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Big problems acclimating new pup and disabled kitty

19 years ago

We adopted a ~ 1 year old Terrier+Australian Cattle Dog+ mixed breed dog, 20 lbs., from a private rescue organization in Italy and brought her home to the U.S. a month and a half ago. We have a small, 5 year old, 3-legged, declawed kitty (former feral who had a bad injury in the wild), who got along beautifully with our prior dog, a miniature poodle who had been well-educated in puppyhood by our prior cat.

Our new dog is a terror with our cat: she wants the cat to run so that she can pursue it. We have put up gates to give our cat piece of mind while we try to train our new dog, but she seems literally obsessed with our cat, watching for her to appear on the balcony, staring endlessly, crying and jumping excitedly when our cat appears there.

We have tried numerous controlled introductions when our poor cat is lying contentedly in a corner somewhere (or else she would just run away): our dog will stay there rigidly until our cat moves or growls, and then she will excitedly move forward and poke our cat with her nose, as if she is trying to get the cat to bolt, so she can chase it. Our dog's tail is wagging most of the time, and she is clearly highly excited, but we really don't know if she wants to be aggressive, or just wants a good romp (neither is acceptable to us, but we want to know our dog's intentions and potential level of aggression).

Our cat is extremely non-confrontational by nature, and has not thumped our dog or tried to bite: she has only vocalized with a deep throat sound and run when pressed. I know she will always choose to run and hide.

We have tried a muzzle on our dog during an introduction, which did not change much. We have tried giving both pets treats during an introduction, which keeps them focused, but doesn't help our dog overcome her instinct to get our cat to run away...

If anyone has any suggestions or experience with this problem, I would greatly appreciate your input! A friend who has two wonderfully-trained dogs has said our last resort is a zap collar, but I hope to not go that direction.

Thanks very much!

Comments (15)

  • 19 years ago

    You have an EXTREMELY driven dog who MUST be kept very, very well exercised and must be properly trained if you are going to have any chance of controlling her behavior around your cat and other animals. Fact is, you adopted a dog who is genetically programmed to kill small animals (terrier) and genetically programmed to spend all day chasing and herding animals (cattle dog). She is treating your poor cat exactly the way her genetic background is telling her she should. She ain't no poodle!

    You need to get your dog into obedience classes ASAP in addition to spending AT LEAST an hour a day in active exercise with her (not just walking around the block). She needs to RUN that energy off, and she needs to do it EVERY SINGLE DAY.

    There's a reason why so many herders end up in rescues and shelters. It's because folks don't realize the amount of exercise and training they require in order to be well behaved family members. You've adopted a fireball into your home, and for your cat's safety and your own sanity, you're going to have to commit to the time and work required to give both of your animals what they need.

    Go buy a pair of running shoes and find a good obedience trainer for your dog. It'd also be fun to find some place where you can take your dog to learn one of the dog sports like agility, flyball, or herding. She needs LOTS of both physical and mental stimulation to keep her happy and out of trouble.

    Good luck!

    Laurie

  • 19 years ago

    I don't believe in aversive/negative techniques for training, but in this case you do need to get a spray bottle of water and use it along with a firm 'no kitty' when dog shows any interest. The dog needs to be on leash at all times, and muzzled when outside of the crate. This is a safety issue for your cat, not a simple training issue for the dog, so the water bottle, leash and muzzle should be used at all times. The staring sounds more like prey drive than aggression or play and that is never going to be trained out of an animal, but you may be able to manage it with training.

  • 19 years ago

    but you'll never be able to trust the dog when you aren't there, those drives are too strong.

    I'd find the dog a new home.

  • 19 years ago

    kitchengirl ~

    Sadly, you have chosen a dog who is supposed to interact and herd animals. She also have terrier in her and they are supposed to chase, capture and kill small animals ..... rodents have been typical of the past but they will chase anything.

    If you are unable to totally control this new dog then you might consider rehoming. Your cat was there first and should have been shown consideration when choosing another furkid.

    It is possible to be involved with both pets but you will have to commit to whatever exercise and outside play is required for you dog. If you don't she may become destructive out of bordom.

    You could look at this in a positive light. You will be getting more exercise and that should be good!

    Robyn

  • 19 years ago

    If you keep the dog, I would highly recommend a Citronella collar over a zap collar. I have a rescue Beagle. I have never seen a dog SO intent on hunting! She is genetically bred to hunt rabbits, and WOW - it's unbelievable! If she sees one out the window, she literally vibrates because she wants to chase it so badly.

    Since there is a lot of common ground in my neighborhood, with tons of rabbits and squirrels, walks were challenging, to say the least. I tried training her with treats as rewards, which only helped a little. Then I got a Citronella collar on ebay - it's a freakin' miracle! She only set it off a few times, and that was enough. It sprays a puff of citronella, which is not harmful. The spray shoots out in front of her, does not spray her face, and the noise and smell startle her. A lot. I only use it on our walks, and she doesn't even attempt to go after anything any more. She will look, but just walks on by. She also no longer goes crazy when she sees another dog. I do not keep it on if she is in the yard or the house - I feel she does need to time to bark and play and chase whatever is in the yard.

    The collar has not replaced ongoing training, but boy, it has been a godsend. At this point, I don't even have to turn the thing on - she knows when it is on her neck. I think she thinks the rabbits are spraying her :)

    Here is a link that might be useful: Citronella collar - good seller, good price.

  • 19 years ago

    Thanks very much to all for your thoughtful comments.

    We recognize the need for lots of exercise for our dog, as my brother had an Australian Cattle Dog who was not well cared for, and I felt sorry for his lack of engagement with his family his whole life, plus, we have seen our share of "Dog Whisperer" episodes where the poor herding dogs are dying for exercise and mental stimulation... We will be starting obedience very soon, but had to hold off b/c of our dog's serious pulmonary problems (lung worm, not seen in the U.S.) that developed the day after we adopted her.

    I'm "hoping" that our girl can develop control with significant training, as she is not a herder like my brother's Aussie Cattle Dog. She does exhibit tremendous intelligence, is an incredibly quick study, and her agility is amazing, so we are hoping to pursue that, without her going airborne, as I don't want to encourage joint issues.

    I'm not willing to give up either pet: I have done a good bit of cat rescue and TNR and we have rescued and re-homed two stray dogs in the past 3 years since moving to SoCal, and will go the distance.

    Plus, I witnessed a lovely, human-loving Golden kill my beloved cat (I wasn't strong enough to stop it) when I was 12 so I know first-hand about prey drive and do not intend to underestimate our new dog, even if she is 20 pounds. Yes, she is completely different than our beloved 16 pound mini poodle -- how true. This little dog is much more strongly built and uses her nose CONSTANTLY, sniffing, poking, digging... (And our poodle was an ace athlete, not a couch potato, catching frisbees daily at 75 yards -- sorry, I digress).

    Weed30:
    I really appreciate your suggestion about the Citronella collar, which I've never heard of. Our pooch does not bark all the time at our cat, only when she gets quite agitated, or when they have been face-to-face for some minutes; do you think the collar, which activates with barking, can be beneficial under these circumstances?

  • 19 years ago

    Rehome the dog instead of letting the cat live a tortured life. Cat came first. Not fair!

  • 19 years ago

    "Weed30:
    I really appreciate your suggestion about the Citronella collar, which I've never heard of. Our pooch does not bark all the time at our cat, only when she gets quite agitated, or when they have been face-to-face for some minutes; do you think the collar, which activates with barking, can be beneficial under these circumstances?"

    The collar is only activated by barking, and it's intent is to teach a dog not to bark. The spray bottle of water will perform the same function with you triggering it :)

    I have three greyhounds, a prey driven breed if there ever was one. I also have 3 cats, and my dogs were carefully chosen. Granted there are some dogs who can never live safely with cats. But with training, vigilence and allowing your cat plenty of escape routes, (I have baby gates 8" above the floor in most doorways), you will figure out if your dog is one of them or not.

    There will always be a difference between prey outdoors and cats indoors. My dogs would kill a cat in the yard in a heartbeat. Outdoors cats are PREY. But indoors, they all live peaceably together. I do gate the dogs in my office when I leave the house. It's not about trust, it's about responsibility. They are just dogs. Good luck with your training.

  • 19 years ago

    I understand your concerns, and I am glad you know about herding dogs, so are you taking your dog out for a good long walk at least once a day? You dont have to be in a class with a trainer to help your dog understand what is okay to touch and what is not okay. Put your dog on a leash so you can control its behaviors, put her in a sit and stay position. Work on these two things for about a half an hour or so, you have a smart dog, and it should pick things up quickly. I believe training should be positive and can be made fun, I use Natural Balance meat sticks (diced or cubed up) as a reward. An easy going attitude and firm voice should be all that you need. Then approach the cat. Have your dog in a sit and stay position, and have someone help you (by holding on to the leash) go up and pet the cat (this should make your dog want to do the same THE SECOND YOUR DOG MOVES, OR WHINES OR BARKS OR MAKES ANY MOVEMENT OR NOISE Just gently correct the dog into a sitting position. Making certain you add the stay part and add LEAVE IT to the end of your command. You can replace the cat with a toy of her own, and direct her to play with the toy, reaffirminng Leave it, when your dog aerts to the cat, and immediately follow up with "go get your ball", this gives your dog a reward and a positive thing to play with, your dog will know what is okay to play with and what is not. WHen my friends say their dog is chewing up a shoe, I say to take the shoe and a dog toy and place them side by side. When the pup goes for the shoe a gentle reprimand of leave it, and an encouragement to go play with something helps those little brain cells to know what is okay to play with. Good luck

  • 19 years ago

    I'd rehome the dog because I would never trust him with the cat..poor three legged thing was there first. And she's declawed to boot so no defense for her. I have no experience with that type of dog but know they are extemely intelligent and probably fast learners. I just wouldn't want you to see what you saw as a child happen again.

  • 19 years ago

    Cynthia and Mazer: Thanks very much for your thoughtful responses. I'm game to try the spray idea, as I have used it with cats, of course... And Mazer's tips training are excellent. This little dog is amazingly bright.

    Re. exercise, our new pup gets a morning walk, goes out for a "break" and a romp with me a couple of times, lunch and mid-afternoon, and then gets a long play session before her dinner. She also gets a play session before bed usually. She is high energy but not destructive in the house: she has never chewed on anything, although she loves stealing our dirty laundry (undies and socks, of course). We do need to move on to leash training: she knows sit, stay, wait and come (reinforced by expectation of a meal or treat), but has not done those things on-lead, as she would in a class.

    Lily and Elly: I gather you are both cat people -- I am too. I've had a cat since I was 5 and I'm well into my 40's; I know cats. Our kitty isn't a "poor three legged thing" -- she thinks of herself as completely normal, I'm sure. Her reticence is just her approach to life, not due to her injury. I would not forgive myself if I allowed harm to come to her through my negligence. I spend a good part of my free moments shuttling one pet or the other out to the back yard for sun and rec, as both love being there...

    Thanks again.
    kg

  • 19 years ago

    I think you can train the dog to ignore the cat, but its going to take firm discipline. Herding dogs can be trained not herd and hunting dogs can be trained not to hunt. But they do need other outlets.

    You want the two to be friends and that is not really option right now.

    When you put the animals together, don't allow the dog to sniff, look or even stare at the cat, if she does, she gets a correction, typically a rough verbal command should suffice, if it doesn't then you need to use something physical, a leash or noise can. Eventually the dog will learn that she needs to ignore the cat.

  • 19 years ago

    My oldest cats first meeting of a dog ever went as so "Big old pitbull boxer walks in, snaps his leash off and chases kitty" This goes on everytime kitty braves the danger. He never hurt her, I don't know if that was because he couldn't catch her, or he just wanted to chase.

    And then we got a beagle, who loves to chase the cats. God old hunting drive. She still chases the cats. But she does not hurt or attack them, when she catches up to them she submits, onto her back. And if she ever gets too rough the cats chase her off.

    Big guy doesn't even notice the cats, they walk right up to him and sniff him and he doesn't even bat an eye. Except for when the crazy, furry black thing rolls around on him meowing and purring. That confuses him slightly.

    We achieved this with both animals by saying "No, leave the kitty" Of course after training "Leave it" and if they didn't, they were removed from the room, either to their crate in the beagles case, or the garage in the big guys case. They quickly learned if they didn't "Leave the kitty" They weren't allowed to be in the same room, and from that they effectively learned to leave the cats alone all together.

    I'm pretty sure the beagle would leave the cats alone, if they didn't like her so much. Especially our little black one, she loves both the dogs, and she LOVES playing with the beagle. And the calico pretends to hate her, but if she doesn't play with her for a day or two, she harasses her. She pretends to hate everyone and everything though, til it ignores her.

    However, we do still have gates in place where our banisters are, so that if ever the cats feel threatened (or annoyed, mostly) they can escape without fearing the dogs chasing them. Just because they're reliable, doesn't mean they will always be 100% reliable, and I think reconizing that is almost more important than the actual training. You hear too many stories of "Oh my fox killing dog would never hurt a fly, I dont know what happened!!" instinct!

  • 19 years ago

    Eacg dog and each circumstance is different, but with good training techniques, a good daily exersize program and a positive environment, there is no reason why you can not teach your dog to leave other species alone. Our Aussie learned to leave our cats (4 of them) and our free flying cockatiel alone, of course he loved to try and herd the cats into the kitchen, but he never went after them. His life was very fulfilling though and he did not have alot of down time, when he did we can him a tennis ball, sqeeky toy or other item to occupy his mind

  • 18 years ago

    Your dog is only one years old and at that age a dog is very active and playful. Based on my understanding of what you are saying, it appears that your dog is excited and may want to play with your cat. A small dog like that may well think your cat is a playmate. Its very important for you to distinquish between your dog being overly excited and playful versus showing any signs of aggression towards your cat.

    There is no excuse for lack of proper training of your dog. You don't need to wait to take a class or wait until he is better. The most important commands to teach your dog is "NO" and "Stop" meaning stop dead in your tracks. You must immediately let your dog know that it is unacceptable to behave like that with your cat. Until the dog is trained not to bother the cat, take precautions. Make sure the cat has areas off limit to the dog. It is also unfortunate that the cat is declawed. That is her only ability to defend herself.

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