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criticalmass048

Questions about kitchen remodel

17 years ago

My wife has convinced me to getting around to remodeling the kitchen. The cabinets have arrived, the old ones are ripped out, and the only thing left is the stove.

Question #1: We will be getting a new built-in-dishwasher. We currently have a portable. I know that common built-ins are 24" W, but my question is do I need to leave a gap of exactly 24", or some increment like 24 1/4", 24 1/2", or even 25"?

Question #2: We will be re-using our old sink, which has a sprayer. Every book I look at shows an "air gap" popping out of the sink hole. How necessary are this "air gaps", and do I have an alternative to removing the hose?

Question #3:... well, I HAD a third question, but I forgot it now. Maybe I'll remember later :) Thanks!

Comments (11)

  • 17 years ago

    Q1: The gap for my DW is 24 1/2 inches between the surrounding cabinets.

    Sorry, i can't help at all w/ Q2. And as for Q3, I'm sure we'll all still be here when your remember :)

    Congratulations on getting the built-in dishwasher. It is one of life's pleasures :)

    Anita

  • 17 years ago

    As far as the opening for the dishwasher, it might be worth it to purchase the dishwasher first or at least pick one out and look at the manual for it on-line. The manual will provide a diagram for the size of the opening.

    The air gap requirement will depend on your local code. There are some dishwashers (like Miele) that say they don't need the air gap. I put in a Miele in the San Jose,CA area and didn't need the air gap.

    Cavu

  • 17 years ago

    Question #3: My wife is upset that because our gas line comes out of the floor instead of the wall, the range doesn't go as far back against the wall as it should, and therefore sticks out further than the cabinets. She always refers to pictures of other kitchens where the ranges are practically flush with the fronts of cabinets. My argument is that even if it wasn't for the gas line, ranges are generally 3" deeper than cabinets anyway, but it's true that the gas line causes it to come out a few inches more. I need thoughts on this.

  • 17 years ago

    Critical, I suggest that you consult a plumber about whether the gas line can be moved. It may be too expensive to move the line, making putting up with that 3 inches worth a few hundred bucks.

  • 17 years ago

    If you have wood floors, the gas line adjustment should be relatively easy to accomplish.

    Or, you could consider a gas cooktop and separate oven.

    Yet another possible option would be to bump the cabinets out and go with deeper countertops.

  • 17 years ago

    1. DW are less than 24" wide so you can tweak the space to be a minor fraction less than 24" if you are handy.
    2. There is no DW that needs an air gap. It is not a DW requirement. I repeat that For All makes or models of DW there is no need for an air gap.
    -- 2.a.) It is totally false to claim anything about one brand or make in relation to air gaps. E.g. that one brand is so good because it alone doesn't need an air gap. (I have seen this written all over GW for ages so I am posting it here now to be real clear.)
    3. Yes, move the gas line and you gain a lot in ergonomics and looks when your range fits against the wall. (I had to move a 220V plug for the same reason. It made a difference.) Yes this is easy for a licensed plumber. (Or leave it under a base cabinet and move the range when you remodel).

    -david

  • 17 years ago

    Agree with above comments. Move the gas line (relatively easy if wood floor) and depending on what what you bought, bump out the cabinets around it. There is no rule that the cabinets have to attach directly to the wall. you can space them out with a 2x4 etc depending on how then end of the run was figure out, the depth of counters etc. It may be too late to do anything about this though - best considered in the design phase

    take a look at the cut out schematic for the dishwasher - bet is says 24"

    I like to turn the studs sideways where the refrigerator goes if a counter depth one is not purchased. that allows the refrig to move back a couple of inches.

  • 17 years ago

    just checked for a Bosch D/W: 23-5/8" Â 24-1/4" (600Â616 mm)

    Bosch and some others have a rubber strip that fills in the area beyond the minimum size. I always set them up for the 24" or a little less. Bigger than that, you might see gaps It also depends on how your counters are going in. You may have no choice unless you have a filler/scribe strip that provides for adjustment

  • 17 years ago

    If it takes a custom panel, the Bosch door is less than 23 1/4" (when naked i.e. without the custom door). The DW body can fit in a 23 1/2" opening, and this is true for all Bosch DW as far as I know.

  • 17 years ago

    No DW "NEEDS" an air gap, but some antiquated local codes still require it. If yours does, put one in and remove it at an opportune time and insert a soap dispenser, put it back if you are going to sell or have the inspector back in for some reason. Don't be caught with renovations that don't meet code.

    If space is no issue you can move the cabinets out to avoid moving the gas line but if you are working with a smallish kitchen I would not want to loose 3" more inches along one entire length of the room or even 2 or 3 if you are doing an "L" shape or "U" shape and want them all to line up correctly. I think moving the gas line is worth while. While you are taking the time and money to do it, don't be penny wise and pound foolish, and do the layout and rough ins for gas, electric, etc. correctly now. Spending the money to redo the kitchen only to have something like that bug you (or your wife, and by extension, you) long term. Don't build in defects or annoyances that are so easy to resolve at this time. Believe me, I did my kitchen on a budget, so I understand. But anything that will be easier and cheaper to fix now than later is worth doing, or postpone starting until you can.

    JMHO

    Sue

  • 17 years ago

    The stove depth.... We moved the gas line across the kitchen so we anticipated getting it close the the wall. But it was still a major bugger - but VERY worth it. We got a licensed plumber to come in off hours for very cheap.

    But the other thing we did was pull the cabinets forward to line up better with the depth of the stove - and then made the counters deeper. It really saved us - and we almost didn't catch it. (one of 2 DIY errors)

    On the DW & the stove issues, you absolutely need to get your appliances and check the specs and installation instructions. They'll give you details and measurements. Part of our gas line actually sets under the stove. You can save a ton of money buying floor models.