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Question on dwarf conifers

17 years ago

Just wondering if anyone has any suggestions for a dwarf conifer...

We're looking for a dwarf cultivar of a conifer that's native to the Northeastern or Mid-Atlantic U.S. The conifer that's most prevalent in our area is Eastern red cedar (Juniperus virginiana), so we were thinking about a Juniperus virginiana "Grey Owl".

But I've read that "Grey Owl" is a hybrid between J. virginiana "Glauca" and the Asian J. chinensis "Pfitzeriana".

Is there any dwarf conifer that comes from a conifer native to the Eastern United States? Please pardon my ignorance if such a thing does not exist...we're just trying to plant all natives this year, but would like something a little smaller than the Juniperus virginiana in our yard, which are quite large.

We are also planning to plant some Creeping Juniper (Juniperus horizontalis), but are looking for something a little larger than Creeping Juniper, in the 2 to 5 foot range.

Zone 6b, Northern Piedmont area.

Thanks in advance!

Comments (6)

  • 17 years ago

    Search around for Juniperus virginiana 'Reptans'. It is emerald green throughout the year and gets covered with yellow pollen cones in the spring. It is slow growing and prostrate so it takes care of both of your needs.
    It is often sold as 'Pendula', but the yellow pollen cones in the spring say otherwise. Since the true 'Pendula' is rare in the States, it should be a safe purchase for what you want even as 'Pendula'.

    Bob

  • 17 years ago

    Thanks so much for the recommendations. Can't seem to find the "Reptans" for sale anywhere though...I found the "Pendula", which is nice but we're looking for something a little stiffer/spiky and more upright.

    This size range, 2 to 5 feet, is considered a miniature conifer rather than a dwarf conifer, right?

    The other native conifers in our area are Eastern White pine (Pinus strobus), and Atlantic White cedar (Chamaecyparis thyoides), if that helps. A miniature of one of these would be great too.

    We'd even consider a Western U.S. native if we are unable to find anything miniature from a tree native to east of the Rockies.

    As far as color goes, would like something with a blue-ish hue, but that's less of a priority...

  • 17 years ago

    growth rate determines the type

    mini.. under 1 inch per year
    dwarf ... 1 to 6 inches .... etc.. see link below ...

    but as an exaggeration.. if momma is 365 feet tall.. in theory.. a DWARF of her.. could be a mere 250 feet tall ... given enough centuries ....

    there is an annual growth rate ... it will grow at that rate.. for your lifetime.. your childrens life time.. and their childrens ... NOTHING stops magically growing at some predetermined size ... MOST size estimates are at 10 years ... and they will grow at the annual growth as noted above ...

    find something that makes your toes tingle.. forget about native stuff ... and enjoy the heck out of it ... and then.. when it outgrows the space.. get rid of it .. rather than 'settling' on something that will allegedly fill a given space ....

    i dont understand your reference to grey owl.. i have some on the driveway that are 15 feet tall.. and 20 feet wide.. i dont know why you brought that up .. and that is why i am referring you to the ACS website ...

    also at the link... go the the database page ... and in cultivar name.. insert grey owl.. to find its annual growth rate .... and some reference pix ...

    all that said.. ID'ing the perfect plant.. leaves ONLY the problem.. of finding someone who actually sells the darn thing... lol ...

    there are many mail order stores for the rarest of plants.. google any of the following:

    girards nursery
    COENOSIUM GARDENS CATALOG
    rich's foxwillow pines
    and a bunch of others that are escaping me right now ...

    while you are at the ACS website.. look through all the pix... and do some good learning .... we want to help.. but your questions are not limited enough to lead you in a good direction ... i do want to help

    BTW.. north piedmont????? how about a state??? and a zone ...

    good luck

    ken

    Here is a link that might be useful: link

  • 17 years ago

    Hi Ken, thanks so much for your reply, including the list of conifer nurseries, and the American conifer society link. The links are really helpful! I've actually been studying the ACS site already to see if I can find what I'm looking for, and to learn more about small conifer cultivars.

    The estimated height I got on the Juniperus virginiana "Grey Owl" came from several websites, including these:

    http://www.pendernursery.com/Catalog/Detail/juniperusvirginianagreyowl.html

    http://www.evergreenplantnursery.com/Grey-Owl-Juniper-p/junowl1.htm

    http://www.pahls.com/library.cfm?plid=30&sq=type%3DEvergreens

    Based on your info about the variability of so-called "dwarf" or "miniature" conifer heights, I take it that some nursery websites give out vague and/or inaccurate information on small conifer cultivars, and that the estimated size these websites give for the "Grey Owl" does not fall within the scope of reality?

    Basically, I'd like to find out if there any conifers native to the U.S. that have miniature cultivars that generally stay under 5 feet tall.

    We are also thinking about these:

    Chamaecyparis thyoides 'Little Jamie'

    Chamaecyparis thyoides 'Top Point'

    Pinus strobus 'Blue Shag'

    Pinus strobus 'Nana'

    Do you have any experience or know anything about any of the conifers listed above?

    We are at the very top of the Northern Piedmont in Pennsylvania...our zone was posted in my original post, but here it is again, Zone 6b. All of our other conifers are not dwarfs or minis...so we don't have experience with these, and are just trying to understand how to achieve the "small conifer" look we've seen in so many garden photos.

    Thanks again.

  • 17 years ago

    i am still mystified by this comment: I'd like to find out if there any conifers native to the U.S.

    why is that important???

    your website research is for nurseries that do NOT specialize in conifers.. as far as i know .... ergo.. they most likely rely on the tags provided on the plant.. or catalogs themselves.. which.. are USUALLY.. as i said before... size estimates AT 10 YEARS ....

    so YOU have to find the annual growth rate ...

    anyway ... check the website below for more learnin' ..... and more pix ... and all the articles.. and flip over to the companion site:

    www.cnos.biz

    ken

    Here is a link that might be useful: link

  • 17 years ago

    Thanks again Ken. I'll calculate the size by the growth rate as you suggested, and look for a conifer that comes from a nursery that specializes in conifers, rather than a regular nursery that just happens to carry conifers. Thanks for the information.

    Native plants and trees are vital to the well-being of the ecosystems and wildlife of North America. It may be that we won't find a cultivar of a conifer that meets these needs, but nevertheless, I appreciate all the information. Below is a link to an excellent website where you can learn about the benefits of growing native plants and trees of North America. Hope the site is informative, and thanks again.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Lady Bird Johnson Wildflower Center/Uni. of Texas