Do you mind if I ask why? Given the cost of the vinegar making cultures, glass or stainless steel jug, etc. it is much cheaper and easier to just buy a 5 gallon jug of some off-brand vinegar for cleaning uses.

The standard ratio is 1 quart of starter culture to 1 quart of fermented juice. Tomato pulp will ferment as any of us who save seeds have discovered but just skins? I don't think there would be enough pulpl on them to ferment.

Home made vinegar wouldn't be safe to use for canning though.

Dave

Vinegar requires a starter, or 'mother' to get to ferment to vinegar. I suppose that tomato peels could be used, but they are quite thin and lack any juices. Once vinegar is made, it must be distilled to a specific acidity. Also, chemical testing is needed as vinegar isn't the only thing that gets produced during the fermentation.

Dave, I just thought I'd try it. Sort of a "Little House on the Prairie" thing." Everything gets used as much as possible. Why just compost, if you can make vinegar first, kinda thing. And you know, a penny saved....I was thinking of using all the stuff that's left after putting tomatoes through a food mill. Many people describe making vinegar without a starter. Say it's not necessary, just takes much longer. And I always have more containers than I know what to do with. I'm always looking for uses to keep them out of land fills. Consequently I have lots to choose from. There are lots of descriptions for making vinegar from apple peels and cores, so I just thought, why not tomatoes? I don't want to add the juice that I remove before processing because I boil that and freeze it to use as "vegetable stock" in cooking, but maybe I would have to use some of that to get the vinegar started.

If there is no liquid from the tomato skins, you will not get anything. The tomato seeds are not useful as they give off a bitter taste. A choice of apple peels and even hard cider are usually better choices for making an apple vinegar. I think potatoes are used for the white vinegar. I do know that potatoes do make vodka. Distilling is very necessary in any case, so the vinegar is safer, and can be adjusted in acidity for the final percentage. Vinegar needs a specific type of yeast to start, it could be a wild yeast, but can be a 50/50 chance. Thats why a 'mother' is active, whereas a vinegar you buy in a bottle cannot. The reason, its distilled to kill off any possible yeast spores or any other bacteria.

There is recycling all over the country for most all current plastics that are used to package everythng we buy. Glass, metal, and paper are also recycled, so land fills are used less. Locally here, the trash people dispose of is sent to a big plant nearby and burned. Its energy powers electric generators and supplies nearly 3 towns with power. Its next to a GE factory and I believe it was their property that the plant was constructed on. They have been doing this for nearly 20 years now, and have reduced any excess waste by about 80%.

We too live a packrat "Country Boys Can Survive" life here in the boonies and thankfully passed it on to our 2 sons. They already have their names written on each thing they want for when Ma and Pa kick the bucket.

But I think I would likely draw the line at making my own vinegar. There is the old "law of diminishing returns" to consider. ;)

But I honestly can't see how tomatoes skins alone would cut it. Potato peels, sure. Maybe some of that left over tomato water plus some ripe rotten ones that may have gotten over looked in the garden or fallen to the ground thrown in plus a few bad apples. If you don't grow your own collect the trash produce from the produce manager at the local grocery.

Someone posted over on the compost forum a couple of weeks back that they were doing that - collecting the throw-away produce - and were overwhelmed with it. Their main concern was what to do with all the little plastic stickers that come on the apples. :^)

Dave

If you don't have an established vinegar SCOBY (symbiotic culture of bacteria and yeast), and you're working with a borderline source of food for your culture, you could produce something toxic before the SCOBY ever gets going. I think you should either start with something you know will ferment, or get some mother of vinegar. One cheap source is a bottle of unfiltered vinegar from the health food store. That way at least one of the variables is out and you have a chance.

Seems like tomato peels are mostly cellulose and not much sugar, which becomes alcohol to feed your culture. Something like a banana peel would probably be easier to start with, then see if that mother will ferment tomato peels too.

Melissa

Hi Melissa,
After reading the other comments, I sorta thought the same thing. So I picked some neigborhood crabapples, smashed them, let them brown and then put them in water. They have started to have a vinegary smell and the liquid is getting cloudy. I figure I'll let that develop for a while and then thaw out my tomato "left-overs" and add them. My food mill seems to leave quite a bit of pulp in the skins, and cores and seeds. So we'll see. From my reading, it seems that as long as the "mother" forms I shouldn't have to worry about toxins, right? This certainly is "learning by doing" with a "little help from my friends."

Thanks.

Lynda

Lyndapaz,

What kind of food mill are you refering to? If its a Foley, with a top crank, and looks like a big saucepan, I agree its nearly useless for anything beyond a small batch. If its a Villaware/Roma or other brand, they do work very well if you run the waste through a second time. With the latter, you can get juices out of most anything.

My daughter lives in Lancaster County, PA so I get all my canning supplies from an Amish store. I bought a Norpro Sauce Master. I think it works well, although I didn't try putting the leftovers through a second time. I'll try that next time. I didn't think it was important to get all the juice out, since you then have to boil it away anyway. Or is there another way to make the sauce thicker?

boil it away anyway. Or is there another way to make the sauce thicker?

Several prior discussions on this if you want to review them but basically it boils down to, yes. ;) You can let the juice separate and remove much of the water, you can add a can or 2 of tomato paste to the juice, you can use only certain varieties of plum tomatoes for a less watery mix, etc.

Personally, I just prefer the cooking down method myself.

Dave

Thanks, Dave. I keep learning. I think I'll try separating the water from the juice before boiling it down. It does add another waiting step to the process, though. And I'm so slow at all this as it is. We are still getting lots of tomatoes. Have another 40-50 lbs. to deal with today. I'm actually looking forward to the first frost.

Lynda

To get a thicker tomato sauce from the start, cut open each tomato and dig out most of the water and seeds as waste. Then run them through the strainer. This will usuaully give you a decnet thicker sauce that requires less cook down time. I prefer mostly meatier plum type tomatoes for making sauces.

Thanks, Ken. I scoop out the gel and seeds and save this for making vegetable stock. The sauce is pretty thick after putting through the mill. That's why I didn't put the skins through a second time. But I think I understand now why you might want to do that.

The waste still seems to have some goodness left in it, only because about 90% is sieved out. Running it through again will not clog or create any problems with the strainer.

Can you clear up another question I have had for a long time? Why do you have to cook the tomatoes before putting them through the food mill? It seems like it would be so much easier to put them through the mill first and then bring them to a boil and boil them down? Is it for safety reasons or to get the most out of the tomato?

You don't have to cook them first. It is optional with most mills. Some of us prefer to do it, some of us don't. But it is never required. Try it both ways and see which works best for you.

Dave

If you use a saucepan type Foley food strainer with the crank on top, its usually easier to soften them. That design is very slow and today the side crank type food strainers are much more efficient. You do NOT need to cook the tomatoes, or even expose them to any heat whatsoever to fun them through a Villaware/Roma strainer. I usually will cut them in halves though, just to dig out some of he watery liquid and some seeds. Doing this easy step helps to give a thicker sauce, which would probably need less cook down time.

The exact same question has been asked here many times in the past, and some people insist on cooking or blanching tomatoes prior to straining. It is not necessary and is just an extra laborous task that can be eliminated. The food strainers will remove all seeds and skins, and these get pushed out the narrower end of the conical sieve. For a harder thing like apples, it does make sense to partiall cook them but even there you can leave skins on, but dig out the seeds. Apples are quartered, and seeds removed, then a partial softening will help to get them through the strainer. This method is for apple sauce.

If your not familar with a Villware/Roma fod strainer, suggest that you do a search for the word 'Villaware', as it will bring up thousands of posts, as well as photos of the machine.

Thanks, guys. I was just concerned since so many recipes say to boil quartered tomatoes and then put through food mill. I didn't think it would make any difference but was afraid to deviate from the recipes. This sure will make my life easier. Frost tonight. So now I'm on to a bushel or two of green tomatoes. My favorite recipe is for green tomato relish. That should use up quite a few of them. I'm thinking of pickling the smaller ones. And trying out freezing slices prepared for fried green tomatoes I read about on one of the threads. Thanks again for all your help.

Add onions to the green tomato relish too. Helps balance out the flavor. The spices needed are mentioned in another thread if you care to add some.

My son and grandson visited for a week from California. Canning got put on hold, but we just finished the green tomato relish and it's wonderful! Thanks for the advice about the onions. Found a recipe that called for sweet peppers and onions. Used red bell peppers, so it not only tastes great, but looks beautiful, as well. Still so much to do. Have cabbage soaking in brine for sauerkraut. And just have to try the mint and herb syrups I read about on another thread. With so much to do, we don't have time to eat. But we'll have plenty this winter.

The vinegar seems to be working fine. I just keep adding vegetable and fruit peels as I go along. Should have enough vinegar to last a year of cleaning. The remains go into the compost. What fun!

Use care with that home made vinegar. Thats one reason many companies distill their vinegar products. Its not just for clarity. Home made, without a starter culture, you can end up with some bad components in it. Not sure what, but some inedble alcohols can also be present.

Making vinegar does not require much of anything. You can make it, tomato or apple or peach, without a starter, it just takes longer. The equipment needed is not expensive or special. A crock or fermenting bucket or mason jar. If using a mason jar, use a wide mouth if you have it. I used half gallon mason jars and a huge deli pickle jar.

If you wish to make tomato vinegar, and have any raw apple cider vinegar, add a tablespoon to the tomato starting.

I do not know why folks think this costs money.

As discussed above it isn't so much about the money issues as the safety issue. If all the vinegar you are making is for cleaning purposes, fine. But for food consumption and canning the safety of the methods used become an issue thanks to listeria.

Dave