I think you know I love the usefulness of our prep sink, and like mine on my island... on the corner so it can be used from the side or the end for multi-workers and multi-function... It earns its keep! I also like that it takes as little space as possible when situated that way, leaving larger expanses of work area. If you center it, you split and reduce the size of the countertop work area.

My island is 4 x 5. Our sink is Kohler Iron/Tones (K 6584) and is about 14 x 16. It can be installed as an undermount or self-rimming (what we did).

Placement within the layout and work paths is essential to its usefulness. People who find their prep sink to be superfluous or not useful usually have it outside an efficient work area.

Here is a link that might be useful: Kohler Iron/Tones K-6584

rhome, it is because of your post in another discussion that I decided to go with the Prep sink in the island rather than on an adjacent run with the stove. I think it will work well for me as my fridge, prep sink and stove will make a nice efficient work triangle on one side of the island. Cabinets will be started after Christmas and so I am just trying to get the final finishing details together. Have yet to pick out sinks, dw, fridge and hardware. So much to think about! Thanks for your input!

We have a prep sink in our island. Location (IMO) does need to focus on why you have the sink, what else you have, and the size of the island, more than anything else. Ours is opposite the side of the island with the stove because the stove is on an L with the main sink, so that becomes one work station. The prep sink is used for clean up when clearing, as well as vegie prep (by the way, put in a disposal or it's a waste of money). It's on the opposite side because that allows two cooks to work without bumping bumms :)

It's located in the center of that side because there is a doorway behind it which gives the worker more room. Our sink is undermount with a top made for it which fits in the space so when not in use we can close it off and have the whole counter top.

I like a prep sink that's of good size. What's good? For me, I want to be able to bathe a pumpkin, dump in a bushel of apples that will be turned into applesauce, fit a giant colander in it, or blanch a mountain of veggies, as well as use it as a secondary place to clean full sized pans, cookie sheets, roasters, etc. If I can suds up a small dog or baby in there, all the better.

How do you plan to use it and what is your cooking style? If you are scrubbing a few carrots and always wash your pans at the cleanup zone, then you'll probably be fine with a petite model. Just the same, I don't think I'd go any smaller than the one Rhome has. She mentioned one time (made perfect sense to me) that any smaller, and you could wind up banging your knuckles against the sides while scrubbing potatoes or other tasks.

Where it should be located is what I'll be watching this thread for, since I'm still trying to figure that out myself. : )

What size is your prep sink, Rhome?

Igloochic, I don't know if I can do a disposal since we are on a septic system. Will have to check into that. At any rate, I plan on having a trash cabinet on the island right below where I plan on chopping and dicing. I am so glad you mentioned that you have a top for your sink to close it off! I was just wondering if there was a sink out there that came with a "top". What model sink do you have and what size is it?

Laughable, I plan on using the sink for cleaning veggies, dumping pans of water from the stove, (have a pot filler over the stove), draining noodles, general clean up on that side of the kitchen and as a ice receptacle for cold drinks when we set up buffet. My island can be no bigger than 4 ft by 6 ft. unless I make my aisles less than 42 inches. What size is your island and what size sink were you contemplating?
My initial thought is to put it in the middle of the long side of the island because my island is off set from the stove. That would put my chopping area directly across from the middle of my stove. Does that make sense?

What size is your prep sink, Rhome?

About 14 x 16 x 7 1/2" inside.

I would recommend you try to get a prep sink no smaller than 18" wide. Mine is 15-3/4" square and while it's OK for most things, there are times when I wish it were a few inches bigger (those times seen to be happening more often lately...) If you can fit a 21" (or 24") sink base, then I would aim for the largest sink you can fit in the sink base. If it's off to the side, that leaves you approx 48" of prep space - a respectable amount of workspace!

Regarding septic & garbage disposals...we are on septic and have a garbage disposal on our cleanup sink (we should have put it on the prep sink or both, but that's a different topic). Check your local Code - in our case, we could have one as long as it was made specifically for septic systems. Ours is the InSinkErator Evolution Septic-Assist.

Regarding location of the prep sink, it depends on where it is most useful. Do you have a layout to post showing us the location of everything? (A "bird's eye view" of the space is best.)

++++++

Off topic...Welcome back IglooChic! I haven't seen you much lately (of course, I haven't been on much either...)

Here is a link that might be useful: Evolution Septic Assist

I love my prep sink, though I had never thought I would ever have one.

It is hammered copper and is about 15.5 x 15.5 interior. I like the size but I would not want to go smaller. It is on my island across from my cooktop and I think the location is perfect. Mine is on the corner of the short end of my island but even on the long side you might find the best use of space is to keep it at the end.

You asked about the long narrow sinks but I personally can't see any use of them other than to fill them with ice and put drinks in them.

I have to laugh but one of my favorite little gadgets in my kitchen is my $3 Ikea colander that fits perfectly in the sink. As I wash my fruits and veggies I put the washed ones in the colander.

Here is an overview of my kitchen. The center wall is cathedral and is 16' 4". The stove wall is 13' 5" and the sink wall is 12' 10". You can see that the island is not centered with the stove. The island is 4 x 6 and there are 42" or wider between counters and island.

My initial thought is to put it in the middle of the long side of the island because my island is off set from the stove. That would put my chopping area directly across from the middle of my stove. Does that make sense?

This would make the work area in front of your stove very small. If you put the sink on the corner near the fridge, you have more workspace in front of your stove.

What Rhome said. In any prep sink placement, a primary consideration is placing it where it allows you a minimum of 3' working space next to it. Four feet or more is even better!

You think in front of the fridge? I sort of like that area for my landing spot for groceries, things from fridge and pantry etc. What about on the short side on the opposite side of the island? I will be prep baking on that long counter under the window and that would put the sink closer to that area. What are the advantages of it in front of the fridge vs. the opposite short side?

quiltgirl-you can have a disposal with septic. We have one in our main (only) sink and use it for the bits and pieces that get away after scraping. I wouldn't advise putting anything and everything down it but I wouldn't give it up all the same. I hate digging/shaking that grime out of the basket.

Looking at your layout, I think I would put the prep sink on the other end...

• The prep sink would be across from the range so all you need to do to empty a pot is pivot and dump

The refrigerator landing space would be the island - right where you need the food to be for prepping. You would then only need to pivot and place your just-prepped food either next to the range to work with or right into the pan.
The only negative I can see for this location is that if someone is working at the range and someone else at the sink, they might get in each others way. However, with 42" aisles, I think there will be room for two people. If you had less than 42", I would think twice...
The negative for placing the sink on the refrigerator end is that you block the best landing space for the refrigerator - the end of the island. You could use the perimeter counter to the right of the refrigerator if you have a single-door with the hinges on the left. But, then you will put the food on the perimeter counter and you will have move it to the island for prepping - an extra trip/step that can be eliminated by using the island for a landing space.

If you have a French Door or Side-by-Side refrigerator, then you would have to reach around the open door to get to the perimeter counter. I have a FD refrigerator w/landing space both on the peninsula across from the refrigerator and to the right of the refrigerator - I never use the landing space on the right, I always use the peninsula across from the refrigerator!

I'm going to attempt to go for a 24" single bowl sink, possibly a D shape, but still not totally decided.

For your plan, I would want the sink up at the top left corner of the island. From this spot I could easily dump water from the stove, chop fruits and veggies to the right of the sink, and easily use the sink at the top counter for baking. I always want water nearby when I bake, my hands never stay out of what I am trying to mix, and I am constantly washing gook off of them. I'd like it being so close to where I bake. Also, it would be easy for multiple people to access it from 2 different areas of the kitchen pretty much at the same time. Nice!

I don't think you're going to want to use the area between the fridge and stove for a landing spot, it looks too small. I'm picturing plastic bags of veggies being melted by burners that are on. No, no. Not good. Much better to land them at the island, imo.

Buehl, Yes, I am thinking that the sink on the opposite end of the fridge side would be more useful. Should I face it to the stove or center it on the 4 ft. side facing the long counter under the window?

Laughable, I too am always rinsing my hands when mixing and prepping for baking! I do have a bigger sink on the other side of the island for clean up. That sink will also be fairly close to where I prep for baking as well. Since I do not have counters now and am just using make shift pieces of furniture to work on, it is hard to tell if I will change my "modus operandi" once I have real cabinets. I know with all the help here from everyone here that the kitchen will be designed to be as efficient as possible!

My prep sink is D Shaped, 22 X 19. I love it, it fits a 20 lb turkey, a cookie sheet, roaster, or a large colander for dumping pasta with room to spare. There is a spring operated garbage pullout underneath--I bump it with my knee and it pops open for disposal of chicken parts or whatever nasty stuff I'm holding. No garbage disposal, I compost raw veg scraps, so I don't miss having one. Also, I suggest a Tapmaster. It's a luxury, but you'll love it every time you're working there!

As to placement, I agree with Buehl. I have mine right across from my cooktop, and with a 42 inch aisle, I don't bump butts with anyone who happens to be helping at the cooktop while I'm using the sink. The space across from the fridge is a natural place for things coming out/going into the fridge. In my kitchen, that corner is also by the door to the mudroom, and so is a natural landing spot for groceries, so that was also part of my decision. A corner placement leaves you plenty of work space, too, which is essential. If you put it on the short side, you'd not have as much side space to work as if you put it across from the cooktop.

Cj

This post was edited by cj47 on Wed, Dec 5, 12 at 9:22

Here is a kitchen that has the same shape and ceiling as mine. (minus the beams) Layout is similar except my fridge is on same run as stove. Where the fridge is, I have my clean up sink. Notice the prep sink is in the middle of the long side of the island. How long would you guess this island to be?

cj47, what is a Tapmaster? Can you post a picture of your sink and please tell us what size is your island?

[Traditional Kitchen design[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/traditional-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2107) by Dc Metro Architect Harrison Design Associates - DC

I'd guess there to be 3 ft on either side of that prep sink.

I am in the minority here about prep sink placement. It's easy place things from the fridge to one side or other of the sink. It's not that much further or more difficult...probably just a reach and no extra step. But I am not one to highly prioritize landing space at the cost of other conveniences I prize more. You can see that in my kitchen with the island further from the fridge than yours will be, and my prep sink on that nearest corner.

I can see it being help to baking to have it on the opposite end, but to prep I take things from fridge to sink, or beside the sink, and don't want that to be a walk past the stove then back. You lose efficiency in the busyness and time-sensitivity of meal prep. A lot of times things coming from the fridge might be drippy. It's helpful for fridge cleaning to have the sink close, too.

Also, it won't be accessible to those on the perimeter of the kitchen, which I really like about mine. --Part of its multi-purpose value.

The end of my 2 cents worth! :) We all have to decide between our specific set of compromises.

I have 2 sinks and love them. One is large and shallow on the island (17x29", Elkay undermount), the other is deep and smaller (16x18" Elkay undermount) on the perimeter. Best of both worlds. Disposal in each. I've been using my kitchen for about a month now and love the placement of the sinks.

I would put your main sink on the island opposite the stove. If the island is not big enough for your main sink then put a good sized prep sink across from the stove, or to the left a little so you have more space to the right of the sink close to the fridge. You will live at this command center, that's why it needs to be a good size. You have your fridge and pantry close so it's easy to put groceries away and get out what you need for cooking. Your helpers can use the other sink and counter space on the perimeter (and clean up for you!).

Do you plan on any overhang on your island for seating? It seems like the only place you could put a stool would be on the open end, which would be nice for you or a helper to sit and chat.

I have 3.5 feet to the right of my sink on my island and it's a lot of space. Frankly I rarely use it all, except when baking.

Good point Rhome. I thought the points made by others were sensible as well. I am going to set a 6 ft table there and put a pce of foam board to replicate sink on it and see which end works for me.
Do you think I should also put a peninsula coming off of pantry wall to separate kitchen from family room?

My island is 4.5 feet X 7.5 feet. On the long side, there are drawers for prep and lunch supplies, vertical storage for baking sheets, and the prep garbage. On the short side, it runs in front of the cleanup area, and has drawers for towels, containers, and other items used for cleanup. The remaining sides are seating areas. These pictures are a few years old, but show placement of the sink and garbage pullout. I have another garbage pullout by the cleanup area for general trash and recycling. If placement and design strike you as implementation of suggestions made by Rhome, Buehl, and others...it's because I had a LOT of help in the design phase. :-)

Cj

Here is a link that might be useful: Tapmaster. Awesome.

This post was edited by cj47 on Wed, Dec 5, 12 at 12:44

My island measures about 9' long. My Blanco silgranit prep sink is about 15" square. I would have gone slightly larger if Blanco made one in between mine and the next larger size. I would NOT go smaller. With my sink placement, I have sufficient landing space for fridge/freezer and pantry items. The area also serves as a "waiting room" for those items so theat they don't take up space in my actual prep zone. I prep to the left of my sink as I stand at the island in a 50" wide space. My walnut cutting board, a permanent fixture next to the sink, takes up 20" of that width. Prepping in 50", plus having the extra depth of the island beyond the standard 24" counter depth if necessary, feels like heaven to me! And I use up every last inch daily.

You've got two of THE best layout experts in Rhome and Buehl helping you now so please listen to them! My kitchen layout would not be nearly as functional if it weren't for the help I received from them (mainly my friend Rhome) and others.

Do you think I should also put a peninsula coming off of pantry wall to separate kitchen from family room?

There are pluses and minuses, so it's hard for me to say. It impedes traffic and encloses the kitchen, which could be good or bad. It could be a lovely and helpful extra bit of counter, or a clutter catcher.

Would you try to use it for something like a bfast counter or just leave it open?

You have to think about how it will make the space feel and how your family will treat it. It brings to mind Breezy's gorgeous peninsula, the way hers comes off her pantry and fridge, or the one in one of my favorite inspiration kitchens from Crown Point, so you could check those out. But then, her kitchen is open all along the side so that others can get straight to the fridge, etc.

Here is a link that might be useful: Crown Point example... LARGE, but still an idea

"We all have to decide between our specific set of compromises." Wisely spoken, Rhome...so very true!

If you put a peninsula in to separate the kitchen, you're going to have people coming around it to get to the fridge, thus encroaching on your prep space. And you KNOW they'll be there when you are in the throes of trying to get dinner done... If that wouldn't bug you, then go ahead. Personally, I placed my fridge specifically so that people could get to it without having to come into 'my space'...even though it might have been slightly more convenient to place it elsewhere. It has worked out well for me.

And X2 what Breezy said, too.

And..... Igloochic! What a nice surprise to see your name floating around the board again! :-)

After a half hour of arguing, I finally got my DH to help me carry an old 6 ft by 42" table into the kitchen from the barn. It is 32 inches high. I am so glad I did because I was really vacillating between having an island or an eating table in the center of the kitchen. Now I know I will really enjoy the efficiency of having an island. The height is just perfect for me for chopping, dicing or rolling out pastry dough. Here is my question: Can an island with a sink be less than 36" high? I am only 5'2" and the 32" height feels so comfortable for me.

Rhome: I put a piece of foam board to similate a sink and I am at the moment preferring it on the fridge end of the island just like you suggested. The only two drawbacks I have with it there are that it will be 4-5 steps to dump a large pot of water. Also, it would eliminate me being able to have seating on that end. The flow feels right to me from fridge to chopping to stove vs. if I had it on the other end. It also frees up other end for rolling out pastry dough near my baking/prep area which will be on long counter more towards clean up sink.

Buehl: I like all the points you made and I will try my 'pretend' sink on that side some more to see if I change my mind. The side you suggested is better for dumping liquids from the stove. Will have to figure out which pros and cons will work for me. I am rethinking the FD fridge. Maybe a single door would be better?

Can an island with a sink be less than 36" high?

Our island is 33 1/2" high...maybe a tad more. If you like 32", you could go with that, but just remember that the bottom of the sink will be quite a bit lower. You might want it just a smidge taller... Not enough to feel the difference from the 32", but so you're not reaching so far down into the sink.

it will be 4-5 steps to dump a large pot of water.
I think you're misfiguring, since 4-5 steps would be several feet...like 9. I think you'll have something like a left turn and a couple of smallish steps to maneuver. As long as you don't have people going through your work area, I don't think it should be a problem.

it would eliminate me being able to have seating on that end.
Did you mention seating at the island before? That can change a lot of things. Where and how many seats?

As far as the fridge configuration goes, I've made my dislike of FD fridges very well known. I have a single door KA that I love, love. It's easier to walk to the nearest side of the fridge and open one door, as opposed to walking to the middle of the fridge and opening two doors. In your layout, you could still keep an eye on a pot bubbling on a burner while rummaging though the fridge for the cilantro.

The island could still provide landing space, depending on where you place the prep sink, or the small stripped counter next to the range would work also. As I mentioned, my island end across from the fridge is my landing spot and "waiting room".

In short, I recommend a single-door fridge based on my experience and on your layout. If your heart is set on a FD, you could certainly make that work also. Just not as easily, to my mind.... :)

igloochic, Not to hijack but how is little igloo?

Yes, I definitely want seating at the island. I am thinking seating on the long end across from clean up sink and on one of the short ends perhaps. It is just two of us for most of the time with kids stopping in here and there. I do have a bay eating area off the kitchen for eating as well. If I could fit four seats that would be nice, but I would be happy with three.

I walked the steps from the stove to sink and it would be three to four steps.

I think 42" aisles are too tight for that much seating. Our aisles are 48" and I sure wouldn't want stools and people in that space. I'm not one who likes 'seaters' in my work area, and even if they're helping, still don't want them where I need to stand and work, do or access things, like opening the dishwasher, or need to hustle and bustle through while cooking or baking.

It's helpful to draw something as space-taking as seating, and something you feel so strongly about, into your plan so that everyone commenting has a clear idea of space use and what you're trying to accomplish. I'm sorry if you mentioned it before and I don't remember.

I think 42" aisles are too tight for that much seating. Our aisles are 48" and I sure wouldn't want stools and people in that space. I'm not one who likes 'seaters' in my work area, and even if they're helping, still don't want them where I need to stand and work, do or access things, like opening the dishwasher, or need to hustle and bustle through while cooking or baking.

It's helpful to draw something as space-taking as seating, and something you feel so strongly about, into your plan so that everyone commenting has a clear idea of space use and what you're trying to accomplish. I'm sorry if you mentioned it before and I don't remember.

I would definitely put it on the long side so it's accessible from the Prep Zone, Cooking Zone, and Baking Center (that is what that is in the base of the "U", correct?)

As someone else pointed out, if you put the sink on the range end, then you can easily have water near the Baking Center.

If the sink is on the refrigerator end - and right in front of the refrigerator, you will be competing for access to the prep sink when others are in the refrigerator looking for a snack or whatever.

I can also hear myself having to say, "Look out everyone, coming through with boiling water, out of my way!"

In your layout, I would expect people to use the cleanup sink for non-prep work. That's how it works in my kitchen...the prep sink is for prepping & cooking, the cleanup sink, b/c it's on the perimeter and not in my Prep or Cooking Zone, works as a sink for everyone else, whether it's cleaning up, washing hands, or getting a drink.

Seating...you don't have near enough room for seating on the long end. If there were no cabinets/appliances/etc. and the aisle wasn't a major path through the kitchen, then 48" would be OK, but with a sink, DW, counters, cabinets, etc., you really need more like 63" (72" would be even better). Figure you need at least 30" to 33" for the person sitting at the island then another 36" for the person working behind them.

Whatever you decide, good luck!

I don't think I would have people going thru my prep area as the fridge is at the end of the stove wall. Also,people sitting at the island would be across the island from my prep/cooking area and not where I would be standing and working.
So no seating? Can I put two stools on the short end by the pantry for seating? How about a peninsula off the side pantry wall with seating? Maybe I need to re-think having an island and put a prep sink somewhere on the periphery. I sure like the feel of the island though. I really need to have a couple of seats somewhere in this kitchen. The bay area is a distance away and is fine for large crowds and company, but when it is just the two of us, we like to sit right in the kitchen. If I make my island 42" wide then I have 54" between it and the clean up sink. I have always had a 42" wide table with chairs here and did not feel too crowded.

Phylhl, yes I was planning on a overhang for seating. We are used to having a table and chairs in the middle of the kitchen and we sit here doing paperwork or visiting most everyday. My DH likes to sit and gab while I am preparing the meals. I guess that is why I like the island vs. using the perimeter for prepping. I don't have my back to others with the island. I think I would like a stool that I could pull up for myself on the prep side when I am doing labor intensive stuff too.

Thank you Rhome and Buehl and all for your helpful suggestions!

I too was thinking 2 small scale stools at the pantry end of the island, that's it. you could easily move them to another side just for you, but just have the overhang at the pantry end for proper seating. Then you can prep and visit with guests who are seated. I see you have a table/chairs for dining as well. you could even arc the overhang to minimize the depth on the ends (or not).

I too like facing people while prepping. good luck.

I am new here, have read a bit about prep sinks and I got great tips from you!
However, haven't found something that's been bothering me (or just missed it). I think a prep sink in a corner, that is accessible from 2 sides, is a great idea, but I am worried about spilling. Wouldn't it make a mess on the floor? My floor is usually dirty in front of the sink, after I have used it for a heavy round of cooking, and that's considering it mostly lands on me :) But if it has 2 sides that are so close to the edge....

I haven't found it to be a particular problem. If I'm doing something really 'splashy', I might put a folded towel next to the sink on the aisle side, but I don't keep one there as a matter of course. The water seems to stay on the edge of the sink and the counter, and doesn't make it to the floor.

Cj

I haven't had a problem with that either. The kids tend to leave water around it on the counter, but it hasn't really splashed all over the floor.

Mine is near the end of the island too and I haven't had any problems with water on the floor. Anywhere you have water, you can get a drip, but more likely moving to or from than coming from the sink itself. I do have a bit of an arch on the end of the island with about 9 inches on the end and maybe 12 inches in the center. It was put there to give a landing space rather than just enough edge to tease, not for water considerations. My faucet is on the outer edge of the sink and if I had a narrower space and was concerned about splashing, I'd have moved it to the inside corner.

You guys give such great advice! I have never had an island, or a big kitchen for that matter and it is overwhelming to decide on... everything. I am going to prepare a sketch and show it to you guys to let me know what you think. It feels like I am missing something...

I decided to take Buehl's advice and put my prep sink on the far end of the island in front of the stove. It works better there. The island is only 6 ft. long, so with the sink taking up a cabinet, it does not leave a lot of room to get real creative with this thing. I do need to have some seating. Construction on cabinets begins first week of February and I am overwhelmed and need HELP! Any suggestions on what to put in this island and design would be greatly appreciated! I was sort of thinking along the look of the islands below. What do you think?