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cactuscatie

Yikes - New System Freezing

18 years ago

Last year we completely, down to the studs, renovated our home. As recommended by our A/C contractor, he installed a Coleman 5 ton system to cool our both floors last fall. This past Saturday we started up our unit. Our A/C contractor came on Friday to make sure everything was ok.

We noticed all day Saturday the temp would not go below 77 deg F. Than on Saturday night the temp actually started to rise into the 80's. Of course we couldn't get the A/C contractor until Monday. He found the copper pipe going into the blower had ice. So he told us to shut off the system and just run the fan to melt the ice and start it back up.

So we start it back up and it freezes again. Temp did not go below 77. He comes back and says it needs a "squirt" of coolant. The unit was taking in coolant for at least 15 min. Was that a "squirt"? He said we should have no problems now because the only 2 things that would cause this problem was if the vents were not open and ours are all open and if we needed coolant, which he added.

Well there was ice on the copper pipe again this morning and again temp did not drop below 77.

We are frustrated because this is a brand new system which we just started up 3 days ago. Does anyone have any ideas on why we are getting ice on this pipe to the blower....

Oh and any A/C guys out there you will like this story. In the midst of all this, we hear a rattling in one of the vents, not all the time though. So the guy takes apart the duct and what falls out? The plastic covering from the back of the vent. Someone forgot to take it off and it was floating up and down having a grand old time in our vent duct.

Anyway, thanks for any help. A/C contractors are coming back this morning for the 3rd time.

Comments (7)

  • 18 years ago

    Perhaps something is blocking some of the evaporator coil circuits.

    There would be no heat to boil off the liquid refrigerant which would cause a very cold suction line.

    "The 'Airflow CFM' has to be checked to know if it meets the specs for a five ton system."

    They should be taking pressures & temps everywhere!
    Superheat & Subcooling Temps.

    The indoor dry bulb & wet bulb Supply Air & Return Air temp split.
    The outside condenser discharge air temp split, etc.

    Tell them you want a written record of all the diagnostic data; then post it here.

    There are problems that should have been found & taken care of.

    Make a hard copy of the chart & "casually give it to the contractor," also do the same for the "first linked Super Heat & Subcooling Trouble Shooting Page."
    - udarrell

    Here is a link that might be useful: My Trouble Shooting Chart

  • 18 years ago

    cactus

    your dealer has performed a typical "gas and go" apparently without making any effort to determine if you have a refrigerant leak and if so its location as well as making a repair. This kind of service should be illegal but unfortunately it is all too common. I can understand that serviceman is probably covered up with service calls. Perhaps he had good intentions to come back and attempt to locate leak.

    I would say your dealer and his techs leave a lot to be desired. There are diagnostic tools/methods to locate leak and depending on its location can be easy to repair. I would consider all this work-labor and material to be warranty work.

    Sorry for your trouble.

    IMO

  • 18 years ago

    udarrell 2007 and tigerdunes, they didn't check for any leaks anywhere. They only checked the pressure on the outside unit. Didn't check temps either. Only to put their hands up to the vents and say, "oh it's blowing really hard" and "yep coming out good here too".

    I printed the charts and will give them to the contractor (when they get here). Suppose to be here this morning and it's now 2:45 pm. Yeah, I have nothin better to do than wait around all day for them.

    Anyway, thanks guys for your help. Now I know a little more about what they should be doing.

    tigerdunes, you better believe its warranty work. A/C contractor better not think of sending me a bill.

  • 18 years ago

    So I give him the charts and he says "heck I don't need to do any of that". I'm thinking it's the TEV, I want to replace it with an oriface. So he calls to find out what size oriface he needs and the technician is asking him questions and it comes out that he is 400 CFM's short, they installed a 16" duct and the requirment was an 18".

    They can't get to the duct because it is behind a wall and it's too tight so now they have to put another return, cut a hole in the wall, blah, blah, blah....

    I am disguested!!!

  • 18 years ago

    That is crazy, a TEV/TXV is much better than an orifice!
    Always go the other way.

    They should have had a 22" rd Return metal duct for 2250-cfm which gets 853-fpm velocity & 0.02" friction rate for say 25 foot run.

    The 2250-cfm is 450-cfm per ton (required for heat pumps) which, depending on conditions, can help deliver more nominal tons of cooling.

    A 16" Return is good for 1125-cfm, "you need another 16" return duct," with filter racks on each duct run, sized at 200-sq.ins. per ton; minimum of 500-sq.ins each.

    That will reduce the load on your blower, reduce air noise, & providing the Supply Side is sized right, it will optimize airflow. - udarrell

    Here is a link that might be useful: Sizing of Residential Ductwork Systems

  • 18 years ago

    Please don't be disgusted with the equipment, just at the installers. It sounds to me like he has a blockage in the TXV, which if thats the case, he should replace it with another TXV, not an orfice. It will kill the seer rating.
    IMO

    Hope this helps

  • 18 years ago

    They gave us another return duct. I don't know about filter racks but the air coming out of the vents is much more powerful and the house was cool in minutes. I actually had to raise the temp after a couple of hours because I was freezing :)

    I was disgusted at the installers and will not be recommending them.

    Thanks to everyone who helped.