Carol I can tell you that Dawn, and Tide do not adversely effect my hosta in the bogs.

Insecticidal soap is different from Dawn and Tide... It is for insects, not clothes, or dishes.

-Babka

Carol,

I don't have well water, but if I did I might be concerned about using Orthenex too.

I plan to spray Orthenex this weekend with gloves and mask on.

I found the following info about the toxicity of Orthenex.

SASSY

Here is a link that might be useful: Orthenex info

Hi Sassy,thank you for the info.
I hope you plan to were eye protection as well,sounds scarry.
I used Dr Bronners,soap concocktion yesterday, even though it was raining,i will use it again every other day till freeze,don't know if this is a good idea or not, but what the heck,it is only one hosta so far, and i will use this one as an experiment,i just can not see how the soap will get rid of these little buggers,but i am trying it any way.
Next year,if they are still there, i will pull the plant and get rid of it.
Good luck with yours,i hope Ortho, will do the job for you,Do you have a lot of infected hosta to deal with>I saw your sprayed,ha ha,you are armed and ready,you Do mean business!!
Keep us posted will you?And i will do the same.I hate these things!
Carol

I just inspected my hostas this morning and I'm truly impressed.
It's mid Sept and I'd safely say that I'm seeing at least 90% less nematode damage this year!

During the past two years I've heat treated, used ZeroTol, Merit and the Soap Spray.
Next I will spray with Orthenex.
Since I have 6 pints of the stuff and a 15 gal sprayer that I hook to a garden tractor, I will spray every plant I own, if they need it or not.
I'm determined!!!!!

I wish you would have tryed just one of the products alone don't you, so we would know which it was that did the trick.
This year, i will just use the soap spray,at least we will know next year if it did any good.
I will go out in a few hours to spray again, it is raining again today.
Good luck Sassy.
Carol

Raining like crazy here too, Carol.
I may have to postpone spraying the Orthenex tomorrow.
Yes, I really should have tried one product and stayed with it at least 2 years.
In the above post I forgot to mention the bleach/water overnight soak.
I think I've tried every thing that was ever recommended on this forum for nematodes.

Carol, can you PLEASE!! find somewhere else to buy your gardening supplies other than Walmarts? PLEASE? or there affiliates? (sams club) I beg you to spend your hard earned dollars somewhere else. Maybe on non imports? (dont want to start an up roar here) just asking

Paul

Hi Paul
May i ask your reason for you not wanting me to go to Wal Mart?
What "roar" would you be talking about?
I am very open minded,and try to be as "Green" as i can be.
I am listening. :0)
Carol

well, this isn't *green*, but might merit work as a systemic? ~~ just asking ~~

phy1345,
Yes, Merit is a systemic.

I believe that soap spray is a contact sort of spray. The evil doer has to be in contact with the spray. Nematodes are IN the leaf so I don't think that approach would work. Systemics, on the other hand, get sucked up with the plants juices and should do the trick. Soap spray never worked on leaf minors on my tomatoes here. It needs to touch them directly. Systemics appear to be the answer. Oh, and I don't really care where you buy it.

-Babka

Carol, Walmarts largest importer is China, Chinas largest exporter is Walmart (it is well over 60%of that countries exports) hmm lets see, sweat shops, child labor, 2months of work to buy a TV. Walmart doesnt really give a carp about there employees, espescially female management. There commercials look fine and dandy, but the hidden agenda is quite different. they are out to make money just like any other company, but they put american jobs at risk. Buy it overseas dirt cheap, and then sell it for a couple $'s less than a comparable product somewhere else. I try to buy as much AMERICAN MADE product that i can. I want to keep my neighbor employed. There is a documentary made about them that would really upset you.

Paul

Dammit!! my cat just YACKED on my rug!! now I have more laundry to do!!

Good news! Orthenex is made in the good ol USA.

Paul, that's just one reason I don't have house cats. LOL

(My 5 house dogs have their own vices though).

Hello every one ,
I have been gone for the week end,
Paul, i will look into the Wal Mart thing,i really do not like the idea od so many of our products coming from China.

Sassy, is Merit a poison as well?

Am i wasting my time with this Dr Bonners soap?
First thing i did after brin ging in the suit cases,was spray my soapy cocktail.Maybe i should just pull them now?

Sassy,you are sooooooo funny!

Carol

Oh My Goodness,
I just looked up Merit,why is it so expencive?
If i were to buy it, i only need a very small amount.
Does Merit work the same as Sevin?
Carol

Paul, maybe the cat has hair in his throat. Give him Petro-Malt. I have 5 cats and three Shelties. You are getting expert advice now. lol I know more about pets than I do hostas.

Thelma

Paul,
I was just wondering,do you have a list of American made products?Very interested.
Carol

Am i wasting my time with this Dr Bonners soap?

IMHO you are deluding yourself with insecticidal soap against nematodes. The only worms you'll kill with it are the ones that are ON the leaf, the ones IN the leaf and the rest of the plant will be unaffected. No matter how often you spray, there will always be more IN the plant than ON the plant.

Carol, Merit is also a systemic so it would be toxic.
I don't have the info on its toxicity, but it is a poison.
I used caution when I spread the granules.

pietertje,
Last year I had posted my thoughts on how Dr Bonners MAY work on killing the nematodes....
It wasn't an experiment, I was at my camper and just needed a shampoo so I washed my hair with the Dr Bonners soap that I had bought to make the insecticide mixture.
Well, it left my very curly hair poker-stick straight.
The residue left on my hair was unbelievable.
I had to rewash my hair several times with real shampoo to get the stuff off.
My conclusion was that the soap probably suffacates the worms.
What the mouthwash has to do with it I don't know.

My conclusion was that the soap probably suffacates the worms.

And I would have come to the same conclusion, in fact, that is the principle behind insecticidal soaps, suffocate the buggers! But, as I said above, they have to be ON the leaf before that can happen, the ones IN the plant (leaves, petioles, crown and roots) will not be affected by the soap. You have to keep spraying the stuff time and again in order to get to them as the migrate to the surface of the leaves, for instance when the leaves are wet from a shower or overhead watering and a film of water remains on the leaves for some period of time. But you never get them all, and you never get to their eggs with insecticidal soap. You might lessen the manifestation but you will never eliminate it using only insecticidal soap. Mouthwash usually has alcohol in it and presumably that is why it was used to help kill the buggers.

Insecticidal soaps work best for dealing with insects that live exclusively on the surface of the plant, be that leaves or petioles. So they work well with aphids, thrips and the like but using the soap to deal with worms that only come to the surface of the leaves under certain circumstances may give temporary symptomatic control at best. The treatment however never gets to where the buggers actually live and the infestation never gets eliminated. A degree of symptomatic control is all you get and if you feel happy with that, that's your perspective.

Pieter

PIM,
Thank you for responding,i knew some one here had used this method,i just could not remember who it was, i was going to start a new post to ask who it was. :0)
Like you, i only want to use organic things in my garden, for many reasons, one being, our well is in the middle of my biggest hosta garden.
Although, i do not judge any one who wishes to do so,i know sometimes it is nessessary to use chemicals.
I was talking to my best friend yesterday,her hubby is a farmer,she was telling me the cost of a certain chemical they use has gone up $9.00 a pound,where in times past,if it goes up at all, it is .50 or .90,she said it is a chemical you have to use or there would be no corn,they farm hundreds& hundreds of acres.
I also have a farmer friend who is 100% organic,but on a very,very,small scale.

Myself,i am happy you posted back,i was ready to give up on the soap,i will keep using it and report back next fall on the outcome.

Pieter:
I think if PIM has seen good results with the soap mixture,that is testiomny enough.Does it really matter,as long as they are not eating up your hosta,if you get to the root?As the eggs hatch, you can kill them on the surfase.
I know nothing about pesticides, or herbisides,as i am sure there are others the same, but,i find this forum, one of the Very Best, because we all share what has worked for us and what has not,and advice is given for those who want to use it, or not.
I learn every day from all of you.Sassy has tryed it all, now she is using Orthonex,she will let us all know the outcome.

Now, i gotta go spray. :0)

Carol

PIM, I was NOT trying to be rude, but I can be if you want me to. All I was trying to get across was that using the soap concoction CONTROLS the nematodes, you never completely eliminate them. In our gardening endeavours we all run a fine line between what we will and will not accept in terms of controlling pests. If you are prepared to live with control, that's your choice. If I want to eliminate and have to resort to using the heavy guns, that's my choice. In my personal situation with nematodes I am very fortunate in that I have never had nematodes in any plants planted in the ground, they only ever showed up in potted up plants. And with the micro environment in pots I am not concerned about the impact on the growing medium because the volume is so small. I'd have to do a major rethink of the process however if I were ever to find it in the garden beds.

We are all up in arms over HVX, and rightly so, but once discovered in your garden there is only one way to deal with: remove and destroy the infected plant. And that's pretty much the end of it since the virus cannot live for long outside the roots and crown. It's different with foliar nematodes and I venture that foliar nematodes are much more of a scourge than HVX since it would appear as if for most it is a matter of controlling them, rather than completely eradicating them. And not just because of what is used, but because of how the worms survive and migrate within the soil. Plus foliar nematodes affect more than just Hostas by the sounds of it.

Everyone's circumstance and perspective is different. If you felt offended by what I said, none was meant, I simply wanted to engage in an exchange of information and make sure all understood that 90%, while a great result, is not elimination of the problem. It is control only. And many would be very happy with that. Just not me, not in my circumstance with a very small, no, a minute, controlled environment. And I don't wish to engage in a discussion of what I'd do if I were to find them in the garden beds, I prefer to cross bridges when I get there.

Pieter

Carol, If you want the recipe you can do a search on insecticidal soap or PM me.

Pieter, Nems are an annoyance, I hope you never cross that bridge, although if you do its not the end of the world. There are many more important things in life than hostas.

And I do agree with your approach, if they weren't already in the soil I would definitely do the bleach solution soak. They were a free gift from a seller 2 years ago, came with a whole shipment of hostas (lucky me). My plants are getting larger and beautiful, I refuse to pour boiling water on 'Javelin', 'Northern Mist' or 'Powered by Bob", or dig them up and divide them, hence the spray recipe. This season they exhibit no tell-tale infestation, as do none of the other hostas in this bed. If they're back next year I'll spray again...I can live with that. And thanks for the note, glad you weren't trying to be rude.

PIM

PIM~ It sounds like nems are a huge problem for a lot of people. I wonder if any zone 4 growers are being affected by them yet????? Would you care to share the name of the grower who endowed you with this problem? This is my email if you don't want to broadcast it. Thanks. Mary (maryross22@mac.com)

Mary, I got my nems last year on a shipment from a lady in Quebec, and while I don't know exactly where she is, I have no doubt she'll be zone 4 at best, probably more like zone 3a. Foliar Nematodes do not get killed off by frost, they simply move deeper into the soil and survive on fungi. I have no doubt whatever that just because you're in zone 4 and get darned cold winters, you shouldn't lull yourself into a false sense of security over nematodes. I'm quite sure I've heard folks from MN talk about dealing with Foliar Nematode infestations. And they don't infest just Hostas, they're a scourge dealt with in many ornamentals.

Nematodes can overwinter in soil, infected dry leaves, and dormant buds. Snow acts as a insulation so depending on how cold it get's before the first measurable snow fall will play a roll in the survival of the nematodes over winter.

Hello my hosta buddies,
I hope you are all fine,today is a quiet,foggy,cool day here in Illinois,a good day to be finishing up my planting.

Hey,guess what,execpt for Friday and Saturday,i used the soapy mixture every day,sometimes two times a day,on my hosta with nematodes,there is no NEW damage to the hosta,now i do realize,that they are still present in the hosta,but i really like what i see so far.
I am hoping as the eggs hatch and they come out to eat, i can zap them, eventually, they will have to all be dead -won't they-?
I am also finding that this hosta seems to be standing up taller than my other hosta,i do find this interesting.
I will keep up with the soapy spray,and in the spring,continue till fall of next year,we will all see what has happened.So far, i am happy with what i see,and no chemicals used,for me, this is a must, my well,and my pond are right by my hosta.

By the way, are you all cought up on your planting,what planes do you have for fall,maybe another post for this one huh?Ok, i will do that now.

Carol