HVAC are machines, just a like a car.

Air source heat pumps can fail and have breakdowns. Compressors can fail and have breakdowns.

Greenspeeds HP systems are a good alternative in cold climates where nat gas is not available and the usual fuel choices are heating oil and propane, both very expensive.

Greenspeed systems in price fall between conventional HP systems and geothermal.

Greenspeeds have only been on the market for a short period of time so there is no evidence as far as breakdowns that they are better or worse to conventional HP systems. One caveot. They must be installed by certified Greenspeed installers who have gone to class. The only issue I know about is sound. Go to you tube and search for Carrier Greenspeed heat pump noise issues. Can't say if this is a system issue or an install issue. They are supposed to be very quiet. If you are considering a Greenspeed, I suggest you get some references from your quoting dealer on recent installs and perhaps go visit to see for yourself.

You must have a complete new system with the Greenspeed, both outside condenser and inside air handler.

IMO

This post was edited by tigerdunes on Fri, Jan 24, 14 at 7:41

If you decide on the Greenspeed system, then I strongly recommend having a Carrier Factory Authorized Dealer do the installation. These dealers are required to have training on Carrier products. You also have an additional guarantee that if an problem is not corrected to your satisfaction, the equipment will be removed and your money will be refunded during the first year.

I would also recommend purchasing the Carrier 10 year labor warranty. I generally am not the type to purchase extended warranties. However with this equipment the warranty will pay for itself if you have one repair over the 10 year period.

I would be curious to know which techs had a negative opinion about the Greenspeed heat pump. My guess they sell a competing product and using scare tactics to make a sale.

Agree with Mike.

Not a fan of extended warranties either. Strictly optional. But if you elect an ext warranty, it should be through the manufacturer, not a third party warranty that is close to being worthless.

IMO

Hello greengirl_va,

I have a greenspeed heatpump, one month old. I have two problems with the unit:

- Extreme noise in cold days, we could hear the noise from 100 ft. I do also hear the noise from the inside (like in an airplane).
On carrier web site it said that the noise level is 58dba with * near the number, I did not check what the * means when I was making a decision, once I saw the noise problem, I went to double check and found out that the 58dba is the lowest noise level :) . now they changed the web site and it is saying "Sound: as low as 58 decibels"
- Backup system is working on cold days at the same time as the heat pump ( I was told that the this heat pump will heat the house until -7.6F, not correct ). so I am not sure it is that efficient as advertised.

Not to get distracted from OP, but previous poster should also check you tube that I suggested. It seems there is an issue with noise on the heating side. This is not acceptable. Another forum member several mths ago posted about this noise issue and also uploaded a video. Clearly this is not acceptable. Forum member has since reported that Carrier replaced his GreenSpeed condenser after dealer initially said it was normal. Anyone listening to the sound would know it was not.

IMO

I have one client that I consulted for that installed a Greenspeed that has had bona fide noise problems. The compressor and inverter board were replaced and the client is now satisfied. I visited the home after the repairs were effected on a day when the temperature was not warmer than +5F and the HP was VERY quiet!

In extremely cold climates such as ours, Greenspeeds are up sized by one ton to ameliorate the noise factor and to provide greater cold weather efficiency. This can be done because the compressor can the throttled way back in A/C mode so that the system is not otherwise over sized in cooling mode and good dehumidification can take place.

I know this is against âÂÂconventional wisdomâ to size larger but itâÂÂs recommended procedure here where the temperatures with wind chills have been around -40F/C this week.

I would install Greenspeed if I were not installing geothermal. However, the 10-year labor warranty is a MUST!

Hope this helps.

IMPO

SR

Where are you located fsq4cw??? And how would your advice about sizing up affect those of us in somewhat less cold climates? What price increase per ton can one expect?

In answer to all the rest of you, we are talking about installation by a trained licensed dealer in both brands, so no problem there. Obviously cost is the first consideration, but throwing out perfectly working air handler to replace a whole system is offensive. Is there any kind of general guide to how long a top of the line air handler should last?

As for the Greenspeed, beyond the huge costs, no disputing the claims at all, only whether its complexity can add to the possibility of things going wrong. And thus the question of why there are no labor warranties over a year??

Keep the thoughts coming guys, please!

âÂÂWhere are you located?âÂÂ

IâÂÂm located in Montreal, Canada so our winters may be much more severe than yours. The cost differential to up size say from 3 ton to 4 ton would be about $2k but that also includes up grading to a larger size fan coil unit as well. Not up sizing will still do the job and may not be necessary, depending on your location. Up sizing in severe winter climates is not something done on the initiative of the dealer alone just to âÂÂmake more moneyâ but has been decided in concert with consultations with the regional offices of Carrier Canada.

âÂÂAs for the Greenspeed, beyond the huge costs, no disputing the claims at all, only whether its complexity can add to the possibility of things going wrong.âÂÂ

This is still a relatively new product and while I do believe in the principal of the technology and would install this in my own home, for me personally, the jury is still out as I have only limited historical data at this point in time regarding energy savings and long term reliability. However, all modern, energy efficient systems are far more complex than their predecessors and therefore may not, by their very nature have neither the reliability nor the length of life cycle we would otherwise expect. Labor warranties beyond 1-year are usually an option because this is a very expensive item to include by the installing company and while it may generate some up front income for the dealer, it is not generally a moneymaker from what I see. Extended labor warranties are by far a better deal for the purchaser than for the dealer in my estimation.

âÂÂthrowing out perfectly working air handler to replace a whole system is offensive.âÂÂ

Personally, what is offensive is wasting energy with older technology that is well beyond its âÂÂbest before dateâÂÂ!

IMO

SR

fsq4cw,

âÂÂthrowing out perfectly working air handler to replace a whole system is offensive.âÂÂ

Personally, what is offensive is wasting energy with older technology that is well beyond its âÂÂbest before dateâÂÂ!

Absolutely great response and spot on!

The air handler is only 5 years old and is the top of the line York one (AVG), not some 20 year old has been.... I know that I did not state that at first, so sorry! One of the main concerns is that it is 5 years sold and even if matched with a new York outdoor unit, it is 5 years old. Obviously, going that route is cheaper by a lot but does wind up with only half a new system. Does this help?

Going with the Greenspeed, if all goes well will result in less energy use, but by how much really and taking how long to play catch up. All points are valid here and we are just trying to do the right thing and not go broke doing it!

The high Seer 20 & HSPF 13 for the Greenspeed is based on the complete system, HP, fan coil & T-stat - all MUST be replaced! This is a âÂÂcommunicatingâ system where all the components provide detailed data to each other. Keeping your old fan coil unit is NOT an option.

Basically youâÂÂre either âÂÂall inâ or âÂÂall outâ with Greenspeed.

You will either have to have your dealer crunch the numbers for you or try to do that yourself to determine what your energy savings may be. The more energy youâÂÂre using now for heating & cooling the more youâÂÂll likely be saving with Greenspeed.

Something that I can tell you from personal experience is that the prices for these systems are ALWAYS going up! I will often receive calls from clients that I have previously visited several years ago that have done nothing and are now again interested in âÂÂmoving forwardâÂÂ. They are invariably âÂÂfreaked outâ by the price increase in just a couple of years! ThatâÂÂs why proposals always say, âÂÂprice valid for only 30-daysâÂÂ. I have seen instances where within a 30-day window Carrier cancelled the spring/fall incentives for all 10-year labor warranties; thatâÂÂs now a $1200 option, thank you very much!

The same holds true for geothermal. Wait a few years and the same system may cost $5k~$10k or more, in some cases MUCH more. For everyone out there that loves the EPA & big government regulation - do I have stories for you; would make your hair curl, go grey & fall out!

My advice is whatever you want to do - if youâÂÂre doing to do it - DO IT NOW!

IMPO

SR

I currently have a three year old Arcocaire 3 ton heat pump with a 5 ton fancoil (20KW heater). I'm spending close to $900 a month to heat my 1,800 SF house (it was below freezing out the entire month). I've had a few vendors try to sell my a new Carrier Infinity with Greenspeed and claim it will cut my electric bill in half. Before I sink $13k into a heat pump to replace my existing fairly new heat pump, does anyone have any other recommendations?

Hi fsq4cw, All,

My noise issue still
persisted, so i called the installing company, and asked them to change the
inverter + electronic board as suggested by an other forums member. The noise
is lesser but we did not have -13F ( -25C) to put the system to test. One thing
I realised is that the RPM does not go beyond 3000 RPM and the thermostat is
showing the heat pump running at 75% (although the 4T can go much higher –
6500RPM I believe). I also realised that the auxiliary heat ( electric furnace
in my case) sometime start while the heat pump did not reach 75% ramp up. I
think something fishy going on, may be the installing company replaced my 4T
inverter with 5T inverter (I am guessing only). Anyway the system does not
behave as before, less noise with less RPM. The ultimate test would my
electricity bill.

That is the update
so far. If you folks have some ideas on what could have caused the RPM to be
limited to 3000 on the heat pump without that the installer touch the
thermostat, let me know ( the thermostat is still showing 5500 RPM as max for
the heat pump).

BR