First up,go the permit store and ask them these questions.

Second up, your asking about using nails or screws in frame construston tells me you badley need a Contractor.

Re read second up, again.

Its never a good idea to fasten a ledger to a cantilver,if fact its a very bad idea. Your friends at bestdeck are right a lot of mods are needed to fasten a ledger to a man made joist system get your ten bucks worth and do what they say. And More.

Never leave the stairs out of a drawing.

Simpson zmax are rated for your project. Again your " nails or something " tells me you need to talk to a local Contractor, real quick. Either hire one for the whole job or hire one to draw up your plans.

John Hyatt www.deckmastersllc.com

Hey John, thanks for the quick response.

I'm not entirely confident with the "clerk" at the permit store since they said I could go ahead and bolt into the engineered floor joists if in fact that is generally not allowed. In addition... whenever I ask him a question (which has been two seperate occasions) he never has an absolute answer but says: you could do "a"... and when I ask if I can do "b" and give my reasoning he says that would work just fine too.... so he's not all that helpful and I actually trust the experience of people like you more.

Regarding the nails/screws... I should have stated my question more clearly (I'm often accused of rambling so tried to keep it short and sweet). I'm aware of the reduction in shear strength with screws, and really was asking the question because I was previously told (actually by you "Unless the plans call for the rail posts to be fastened to the rim joist,or the Wallet wants a little more deck space, We always place them inside with blocking,adhesive,and ss screws. There is never a need to run bolts thru the posts that cause many problems all to themself") to glue and screw the railing posts into the frame blocking (I had been planning to also add thru bolts or use some of the Simpson brackets if required) so I wasn't sure if there was a new practice with framing fasteners. I'm just trying to do it right and get all the details finalized before breaking ground.

Most of my help on this project are people with lots of DIY experience but not with the newer ACQ PT lumber. I've read several construction articles recommending stainless (brackets, nails, screws... everything) for construction in contact with ACQ PT lumber, however then they say you can optionally use fasteners with a specific ACQ coating. I'm just trying to avoid the fasteners failing long before the Ipe. Of coarse if this is truly not an issue then I don't want to flush the extra money for SS down the drain :)

I appreciate your recommendation on hiring a contractor but I'm a DIY'er for nearly everything... this just happens to be my first construction project and so I'm bound to ask some rookie questions. Thank God I'm asking them before I break ground so that everything is done right.

Thanks again for all the info.

Chris

Chris where are you located, girl or guy.

In my area acq got kicked to the curb 5 years ago its all mcq now. mcq has been deleated of most all usefull chem. There is no need for ss fasteners using mcq. If fact there was never any need to use ss on acq it was a very big scare farce. Anything close to the ground using mcq we retreat with copper napthenate.

If this clerk stamps your plan a go while taking your money you then must deal with the Man In The Field who has the strongest say.

Frame fastening and rail post fastening are very different things.

Building a second story deck is not something you want to goof around with. J.

Hey John,
The "clerk" is (based on what I've been told) also the inspector... or man in the field... I live in a fairly small suburb of Minneapolis, Minnesota.

I'll have to see what types of treated lumber are available in my area. The big box stores advertise ACQ... but I'd like to find something that is less corrosive if possible as long as it is durable in our environment. My day job involves working mostly with metals and plastics... which is why I'm trying to educate myself with the methods of working with wood.

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by your goofing around statement... I typically only goof around with my wife :) Can you recommend any additional resources that I should study for this project regarding construction techniques? I'm not being a smart A$$... I'm serious... I want to do this project right and fully admit that I'm not very experienced with lumber construction (just a few small decks under supervision and two garages). I design automated machinery by day so I'm confident that I can be educated though, just need someone / multiple people to point me in the right direction.

Anyway, thanks again for responding to my questions.

Chris

Chris, you want to do a search for one of the best guides to deck building, using the most current codes.

It is "The Prescriptive Residential Wood Deck Construction Guide".

Some areas of the country are still stuck with only ACQ preservatives. If you want complete piece of mind, go with the stainless. A alternate method you can use, is to put a barrier between the dissimilar metals, a flashing tape. Vicor or protecto wrap. It's a pain, but much cheaper then stainless.

Now John works in a area where permits are not always needed. If your area in using the IRC 2009 code, there have been a lot of changes, and you will need to bolt things, including the railing posts, whether they are inside or outside the frame.

Good Luck

Mark www.creative-redwood-designs.com

Actually its all up to the local area to demand strict interptation of what some belive to be what that code really has to say. Reading it can mean several things.There are
many ways to fasten rail posts that dont involve bolts and pass code just fine.

I could go on about the test I did when acq first came out involving every fastener I ever used including two rusty sinkers,trim nails, regular glav joist hangers glav gun nails on and on stuck in to .40 acq 2x6 dunked into a 5 gal bucket of water,removed every other day,for 3 months and have Nothing At All happen to those fasteners. I could go on and on about it but I wont. I could even bring up that chunk of 2x6 is still laying out by the door of my shop but that's just not Me. J.

By the way, I don't use stainless steel hardware, other then the decking screws. I use either Zmax or HDG. I certainly would not use anything less.

John and I usually agree on most everything, but if what my engineers tell me, to meet the 2009 code, you will need bolts in those railing posts.

I went to a,god forbid, Simpson Deck Construction Seminar, last week. If all that they say is true, times are really changing for this deck builder.

Mark

There are always different ways to get from point silly to point logical.

I also had a chat with the Simpson boy's last friday durning a hot dog chicken get together at a local supplier. I ran some of my ideas and they agreeed anything they make can be done differentley and for a lot less money.Nothing against those ol boy's they dident create the demand they just filled it.

And of course,Mark my Friend, both of us know how engineers are for the most part and how codes can change and be defined diferentley.

On the bolt/rail post topic its a bad idea to begin with. Drilling the holes in its self provides for movement so too using normal hex head or round head square bottom bolts,even with big washers / lock rings will losen up with the weather exchange and provided a space for water to get in this will = rot and more movement. Blocking in the posts inside the frame using construston adhesive/ copper naphthenate and ss screws will never move or let in the weather.

The only time I " bolt " the posts to the rim is during construston of an upstairs deck during a torchdown/stringer/decking thing. Placing the posts with brackets into the roof is silly so I use glav threaded rod/nuts big washers with loktite this will at least give the posts a fighting chance. Taping the rod in with adhesive helps as well.

The day I am unable to explain this to an Inspector and get a finnal stamp is the day I get out of the Business.

JonMon

Hey guys, thanks for the additional info. The IRC Code is very helpful. I'm doing some final detailing of the frame, railing, and beam and will upload images in the next few days in case you want to pick them apart and provide feedback before I submit for a building permit.

Chris

I second the recommendation of the American Wood Council's Deck Construction Guide. It was my bible (along with GW) when I was building my garapa deck 2 summers ago. Link is below. Lots of great diagrams, tables, and the like for the handy-but-never-built-a-deck person.

I used ACQ PT for the framing with Z-max fasteners and nails made for ACQ lumber. SS screws for the decking.

My "watch me build my deck" saga is here in case you find a lot of details useful. GW truncated it when they had a big server problem last year sometime, but everything up to the pergola and handrails is in there still.

Here is a link that might be useful: AWC's deck construction guidelines

Weedyacres..... beautiful deck! I've actually looked at your photos quite a bit over the last few months and plan to copy the way you finished your stair treads and the trim over the outside stringers... it looks great. The AWC document is awesome. I seriously have 11 different deck building books from the library (for both design ideas and construction techniques) and the AWC document is really good at showing the actual details.