Maureen -

"My counter aisle clearances are all ok regardless of island width."

If you have the aisle clearance, could you curve the seating area counter outward to give you more elbow room there?

We have island seating for 4, and I did it with two on the 'short' end, and two on the long end so that people are facing each other when seated there. I wanted it to be a very welcoming, comfortable space, so I have a full 24 inches per person on each side, and a very generous overhang so nobody is bumping their knees on the cabinets beneath (I think it's something like 15 or 18 inches, I forget now!). I also made it long enough so that nobody's facing the prep sink when seated. For some reason, that is a pet peeve of mine. :-p We don't have a kitchen table yet, so it's the only spot to eat--but I can see that it's going to be used regularly for weekday breakfasts even after the table is delivered. What I like best is that sometimes, when there's nobody else around, my teen or tween comes in, slides into one of the chairs at the island and talks to me while I'm making dinner. I never planned that as a benefit, but that's the way it's turned out and if that was the only positive thing about having the island seating, I'd do it just for those moments.
/end sappy mom moment....

We're having 16 for Thanksgiving. My huge island will be both the buffet and seating for the folks who want to talk to me or help while I'm getting the last few things together. The island is about 4'6" wide, and that gives enough room that I can work on one side while someone sits comfortably on the other with a drink.

So, the short answer is yes I like it and I'd definately do it again. :-)

Have fun planning your new kitchen! There are a lot of people on this board with real talent for layout.

Cj

{{gwi:1979187}}

Here's a photo of my drawing with measurements. Right now I am just trying to decide about island seating so please ignore my cabinet scribbles. Sink, dishwasher and range are in their definite spots, refrigerator can move.

Have you ever thought of using a banquette, against the column wall? This would allow you to slide your table over a bit, still have a chair on each end and one or two opposite the banquette, and give you a little more room at the island. I think you could save at least 6" which would give you enough room for two stools.

If you do go with a banquette, pedestal tables are the easiest to slide in around, but any table can work :)

Lavender's suggestion of a banquette is a good idea, though I don't know if that'll work with the heat. As you've drawn it you do not have enough room for your chairs. You got the knees under room and linear edge space, but not the floor space. Two feet between the table edge and a wall aren't enough. If the divider is short, that helps, but it's really not enough room. There'll be a lot of banging against the divider and squeezing in. Similarly, you can get away with the 30" you suggested between the table edge and island, but it's going to be really crowded. You're going to have to move the chairs to get into the storage, and you'll likely have chairs banging into the island as well. Generally, you need two and a half feet from the table edge for a chair, and three feet if there's a wall/cabinet/divider behind. If you have back to back chairs (such as table and counter stools, six feet is really the bare minimum, though you can squish it to five, especially if you don't have a lot of interlocking chair legs (pedestals, U-shaped, etc.) Eight feet is better, allowing room for seating on both sides and walking between.

Do you already own the table? Many tables are 36"-42" wide, so you could gain a few inches there. You could also steal half a foot from the cooking aisle. 48" is better, but some people do okay with 42".

Your stools on the end of the island will probably take more than a square foot of floor space--the stools themselves, minus the people and comfort distance (margin between the tummy and the overhang), will likely be at least a square foot in measure. Those look fine though. They're in 48" of walkway. That should be plenty enough room for people to get by so long as the sitters are well tucked in. You need less space if there's an aisle, rather than a solid object, behind the sitter.

If the island sitting is for perching and chatting with the cook rather than eating full meals I would leave it. You only have 9' for table and chairs and that is a bare minimum for a comfortable table and chairs for seating. I know because that is what we are dealing with and trying to find a table to fit in the space comfortably is tough. We toyed with the idea of a banquette but I always hated to be the one sliding in and out so I'm not going to do that to someone else.

Med- I think your inspiration pictures are just beautiful! The shelves and the banquette would look wonderful, in your space.

I agree that you need more space, between the oven and island. I've been facing a similar concern, with my remodeling plans. I know you said it was too late to move your range, but is there anyway you could go with a cooktop...and put the oven on the back wall, with the fridge? Then you could put big drawers under the cooktop, for pans, etc.

If that were possible, you could even put your microwave above the oven, by the fridge, and have more room for storage in the island. Just a thought :)

Somewhere I saw suggested dimensions for banquette seating but I can't remember where. If I find it, I'll post a link for you.

What I do remember, though, is that you need to take into consideration whether or not you intend to add cushions to a banquette bench when you work up its dimensions. My kitchen chairs are 18" deep (full depth, including back). If they had a back cushion, as shown in your pic above, the seat would be too shallow for comfort, IMO.

Aha, I didn't find the article I was thinking of but I found one with similar information. See link below. Unfortunately, it doesn't provide information about table placement. Should it overhang the bench by 2", 3" or 6"? That would be useful to know.

Oh, I found info about that, too (patience, the right key words and Google, great combination). According to The Smart Approach to Kitchen Design
By Susan Maney Lovett, a table may overhang a bench by 3" or 4" (right hand column, 1st paragraph). So if you have a padded bench (seat and back), you need to allow for 24" for banquette seating. Subtract the 3" to 4" of table overhang and you really only gain 3" or 4" by swapping dining chairs for banquette bench. But every inch counts, right?

In case it helps you, here's my kitchen set-up and experiences.

Our kitchen/home is set up somewhat similarly to your plan. The aisle that directs traffic from front hall to back door and deck is between our island and table. We have 40" between our table and island, which is less than NKBA guidelines (can't recall but it was 48" or 50-something, very generous). However, we find we have sufficient room for people to get by when someone is seated at the table. We don't have island seating, even though our island has an overhang to accommodate seating. We don't feel the aisle is wide enough for island and table seating. We also don't feel that island seating is necessary given the proximity of our table to the island (and yes, people here are in love with island seating but obviously I don't feel it's always necessary or appropriate). We may give up an inch or two when we remodel but I would not want to shrink the aisle to 36". That would be too tight a squeeze for people to get past seated diners and I fear it would direct traffic through my kitchen not next to it.

We have 28" between table and couch back, which serves as a divider between kitchen and FR in the same way as the divider you propose in your plan. It works even though it's less than the NKBA minimum of 36" for seating without traffic passing behind. But I wouldn't want it tighter than that, especially if chairs backed up to a wood divider, especially if it was painted wood. That would show dings from chair backs hitting against it, upholstered furniture doesn't.

I think it would be a shame if you short-changed yourself and ended up with cramped table space to gain a larger island with or without island seating.

Here is a link that might be useful: Make the most of your eat-in kitchen with a banquette