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galleyrat

Exhaust(ed)

14 years ago

For a very slight kitchen redo, I am about to commit hari kari on my chef's knife re the exhaust situation. If that could be resolved, then the rest of the redo will fall into place. I am not gutting and moving walls and starting over, I'm simply adding on. I am doing this to get better exhaust, an added peninsula for more counter space, new granite counters,and better lighting. All electronics are electric not gas.

1. Current ductless (recirculating) OTR microwave combo sucks. No actually that's the problem. It DOESN'T suck! I do not remember having this problem at a former house with a ducted OTR situation, but from what I've read here, the OTR micro exhaust (even ducted) is just one step above opening a window. This appliance is not on an exterior wall. I only have the one wall to work with.

2. Main reason for kitchen redo is to add DUCTED exhaust and a peninsula off of one of my counters. Exhaust has to go down to crawlspace, cannot go up due to finished floor above, and 3 different KDs have recommended this as the most reasonable and economical method. I understand this is not perfect, but this part is not up for discussion. I am fine with getting a blower down there in the crawlspace to help move things along and to make it quieter. I'm not sure what that's exactly called but for my purposes here, I'll call the crawlspace blower an in-line blower. I am roughly at the 30 foot mark that apparently decides whether you need that in-line blower to help move the exhaust. First question: If I go without the in-line blower and then find I need one, can it be added after the fact? Or should I just do it all now? Next question: Can you take a Micro exhaust combo and use the in-line blower to beef up the exhaust? Frankly the OTR Micro and slide-in range is just how the current kitchen is laid out and certainly would be the easiest design to continue with.

3. Recommended by one KD: install a telescopic downdraft, replace free standing range with (electric) cooktop, putting a micro/convection/Advantium whatever kind of thing up where the current micro exhaust combo (i.e over the to-be-installed new electric cooktop) and install an oven in the to-be-built peninsula. Questions: According to all that I've read here the telescopic downdrafts really are not all that great EITHER. What about with an in-line blower? I cook stinky ethnic foods, the usual garlic, curries, etc. Not greasy foods, but of course I do boil water and there's the steam. Currently my whole house smells for days with whatever I've cooked. I realize I now have The World�s Worst Exhaust situation (re-circulating) and that anything will be an improvement, but I would like to pick the best compromise. Also won�t whatever appliance I put above the cooktop still get all steamy and yucky like it currently does above the cooktop? Or does a downdraft at least work well enough for that to not happen? Then addressing moving an oven over to the peninsula: I had wanted this to be my prep/work area. Do I really want to work in front of a potentially hot oven? Won�t the handle stick out and make it impossible for me to sidle up flush to the counter to work?

4. Would a better option be to put a slide in range in and then an under cabinet exhaust hood where the OTR microwave is now? And then I�ll have to figure out what to do with the freaking microwave. Is there any any any any way to have an under cabinet exhaust fan with an OTR Micro up there somewhere? I just do not see any other place in this tiny kitchen to put a microwave. I do not want to bend over in the peninsula to use the microwave, so don't recommend that! I'm keeping the cabinets, but would be willing to add something like a shelf to get a micro off the counter. Figuring an in-line blower for any appropriate exhaust situation, is an under-cabinet exhaust fan better than the telescopic downdraft?

HELP! I'm stuck.

Thanks for all the impressive stuff I've read here to at least get me this far to even know what questions to ask.

GalleyRat

Comments (7)

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Yes, my experience has been that downdraft is mostly ineffective (and I am being polite) no matter how you slice it.

    Just curious, why can't you go up? I assume you have 10 to 12 inches of floor joist between the kitchen ceiling and the subfloor of the level above, why couldn't you put a duct in that and send it parallel to the joists out of the house?

    Drywall is cheap and can be patched and painted very easily by any worthwhile contractor. If it's a possibility, go through the ceiling and straight out the side.

    Our kitchen walls and ceiling were like Swiss cheese when we did our remodel. Scary how fast they put it all back together.

    -Stooxie

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    you can have all three :
    a big catchment / capture canopy overhead over the cooktop, and
    a big inline motor (ie.e. remote) and
    ducting traveling down the interstud cavity of the wall, down into the crawlspace.

    see my two posts in the general thread about Hoods.

    Here is a link that might be useful: ducting Downhill inside a wall is childs play

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Stooxie's solution can be a good one. If there is some reason to preclude it, such as where it would end up, is there any way to take a hood and duct it to the crawl space? While there is some pressure loss at each bend, a suitable in-line blower should be able to make up for it and aid the blower, if any, in the hood.

    kas

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Sorry so long on the replies, but got a bug or something and have been laid up for DAYS.
    Hey Stooxie, this is how the exhausting up v down situation has been explained to me: I cannot go up because the joists are running in the wrong direction. There is no wall running so that I could duct with the joists--there is a stairwell involved as well. Is there an UP way around this, or are 3 people (from various companies) ALL wrong? I know with enough money ANYTHING can be done, however, all 3 people said that it would take something close to an act of God to make the up exhaust happen. NOW I find out that you can't duct the OTR micro down anyway--it looses whatever suck it does have, so I am back to square one.
    My only options: separate out the various range parts (exhaust, oven, cooktop) in order to get a telescoping downdraft exhaust that's only slightly better than a micro hood and costs a fortune and I can put the blower in the crawlspace OR If I get a hood (thank you Davidro1 for the link...very helpful) and downdraft it then I have absolutely no place for the microwave unless I put it on a micro cart--you know the carts of yore olden times!
    I am totally at a loss here. I honestly would not mind considering spending the $$ on the telescoping downdraft option if it worked. But according to what I've read here, they just don't. So what to do? I currently have a free-standing range now. If I split out the range into pieces parts, I end up with having to build 2 cabinets (I have a teeny kitchen with, get this, custom made cabinets -- prior owners/builders must have been sniffing glue) one for the cooktop and another one to hold the wall oven. I can't build out a wall to hold the wall oven because, again, all the walls are taken or are doorways, walkways or bay windows. Wow....what a dilemma.

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Can you post a sketch? Even if the kitchen is in the middle of the house you should be able to reach an outside wall even if there is a stairwell involved. There are several engineers who regularly post to this site and one of them may be able to offer you a solution. In our case we ripped the entire kitchen ceiling out and moved the electric boxes where we wanted them. Then we replaced the ceiling with plywood and installed a tin ceiling over it. I used the option to use small screws to install which came in handy when we got our CC range and switched from a crappy recurculating hood to a vented hood. I simply unscrewed the affected sections of tin, cut the hole for the 8" duct and replaced the sections. I agree, sheetrock is cheap, rip out as much as you need to and replace and retape it. Don't worry about the texture, scrape it all off. Texture was developed to cover shoddy workmanship. Smooth ceilings are classier, especially with crown moulding, they are easier to clean too. As long as you prefer electric, do look in to induction. I am a gasser myself, but if I had to go electric I would go with induction, it is as much above smooth or coiltop electric as open burners are above sealed gas burners.

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    I would listen to Davidro on this one. The folks who came to your home were probably right. This has nothing to do with drywall, but with the ceiling joist direction. Unless you can run the ducting in between the joists and have it go to an outside wall you will have to go down.

    The only exception would be if you have high ceilings, then you can run the duct across the ceiling and suspend a second ceiling below the duct work. And you can use rectangular ducting and maybe only lose 6 inches of ceiling height.

    However, if that's not possible, and the range is against a wall, just install whatever hood you like and run the duct inside the wall between the wall studs- going down. Again it will be rectangular ducting, probably 10x4 inch(or have it made to fit the space as David suggested). Once you hit the crawl space just send it outdoors like it was a dryer vent- of course it has to come out above ground.

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Ok, so now that we've determined that the downdraft is the sensible way to go (sorry Caddidaddy, your way seems pretty involved, and the run to make that happen would be very very long and end up exhausting on the front of the house) what have you peeps done with your OTR Microwave situation when you've replace your OTR with a hood? Where did you put your new micro? I want a convection/micro combo. There is no option of replacing any upper cabinets with deeper ones to hold the micro, I don't want it in lower cabinets, so it seems as tho' this only leaves the countertop as an option. I realize the telescoping downdraft thingie is an option and would thus leave room above for an OTR micro, but that solution causes TWO new cabinets to have to be built to hold separate cooktop and wall oven. I would really prefer a stand-alone or slide-in range below the new undercabinet hood.
    Thanks for all of your really speedy replies.