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mom2lilenj

timber vs balloon frame?

19 years ago

I have an 1885 wood frame farmhouse. I'm slowly restoring the house from a bad 1980's "remodel". For instance the house should have 5 evenly spaced tall windows across the top front with four windows on the bottom with the front door centered. Anyway the PO took out those windows and put in two LARGE picture windows and two LARGE bay windows! What?! It looks bad as many others in my community remind me.

My question however is what framing my house has. I would like to take out a wall separating the old back porch/turned kitchen from the dining room and move the dining room toward the front of the house and kitchen into the dining room and make the current kitchen a breakfast nook/side entry. There are 8' long stone steps that lead to a blank wall where the back porch was enclosed to place the kitchen. Someone told me at one time it was a summer kitchen.

The issue is if it is a timber frame house, that wall might not be load-bearing, if it is balloon frame it probably is load-bearing. I'm doing some research into how to determine which type it is, but I was wondering if anyone here knows how to do that.

In my basement I have a 40' 12"x10" beam that runs the width of the house and two 8"x8" beams that are mortised and joined running perpendicular to the big beam that align with the long center hall and staircase (about 9' apart). Also while remodeling our upstairs bathroom (an add-on over what used to be back porch) we found 8"x8" posts that align with the 8"x8" center hall beams. These posts are in what used to be the outside wall to the house. I'm assuming that there are other posts in the corners of the house as well.

Other than ripping out the plaster and lath (which we will do eventually, but want to contain the mess), is there a way to determine if I have a timber frame house or a balloon frame house?

Comments (4)

  • 19 years ago

    Follow up:
    I got impatient and ripped into the wall. It is post and beam (timber-frame). Now I just have to figure out if the existing beam is enough to span 15'.

  • 19 years ago

    "...figure out if the existing beam is enough to span 15'."

    Possible, but not likely. The beams are designed around the bent spacing and layout.
    Removing posts in a post & beam building is usually a large problem.
    While wood may appear massive, the loads they are carrying are also large.

    A PE with experience in wood design should be able to take some quick measurments and come up with a decision.
    Part of the problem is that changes must conform to the present building codes for load caculations. Even wood has changed markedly since 1885 and you need lab testing to use anything but the modern numbers for material charecteristics. Since you are unlikely to have any samples around to perform testing you get caught in a 'catch-22' situation.

  • 19 years ago

    There are no posts in the center of this wall only the posts on either side. I talked with a timber-frame house/barn builder and he recommended a book with load tables. I followed the directions and came up with a beam that needed to be 8" x 8" to carry the load (I took some statics classes and am engineer, just not civil). However, the beam's actual dimensions are a true 7.5" deep x 5" wide. So, I believe I'm going to need either a post in the center (according to my calculations the beam can span up to 10'-11') or another beam to assist the existing one.

  • 19 years ago

    You can also make a flitch plate beam.
    A relatively thin steel section is sandwiched betwen two wood members.
    The wood prevents buckling of the thin steel while the steel provides extra shear strength to the beam.
    Through fastening schedues are very important in flitch beams.

    You can use a demo version of Superbeam for free for thirty days if you want to plug in actual dimensions and loads and see what you need.
    It does flitche beams, just not the fastener schedule.

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