lizh,

Thank you for the recommendation. Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but I don't find any threads titled "Q on spring cushions" when I do a search for that...

Here's the thread. I think it was worded slightly differently so that's probably why the search didn't find it. Its still on page 1 here.

Here is a link that might be useful: Springs in Cushions

Thank you, lizh. It sure is a complicated matter!

It is, but at least we have choices! In general I would not get all down or all foam. I would get a combination of materials - spring down is great and poly down is very good too.

I got a nice lesson on all this from a salesperson at Boyles. They had the "cutaway - see through" seat cushions with all the different materials inside to see and now I finally understand it!

Hi celiaanne,

Have you made your choice? Which? Reasons?

I have the same decision to make with Austin.

wb

Hi Whistle,

Funny you should ask. I just received the sofas yesterday. I went with the spring down for the seat cushions and standard for the back. This is what Nancy at Elite Interiors suggested. From what I remember Nancy said, the foam would be the best for the back because it wouldn't slouch and the spring down would be best for the seat as they are soft and resilient. They don't do the spring down for the back cushions. This is all a little hazy now after almost 6 months, but I'm pretty sure that was what she said.

They are now sitting in my living room (they are for the family room), so I haven't had a chance to sit on them much, but they are very comfortable as far as I can tell. I guess I'll have to wait to see how they hold up.

Congratulatons, celiaanne,

Which sofa did you get? Leather selection?
Would you share Nancy's telephone at Elite?

If you prefer, you could email me at "My Page".
Did you get the best price at Elite for your selection?

Thanks, wb

Hi WB,

I got 2 of the (shorter) City Sofas in Mahogany in the Cavalier Class 2 Protected leather.

Nancy is no longer with Elite, and I dealt with Christine after ordering. Everything went well. She responded to my emails quickly, etc. The contact # is: 843.449.3588 and web is http://www.elitefurnituregallery.com/. Lexington Furniture originally beat Elite's price slightly, but Elite met it, and I decided to go with them.

Good luck!

Hi celiaanne,

Now that you have had a while to enjoy your sofa,
do you like the spring down cushions?

WB

celiaanne,

Could you give me your opinion about your spring down
cushions after you have had them to enjoy?

I am close to ordering and you are a good source
for my comparison. My sale runs out shortly.

Thanks in advance,
WB

Hi Whistler,

So sorry I missed your questions. I am sure it is too late to help you with your decision, but just FYI, I really like my sofas, including the cushions.

Did you order/receive yours yet?

Standard Cushions are best for Hancock and Moore.

Ultras are very soft, however you tend to sink in them too much.

Spring Downs are very comfy, but don't age well and cause hundreds of cracks in the leather surface over time.

dcollie,

Thanks for the info on the H&M cushions. What H&M leather do you have that developed hundreds of surface cracks with the Spring Down cusions? I'm wondering if it is a combination of the leather you choose with the spring down. Do you own another piece with the standard cushions or are you saying if you had to do it all over you would purchase the standard cushions in the future?

I'm a retailer for not only Hancock and Moore, but Brad-Young and Leathercraft as well. I've seen all the cushions from all the makers and while the Spring Down is the nicest out of the box (in comfort) it flexs so much that the leather develops hundreds of cracks over time, making it unsightly.

If you put a unprotected, all-natural hide on spring down, it would cut the hairline cracks down considerably. These are class III and IV hides in H&M, and not suitable for hard use.

Wow, I have never heard of the spring down cushions causing this. Thanks for the heads-up. Has anyone else experienced this? I certainly would want a protected leather.

I just purchased a H&M sofa, and the salesperson was telling me the same thing about the spring down causing cracks. The sofa I purchased is a protected class II leather and has the foam wrapped in down. I'm not sure if that is the standard H&M foam sofa cushion or if the down wrap is an upgrade. In any event it is soft enough for me. The sofa sits great. I'm looking forward to the delivery.

I contacted H&M and asked about the problem with leather, especially unprotected leather, and the spring down cushions. I relayed the info regarding the cracking. While she said that she hadn't heard of a problem with cracking of the leather with spring down cushions, she did say that when the CEO chose to include the sping down cushion in their line, he did have it in mind for use with fabic. She agreed that they recommend using their standard Qualux cushion for leather.

Exactly.

Here's the thing....go sit on a spring down cushion and you notice its very flexible. On the edges, back, all over. Perfect for fabric, that moves and stretches.

Leather does not move and stretch like fabric. So what happens when you sit on it? You are forcing the leather to move beyond its limited range, and that causes stress to the material.

All protected leathers have surface topcoating. Think of it as paint. Unprotected leathers have little or no topcoating.

If you paint a piece of notebook paper and then start flexing it, what happens to the paper? Does it tear or rip? No.... but the paint gets hairline cracks in it from exceeding the elasticity of the coating. Now, if you take that same paint and put it on a piece of posterboard, and flex the poster board some, what happens? Nothing, because the poster board is more supportive and not as flexible.

The more supportive your foundation, the less your top material flexes. That's why standard cushions are designed firmer and more supportive on the edges to mimimize that flex and keep your leather piece looking better as it ages.

dcollie,

Thank you so much for warning us about pairing spring down cushions with leather. Neither of the stores I went to even mentioned it.

I'm wondering if you have any advice on which leather to choose. There are so many options. I'd like to purchase the Dawson Chair and Ottoman (#1516 and #1515). There is a photo on their website under the "room settings" page. I've attached a link. I like the clean lines of the chair and the leather looks exactly like what I am looking for. H&M tells me it is Payson Tobacco. However, when I look up Payson leather on the website, they describe it as a three-tone leather. It doesn't appear to me that way in the photo or on the swatch I saw at the store. I would like a leather with a "clean" look to it. I don't want an "antiqued" look with a lot of markings. Do you know if Payson would fit the bill. I was told that Cavalier, Caress and Document are popular leathers. Oh, and since I have young kids and a dog, I want a protected leather that will stand up to my family. Any advice you have would be greatly appreciated.

Here is another photo in addition to the link below:
http://hancockandmoore.com/html/largeshot2.cfm?&Stylenum=1283%20Room%20Setting&Which=room.cfm

Thanks so much.

Here is a link that might be useful: Dawson Chair in Payson Tobacco

Payton is a nice hide. Class III, and is protected. It has a hand-rubbed accent to it which is not the same as distressed.

Caress and Document are Class II's, very popular and do not have the hand-rubbed accents to them.

-Duane

Karsha,

Duane is much more knowledgeable than I, but my sofa is a chocolate brown that looks like the picture you reference, and I was told that it is Berkshire Harness/Class II protected leather. It's very uniform in its color. The number of leather choices is mind numbing. Of course I bought mine off the floor so I only had one choice: buy it or walk away.

tocohillsguy,

"The number of leather choices is mind numbing."

Boy, you can say that again! I will certainly add the Berkshire to my list of swatches to pay close attention to. I seems much harder to select a leather from a swatch then a fabric.

Thanks so much!

One thing to do when you look at leather swatches is to remember that it's not vinyl, so the colors from what you see on the swatch to what you get on your ordered piece will vary considerably. If exact color tone is important, request a 'cutting for approval' of the hides that will be used in your piece. This will delay your production order two to three weeks, but will assure you the exact color of your finished piece. If you can tolerate a 10% variance high/low in the colors, then you can skip that step.

More tips when looking at leather swatches:

* Get away from the floresent or mercury lighting. In my store, I have two rooms set up with incandesant lighting (such as you have in your home). I ask all my customers to take their swatches in there for final approval as it affect the colors greatly.

* Pull the swatch tight over your knee as you sit. This will more accurately reflect how it will look on your furniture.

* Some leathers are 'pull-ups'. They change color intensity going around the corners of the piece. To see if you are working with this kind of leather, dig your fingertips into the backside of the swatch and then force them up. If the color changes, you have a 'pull-up'. This can make for some interesting surprises if you weren't expecting it on your piece.

* Leather swatch samples are taken from the whole hide, including the neck and belly of the cow, which are highly wrinkled. It's expensive for the makers to swatch, so they use the bad parts of the hide as samples that you won't get on your finished product. Fot that reason, look at all the samples from a given maker in that swatch sample (example, all colors of Document, or all colors of Caress) and see if they are all patterned or wrinkled. Average them out in your mind.

Finally, Finished leathers are basically painted leathers. Aniline are vat-dyed. Finished are easier to clean but not as supple, Anilines are beautiful, but will sun-fade and be less spill tolerant as a whole.

Have fun!

How does Thomasville's "Benjamin" sofa compare to the Handcock and Moore Sofa? Has anyone had any personal experience with how the "Benjamin" sofa holds up? I am looking at it in "double fudge" leather, which is a semi-aniline leather with a mottled finish. I am wondering how the leather will look in a few years. Currently, I am looking for a nice family room leather furniture set that is very comfortable. What kind of spring system does the Handcock and Moore sofa have? I have 8 way hand tied springs on my living room sofa, and they are very comfortable. Thomasville's sofa has a sinuous spring. Will it be comfortable and hold up well long term? Also, will the piping around edges on the top and the bottom of the cushions on the "Benjamin" sofa hold up long term and be comfortable? Is there a Hancock and Moore or other sofa that is similar to the "Benjamin" Sofa color and style wise? Thomasville's "Benjamin" sofa has piping around the seat cushions. I have heard that that wears through quickly? Is that correct even with a good quality leather? Does anyone know anything about "USA Leather" sofas that have individual pocketed coils in the seat cushions and have a down topper pocket sewn in the top of the cushion on the inside. I think that the pocketed coils sit more firm, which I don't like, generally like foam core cushions, but don't like the way the leather looks stretched out on foam cushions. Is there a way to prevent this in foam core cushions? Also, I would like to re-direct my current sofa to another room in our home. The leather is faded but not worn through. Is there a way to dye the leather back to it's original color again. It was not a very expensive sofa and was made by Leather Trends/Leather Mart. It did not have piping, and the edges have held up very well. It is just the color of the leather--fading issue that is the problem. The color is "picasso brandy," which is kind of a browned burgundy. Can anyone offer any suggestions on what I can do to make my sofa set look a little better color wise?