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Pickling questions

18 years ago

Hi:

My mom and I are getting ready to make our first batch of pickles. (1st canning attempt for either of us). I've read a lot, here and on official canning sites. I still have a few questions, if someone doesn't mind answering:

Can we always use apple cider vinegar where white vinegar is called for?

If the recipe says to use whole cukes, is it ok to use spears or slices?

What exactly is a "sprig" of fresh dill? It's a huge plant. Should I go for the equivalent of a sprig of parsley, from anywhere on the plant, or does it have to be a flower head (in which case, they should call it that!). And some recipes say "bunch" of dill--is that any bigger than a sprig?

If the ring and lid is from Ball, but the jar is not, but it seems to screw on properly, can I use it? (I have new lids and rings for old jars).

If a recipe doesn't call for hot pepper flakes, can I add some? Or would that compromise the recipe? I thought I'd try the Heinz recipe, but it doesn't have hot pepper. Is it safe in general to add dry spices?

I read a post from linda lue, who seems to be a careful canner, stating that processing time for pickles starts before the water boils. I haven't read that anywhere else, so I want to double-check.

Thanks very much!

Comments (14)

  • 18 years ago

    1. Can you always replace white vinegar with apple cider vinegar? Yes, any vinegars can be interchanged as long as they're at least 5% strength. Cider vinegar is less harsh but does darken the pickling brine.

    2. Is it OK to use spears or slices instead of whole cukes. Yes, but pack loosely in the jar and be sure there's plenty of brine swirling around.

    3. A sprig of dill is usually a piece of the leafy fronds. Yes, a sprig of parsley is similar. It goes by taste. You can add more or less. Some people prefer dried to fresh for pickles. A bunch of dill depends on the recipe. Usually it's a bundle of the fronds equivalent to a small bunch of parsley, cilantro, etc. If the recipe uses the blossom heads, it normally says so.

    4. Can you interchange jars and lids? Yes. Ball lids work fine on Kerr jars and vice versa.

    5. Dried pepper flakes and/or other dried herbs are fine to add freely. Fresh is another matter.

    6. It's my understanding that processing time for pickles as Linda_Lou explains it is limited to Fresh-Pack Dills and fermented pickles. Here's the quote from an Extension Service document:

    "Processing procedures for fermented cucumbers and fresh-pack pickles are slightly different from normal water bath procedures. For these products, start to count the processing time as soon as the filled jars are placed in the actively boiling water. This prevents development of a cooked flavor and loss of crispness."

    Happy preserving,

    Carol

  • 18 years ago

    When I make dills, I like to use a pickle mix from Mrs. Wages. These contain the neceasary PICKLING salt and plenty of dill flavor. Becuase I like my dills to be strong tasting, I use more white vineger like about 85% to water. Cider vinegar can affect color and flavor, and is usually meant for making sweet mixed, and B&B type pickles. Spears are fine, but will not be as crisp and long lasting as whole pickling cukes. When I add spices, its usually a 3-4 dill seed heads, some mature and some still at the green stage. I also add a bit of ferny leaves. Also, becuase mine are going to be a Kosher type, I add several cut up cloves of garlic. These get added to the clean empty jars, then the cukes are firmly packed in. I also add the helpful calcium chloride to reduce the issue of pickles getting soft too quickly after several months of storage. Fermented cukes are made with just a water and salt brine and are allowed to 'work' like a yeast would do in bread.

  • 18 years ago

    I would strongly encourage you to use whole cukes this first time out and then plan to slice them when serving. Most first time canners are very disappointed in their first attempt at pickles - it takes practice - and you're more likely to get crisp usable pickles with whole fresh pickling cukes than with slices or spears.

    If you must use slices make them thick, not thin or they will turn slimey and rather than spears, consider using halves.

    Good luck. ;)

    Dave

  • 18 years ago

    Au contraire! My favorite dill pickle recipe uses cider vinegar, and I LOVE it! The brine does darken, of course, but who cares about that? It still make a pretty jar...in fact, I once won the Utah State Fair with my pickles!

    Happy pickling! --Gina

    Here is a link that might be useful: Lindsey's Luscious Dill Pickles

  • 18 years ago

    Thanks for the information, everyone! It helps a lot, even the differing statements about the vinegar. I still have some questions, though!

    The clarification of the pickle water bath time makes it clear what I need to do for pickles, but now I don't understand how that is different from what I'd do for another food? I thought the timing for most foods would normally start once the water is boiling, and that the pickles were timed from before the water reaches boiling. I now understand from the quote above that pickles start timing once they're placed in the boiling water. What is the starting point for timing other foods?

    Since I want the pickles to be as good as they can be, I will use whole cukes (although, I may have to cut one end a lot to make them fit in the jar)

    I'd like to use Pickle Crisp/calcium chloride, but I don't want to make a bulk order if we're not going to make more pickles. I'll ask around the neighborhood for some. I don't suppose lab-grade CaCl is ok? :)

    One last question:
    I thought I read that it's not food-safe to do this stuff outside, but there is a thread about outdoor canning. Is that doing the jar-sealing outdoors, or is the food handling done outdoors too? Can we do the pickles on the bbq side-burner?

    Thanks for your patience!

  • 18 years ago

    Most foods are placed in the canner before the water is brought to a full boil. It may be warm but it is not boiling. Timing begins once it reaches full boil but they are exposed to all that pre-heating time as well as part of their processing.

    Pickles don't get put in the canner until AFTER the water is already boiling. Insert and remove them with care.

    Be sure to trim both ends of the cukes - blossom and stem end and do not over-pack the jars.

    It can be done outside with extra care for food safety, insects, bacterial contamination, etc. Those of us that do outside canning are usually talking about the canning part of the process. Don't think of processing as just getting the jars to seal as it has additional purposes for everything but pickles. ;)

    Dave

  • 18 years ago

    I'm confused about the Au Contraire!. I said cider vinegar darkens the brine, which is true. I didn't say that was a reason to avoid it.

    What I said was it is less harsh (softer finish might be more accurate), which is why rural picklers have long preferred it for all but the lightest relishes or where the slight fruitiness might interfere with other delicate flavors. So someone pickling with fresh tarragon might choose white wine vinegar instead of apple cider.

    The point is you can choose what suits your palate.

    Carol

  • 18 years ago

    Carol, I was responding to ksrogers who said that cider vinegar affects both color and flavor, and is normally used in making sweet pickles. While that may well be, I was pointing out that I make my favorite garlic dills (I personally hate sweet pickles) using cider vinegar and love the flavor.

    I was just trying to let the original poster know that people do use cider vinegar for dills, too. Sorry to confuse.

    --Gina

  • 18 years ago

    And now I have another great-sounding recipe to try, thanks to Gina!

    Thanks so much for all the help, everyone.

  • 18 years ago

    My apologies, Gina. I totally missed Ken's comment re cider vinegar. That will teach me to read everything in a thread.

    Carol

  • 18 years ago

    Again, Carol has stated that its all up to the persons taste buds who makes them. I don't see any commercially made dill pickles that contain cider vinegar, but that doesn't mean it will spoil a batch or its flavor. I also use rice wine vinegar, but only when I pickle veggies for Califonia Rolls.

  • 18 years ago

    Questions using old pickle recipes?
    I'm about to make my favorite watermelon and carrot pickles with recipes from my grandmother and have been doing a bit of surfing on making pickles.

    Apparently, old pickling recipes may be unsafe since the % of vinegar used to be 7% and now is 5%. I've looked for similar recipes that are more current but nothing seems to fit. They have also noted that you can use the old recipes if you store them in your fridge but if I'm making a dozen of each, I don't have that much space!

    So for example if the recipe calls for 14 cups of water and 3 cups of vinegar do you think the flavor would be super altered if I changed it to equal amounts of each like 8 cups of water and 8 cups of vinegar?

    And/or how many of you still use old recipes and have no problems? The last time I made these were about 4 years ago and they were absolutely fine with the old recipe.

  • 17 years ago

    I buy 10lb of carrots there is only my wife and I. I like pickled carrots, we live where winter travel is limited, Is there a pickling recipe for storing carrots for long time like pickles?

  • 17 years ago

    NCHFP safe recipe for pickled carrots here:

    Here is a link that might be useful: Pickled Carrots