First off, FEAR the wandering jew! I bought one with my ATB and it stood maybe 3 inches higher than the pot. In a month it reached the top of my tank (12" or so) and I pulled all the branches down to make them hang. They then turned and grew up again. I now have a rediculous number of S shaped branches arching up and down, not to mention all the cuttings that fell and rooted :)

As for the waterfall, there are probably a million ways to do it. I suppose I would build substrate up to maybe 16" or 20" inches in one corner, and hide the pump inside it. I've only been to one rainforest, and only to one waterfall in it, but it was a granite face going up a hundred feet or so, with large scattered rocks at the base and following along the sides of the stream. How hard can it be to find a one foot long piece of granite? granite countertop scrap maybe? just embed it in a hill of substrate and poor the water over it. For guiding the flow, maybe use epdm pond liner covered in rocks? Even cheaper might be splitting some scrap 4" PVC length-wise and useing it as a trough. It should be easy enough to hide if you build substrate to the sides and put sand or gravel in it. There is always fiberglass, but it will probably set you back a few dollars. But I found that resin for boat hulls (most autoparts stores have it) is a fantastic substance when paired with fiberglass cloth. You could even put gravel on the uncured topcoat of resin to make it look stone-ish. I think a granite slab stuffed into the face of a hill of substrate, and epdm rubber for the streams would probably look great, and be fairly easy to make and modify. If not granite, maybe find a natural looking floor tile at a home improvement store. I think this is going to be a long thread :)

-DH

Hi
You'll definitely want to have it low enough to access easily.Don't have to keep terrariuns very long to learn this lol. Still think they look better taller than wide but aquariums are a lot easier to come by.lol. I decided to go ahead and use a 150 as the base for my new project. i lost my Marine aquaeium last year due to the lights being out for 22 days. Think I'll just give up on it as it would cost a fortune to start over and i have too much stuff anyway. Had finally got started on the new setup and was told that my orange trees have citrus canker!!
They all have to be destroyed. Don't mind losing the trees so bad but I have 50 orchids growing on them which will have to be removed and repotted. Great timing as I have the shadehouse torn up for repairs and the new project
Have no idea where I'm going to put them lol. I have no other shady areas. Always something lol
gary

Sahoya, got a basic layout plan for my tank when I have the right tank and lighting, maybe you could do something similar.

Just email me and I'll link you the plan if you're interested.

RP1

I think you might be interested in a method I have been thinking of for a water fall feature, Ill try my best to describe it to you, it would be a water fall with a "cave" behind it, you build your false bottom first (pvc eggcrate)then in whatever corner/side you chose you build a frame, this frame will be the "skeleton" for your water fall,build it to be a cave,keeping in mind that when complete the water will be falling down and in front of this cave, make it caddy corner or directly on the side wall of the tank,(I think caddy corner would look best) you can make the opening to the cave as wide and as tall as you want, remember to be creative! this is your baby! you place the pump on the opposite side of the tank, where you will place a piece (or several pieces) of egg crate in the rear corner of the tank, again caddy corner,make it from the bottom of the tank up to the top of the tank, so that when you look directly down from the top of the tank, the shape behind the egg crate is a triangle, understand? make sure that the space behind the egg crate (the triangle) is large enough to allow your pump to be easily pulled up and easily lowered back in, that will be your access area, allowing you to clean/replace the pump when/if needed with out disturbing the tank and the inhabitants, you run the hose from the pump inside and at the bottom of the access area up to the top of the tank, then fold the hose at the top of the tank and send it back down the access area, the reason for this is to have enough hose to pull the pump up and out of the area when needed, then you simply run the hose along the bottom of the tank under the false bottom and up to the top of your water fall, there you will place your choice of "basin", slate, natually bowl shaped stone, driftwood, or whatever you want your water to run off of, you glue the hose in place with brown silicone at the spot where you want the water to begin filling your "basin" also use brown silicone to hold your basin in place, let it dry, then, starting from the bottom, begin to add the expanding foam, building the "muscle" of the skeleton as you go up, (remember to add the right size pots onto the frame using wire ties before starting the foam)cover the entire cave area in foam, not thick! just enough to cover the frame, them let the foam dry over night and add your favorite cover or "skin" if you will, I like coco fiber, I described the method of application in an earlier posting, you will do the entire back of the wall (if you like) using this method, that way the whole tank (back ground) looks full and complete, you can make your rivers and ponds using this same method also, just use small gravel for the river bottom instead of coco fiber, then you can let the rivers drain at the other end of the tank. Please let me know if this might work for you, also if I failed to accurately describe any part, please let me know and I will try harder! LOL! I will post pictures of the access area on my tank soon, hopfully tommorrow. =^)-

Well, I looked around on the 'net for pics of the actual rainforest, and I totally fell in love with buttress trees! So I've decided to build a large buttress tree in one corner of the tank, with it's roots spreading out over most of the tank. This will allow me lots of space for epiphytes, and also lots of interesting stuff for the froggies to hop on and over and around, etc. So thanks for all the great ideas on the waterfall thing, but I don't think it will work with this new idea. Sorry! =)

I also decided that I for sure do not want to deal with the hassle of this huge aquarium. You're so right gary, it's just not worth it! Especially if I want to keep PDFs in it eventually, and then I have to be opening it every day to feed them fruit flies and whatnot. . . forget it! We're keeping the stand though. Once the tank is sold (it's currently housing all of my smaller houseplants, so it looks nice and my cat can't eat the plants! =) But I definitely found out how much of a pain it is to reach down into the thing. . .), I'll get a terrarium made that fits the stand's footprint, but is taller than the fishtank, and opens in the front. This means that the tank will be about 30 x 67 x 36" tall. The only thing I really don't like about front-opening terr's is the line that you get down the middle of the view with the sliding or hinged glass doors. Though judging by that pic of the two 30 gal tanks on top of each other, the line isn't nearly as obtrusive as I'm worried it will be.

Anyways, now my dilemma is how in incorporate a water feature with this buttress tree. I want the tree in the back right-hand corner of the tank. It's roots will meander around, filling up most of the right side of the tank. I'd like a multi-level stream in the tank as well though. So I don't know where it should originate, or where it should go. I think it will end up in a fork of tree roots, forming a small pool there for the frogs to sit in if they want to. And something tells me that the origins of the stream shouldn't be really obvious, but more hidden. How does one accomplish this? I might also have some tree roots coming in from the left side of the tank, as if there were a tree further away, just to balance things out, and I guess the stream could originate from behind one of them or something. Another dilemma is how to avoid making this stream look like a mini river like my old waterfall-stream waterfeature. Some pics I've seen on the 'net have the streams running through hollow logs, but I don't think that would work in such a large tank. So how to make this look like a rivulet running over the forest floor after a rain?

Hi
A couple of trees I might suggest are Bald Cypress and
Guiana chestnut as well as Ficus benjamina. All three
can be dwarfed easily and develop adult characteristics quickly.They also can be cultured without media by training in shagnum moss for a few months. The cypress will develop "knees" at about 6 months and as soon as that happens water level can be raised. One problem with all three is that I've never been able to maintain them under 24 inches with this method,unlike true "Bonsai"
The ficus will develop aquatic roots and will stabilize
by attaching to the glass. Of course you can't just go down to the nursery and put them in water. They also have to be root pruned until aerial roots develop. Strangler figs would also be interesting but have never tried them.
Your probably wise going for a real terrarium setup instead of using the 180 aquarium especially for access.
I'm going to go ahead and use my 150.
1 I already have it
2 I want a river tank
3 i plan on a drip wall behind it to extend to the roof. So actually the whole setup will be around 8x12 feet.
4 This will be large enough for me .My wife said so lol.
As to the dividing lines for doors in your setup. I've yet to figure a way around that . If done without frames as in the two thirties it shouldn't be too intrusive.
You might try those dutch or wildsky websites they have a lot of pix for inspiration.
gary

What about if you had a cavity directly underneath the tree and you had the stream coming out from underneath the tree, with the tree roots obscuring the streams source?

Maybe you could have a wider stream filled with small bark chips, silicone bed underneath it, problem is, you probably wouldn't even see the stream?

Only rainforest I've been in was more mountainous than woody so the only thing I'd presume for a waterfall would be a multi stage rock waterfall, with small steps every few inches, with a tree at the source and a pool at the bottom.

RP1

Ive been to the rain forest in Puerto Rico twice so far, its very beautiful and full of ideas for terrariums, I have pics but depend on my daughter to post pics for me since Im a computer idiot! LOL! There are caves/sink holes with underground water falls and rivers, in one the water actually comes out of the ground at the very top (at least 300 feet)of the sink hole, there are an assortment of mosses and plants that the water passes or should I say, trickles, right over so by the time the water gets to the bottom the plants have filtered it to the point of it being totally drinkable! which we did!(The guide does an excellent job describing this and other facts) at the enterance to the rain forest there is a water fall that seems to come right out of the ground but I have never been to the top so I dont know this to be fact, as soon as my daughter returns from her adventures I will have her post some of the pics, I would advise any one who takes a trip to Puerto Rico not to miss it! We also went swimming in a phosphorous bay lined with mangrove trees! (I bought some back with me,legally!) When disturbed the microscopic crustations give off a light something like a firefly, so whatever movement we made left a glowing wake behind us! We had to go at night so that the light created by the crustations was very visable, I hope you get some ideas from the pics! =)

iliketerrariums: nice pics! I LOVE to moss-covered rocks! That's one thing I'd love to have in my terr for sure.

RP1: cool idea about the cavity underneath the tree. I'll think about that one some more. . .

gary: "This will be large enough for me. My wife said so." LOL!!! I can totaly relate! To your wife, that is. =) My husband is the same way with his reef tanks. . .

I was actually thinking of making a fake tree out of styrofoam, eggcrate, expanding foam, and that peat/coir/bonder mix that the dutch use. I did originally think of growing a ficus for the tank, but I'm too impatient for that (and too inexperienced at bonsai), and I don't want the ongoing maintenane of root pruning, etc. Thanks for the tree suggestions though! Now I know what to try when I have more time to study bonsai!

Still hoping someone buys the whole set-up (there is actually one interested buyer), but I also look forward to eventually having such a big tank to work with. Even if only the tank is sold, the stand is extremely useful storage space, and since it's so big, lots of stuf fits in it! So far my husband has all of his saltwater stuff in there, and I have two large jugs of RO water, and there will be more space once the guy who bought the pump picks it up. At any rate, it will be quite a while until we have enough money for me to get such a large terr, but I think that's a good thing. Gives me lots of time to plan it out properly, something I always wished I'd done with my 85 gal terr. And kids will take up most of my time from now on anyways. =)