your project/pictures. Thanks for all you're doing to help save one of the most beautiful butterflies. It's interesting to note how the cats overwinter and how long they stay in their "commune." Can't wait to see pictures of the butterflies that you've worked so hard to produce.

mike

Thanks Mike,

Missherry, I hope you're right about them pupating. I'm keeping a close watch..the main reason I tried this experiment is so I could watch and learn about their life cycle.

It seems as if the 10 or so that I moved over to the turtlehead,(Hot Lips) are still eating greedily and are somewhat bigger than those remaining on or fleeing from the plantain. It makes me wonder if they really do get more nutrition from the turtlehead (which is their natural host) than they get from the plantian(their surrogate host plant).

Perhaps they know that in their last instar they need more than plantain and are looking more nutrition. Plantain is all that most of these cats have known since birth except for the few that I put on Hot Lips and penstemon about a month ago.

Or perhaps they are just dispersing in response to the high balto population in the original, small plantain patch.

Another strange observation, as the cats move off the plantain they all are moving in the same direction. Towards the east, which is also the sunnier side of the garden.

Maryann

Well, it's all interesting!
I hope others in the Northeast will do what you're doing from one end of their range to the other. Bascially, if lots of people would plant lots of turtleheads in wet spots, wouldn't that do it?
MissSherry

Maryann,

Like MissSherry, you are a true scientist and a perceptive observer/reporter. I can't recall reading in any book/article about the direction that cats travel in leaving their host plants as they seek places to pupate. Is this observation about baltimore cats applicable to other cats? Are they heading toward the sun or heading toward the east( if there happens to be a difference regarding the sunniest part of the area they're in)?

I love this aspect of our forum!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

mike

Maryann, I keep coming back to this thread to look at those cats. I just really think that they are so pretty, and I think that the butterflies are one of my very favorite. I had really wanted to plant for them, but now I don't think it will happen. :( My dad had said back in the winter that he'd hire someone to clear out the field that they own so that I could plant milkweed and whatever else I wanted to plant. Now he's cancelled those plans because he's have someone cut down some trees at their place instead. That was where I was going to plant a few hundred Swamp Milkweed plants and plants for the BC's, namely Chelone glabra and Penstemon hirsutus. The C. glabra didn't even come up at all, and the P. hirsutus is so small after several months that I can't even see putting it out at all this year, and if it does manage to live, I'll be keeping it in the house over the winter. I also didn't have any luck with the seeds that I got for the Common Buckeyes, Verbena hastata and Agalinus tenuifolia. They never germinated and you'd think that they'd have done that now after about 4 months. I guess I don't have lucky with teeny tiny seeds, and I know at least some of those were. I could barely see some of them! So I won't be getting BC's or Common Buckeyes here this year, unless they lay eggs on the plantain. I guess if I ever do decide to have those plants here, I'll have to buy the actual plants, at least a couple of them. I raise most of my plant from seeds because it's a lot cheaper. I just have a few that don't come up, but wouldn't you know it, they were all host plants and all for butterflies that I was hoping to get here this year. Now since I have so many Swamp Milkweed and no place to go with them unless I'd dig a huge flower bed (forget it!), I think I'll plant them in cups and put them out fron with a For Sale sign on them. I need the money anyway, and maybe I can get $1 for each one if they're in individual containers like that. Of course, there goes more potting soil. I swear I went through more of that this year than I did in a few years combined in the past. Well, I'm rambling...I just am so happy that you're having luck with your BC's, and I hope that they grow up to be healthy butterflies. You're doing such a great thing! =)
Cathy

Cathy, you're doing your best. Personally I'm not sure where you get all the energy. I have a small yard, I should be grateful, because if I had more land, I'd probably work myself to death. My ex's back yard was huge and every year I made the garden bigger and bigger. It got out of control!

Thinking about you with your milkweed for sale made me smile. This year I raised giant pumpkin plants for a friend who got too lazy to take them. So today, I stuck them out front with a sign, take them. If I had the patience to wait, I could have sold them, but I just wanted them otta here.

Mike, the reason I noticed that they are traveling east, is because I keep finding them in the adjacent veggie garden and weed patch.

Today, I rounded up 5 of them that ended up in the same area. (I wonder if they follow each other.) I put them on the turtlehead and they began eating like they were starving.

I'm beginning to think that while plantain is an acceptable host, turtlehead is preferred especially in the last instar.

Misssherry, planting turtlehead is a great idea, but the deer love it.

Now you guys have me really wanting to get back to the park where they originally came from.

I'll keep you posted.

Maryann

Maryann, I suppose I went overboard with my planting things. If you'd see all of the plants I have in containers, you might laugh yourself silly seeing how many I have. I had them inside on all of our windowsills and as I kept starting more and started moving the ones inside outside, our back porch became too full with them, so I started moving some outside and just have them sitting outside on our cement out back. That didn't stop me, and I kept planting more milkweed, worried that I might get a deluge of Monarchs this year and I wanted to make sure that they wouldn't starve, so now my plants are spilling out onto the lawn. Gosh, I hope they don't creep all the way over to the driveway because that would be about another 50 feet of potted plants. My husband just shakes his head and thinks I've lost my mind. :-D He knows how much I like planting things for the butterflies, though, so he doesn't really say too much about my getting overly enthusiastic. I have the energy because I'm not working, not that we don't need the money but for personal reasons. Anyway, if I were working, I'd be too tired to do all of this. So as it is, I wonder somedays how I keep going. I'm usually outside around 9 AM, take periodic breaks (especially today when it was so gosh dang hot and humid...96), come in long enough to make supper (dinner to city folk) and eat and go back out until dark, which is about 8:30 or 8:45. I just feel like I'm running out of time to get my plants in the ground and so have been putting in a lot of hours outside. Heck, I'm still working at digging sod, but I'm putting that on hold until I get some of these plants planted where I already have the sod dug and peat moss mixed in. I have too much sod to dig yet for my comfort, so I think I'll just dig a hole for each of my tomato plants and annuals and put them in the ground and hope for the best. I have to soon finish this planting so I can work on my butterfly cage that started falling apart. I didn't expect that at all and am very disappointed. I might end up with the cats on the back porch like I had them last year if I don't have time to do everything. Oh, and I still have to plant at least 50 Swamp Milkweed plants in the bed where I planted seeds last year and they didn't come up. I was disappointed with that too. I'm glad you realize that I am doing my best. I really push myself to do a lot of this, yet I still feel like I don't have enough time with having to mow the grass, do meals, do laundry, etc. Hubby does help me though, just not outside. He doesn't mind helping with the laundry. Now you know my life's story. Haha.

Hee hee, that's funny about those pumpkins plants that you gave away. I know what you mean about it being a bother to sell things. I've gone through that, but I thought since I could use the money, I'll try to sell them. Of course, with all this outside work, my back is usually killing me and today my feet are joining in on that. Oh well, I guess it won't last forever. :)

Cathy

Cathy, my Dad of 80 years, a PA native from Catawissa, still calls dinner "supper." Either, you'll get everything done..or you won't...and the butterflies will still come! So just enjoy the warm weather because you know in Oct, you'll be missing it!

Today I found a beautiful baltimore chrysalis in the wild aster patch. I cut the stem off and brought it in. In addition, another made a chrys. on the side of a bucket and another on a PVC pipe. I wonder how many more are around that I don't see.

The cats on the turtle head are still eating and growing. I'll try to get pics tomorrow. Strange weather here.. everyone else is in the 90's and today we hardly reached 70.

Maryann