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Plumbing question

20 years ago

I am working on some kitchen plumbing. The lines coming into the kitchen are encased in cement. The valves need to be replaced. The pipes are bent a little below the old valves. I also need to extent the pipe so that I can replace the kitchen cabinets. I'm not sure that I can get a good solder connection with the existing pipes being bent. What alternative do I have to extend the pipe? Can I flare the pipe and use a flare fitting here? Will flaring the pipe make the pipe symetrical again and ensure a leak proof connection. By the way this is the supply lines to the kitchen sink and the upstairs bathroom. I will have to tee off somewhere along the lines. Any help would be appreicated.

Comments (4)

  • 20 years ago

    By "bent", I'm going to assume you mean warped, as in, you can't get the end of the copper pipe to slide into a solder fitting.

    Flare fittings are generally intended for gas applications (natural gas, propane, etc), I believe. And with any type of compression fitting, you still will need to slide the nut down over the warped pipe, to make the connection. I think I'd try an ordinary brass compression fitting, with nut and ferrule, instead of a flare fitting. You may need to work with it a bit to get the nut and ferrule onto the pipe. Because the contact area between each part and the warped pipe is fairly small, it may be possible to push them into position to make the connection, which apparently you can't do with the solder fitting.

    If you are not familiar with these fittings, get several-they're pretty cheap- and play around with a couple of short chunks of copper pipe before tackling the repair.

    Another possibility: If there is enough pipe sticking out of the cement, just cut off the warped part and then make a new connection. If at all possible, use a tubing cutter and not a hacksaw.

    Good luck.

  • 20 years ago

    The copper used to make the water distribution system is COPPER PIPE, which is sized by its inside diameter.

    Flaring tools are made for COPPER TUBING, which is sized by its outside diameter, therefore a flaring block or flare fittings will not fit on copper pipe.

    Compression fittings are more critical of a perfect roundness than what soldering is, so it would be futile to even attempt to install a compression fitting on a section of pipe that is even slightly out of round.

    Cutting copper pipe or tubing by any means other than a copper tubing cutter is a sure way to end up with a pipe that is out of round and will not make a good joint. Under no circumstances should a hacksaw ever be used.

    The only solution is to cut the pipe. If you cannot access a straight section of pipe to make the cut, the option is to cut the concrete back until you can access the pipe.

  • 20 years ago

    Lazypup;

    Thanks for the additional info explaining why flare fittings were inappropriate and would not work.

    "Under no circumstances should a hacksaw ever be used."

    I use a tubing cutter whenever I can. But, if it were my house and my options were:
    a) Try making a decent cut with a hacksaw (because there isn't enough room to spin a tubing cutter) and see what happens, or
    b) Start busting up concrete,

    I'm going with (a). Certainly, you'll wind up with a ragged cut, but if one is careful (Use a fine tooth blade, cut slowly and deliberately) it can be done without deforming the pipe much. The cut end can be cleaned up with a fine file, and the compression fitting parts slipped onto the pipe without too much trouble. The actual seal on a conpression fitting occurs at the ferrule, not the very end of the pipe (or the threads, as many people think), and as long as the nut and ferrule can be mounted on the pipe it should seal properly. I know because I have done this successfully on a number of occasions, in homes I have lived in.

    And if after all it does not work, then you are no worse off, and can go get the sledgehammer.

  • 20 years ago

    If there is enough room to move a hacksaw there is enough room to swing a minicutter....

    The chances of getting a cut with a hacksaw that would be okay for a compression fitting are slim to none under good circumstances but what do I know...I have only been a plumber for 30 years.