Happy holiday to you as well. Did the jolly gift giver bring you CFL lighting ?

Hah, I wish someone gave me lighting. I'm not very familiar with lighting as far as plants go, but have used a T5 setup for a reef tank I had (sold a few years ago). I always pictured CFL as being focused lighting, not as bright and not sure on power consumption. Did see An internet big box hardware store carried a standard bulb socket CFL at 6500k and 150 watt comparable output I believe. I'd love to hear more about how you would implement or what options they had. Tried calling 1000bulbs.com and the guy said he didn't have a clue what to recommend and I would need to call back when someone more knowledgable was there.

CFLs are bad solution. LFL (T8) with 865 or 965 (particularly) are better suited for succulents, especially for Jades. But variegates like 827(927) or 832(932) with 865 or 965.

Happy holidays to you too, Joe...

Your plants look good in that photo. Looks like the jades could be in smaller pots, but hard to tell for sure from that shot.
If you need more space, perhaps some shelving will work.
I used wire-type shelving (like closetMaid); you can suspend lights for bottom plants from the shelve above.
For additional light, many solutions are available - depends on what are you willing to spend?
I have set up with CFL's you mentioned - 100W/6500k. And they use only 23W each. Using a 'vanity strip lighting fixture', it fits 6 bulbs, and it is 24" long. The fixture is chrome, so it looks pretty good too. Very inexpensive. .
I have few old shop lights with fluorescent tubes too. Personally prefer the CFL since the shop lights fixtures are old. Whatever you use, get highest k (but I think you know that).

The photo is another window with 2 wire shelves (large window, they are 7' or so); and with 2 double bulb fluorescent fixtures above each shelve. Excuse 'poor' photo quality...Rina

Oks2n2

We were typing at the same time...I know that CFL are not 'the best' but why are they bad solution? Pls. explain?

You also mention in other posts you use LED - do you also use T8?

TIA. Rina

Rina
Do you understand Russian? http://www.flowersweb.info/forum/messages/forum18/topic10063/message4083119/#message4083119
In short, due to self-darkening tightly wound spiral tube. So
CFLs are much lower efficiency than LFLs

Thanks Oksana...I used to (read & write & understand Russian)...I will attempt to read, not sure how much I remember, lol.
Rina

Rina
:) as me in English:)

Oh, Rina!
Yes, I use LED-tubes (T8) in fixture for LFL.

Oks2n2

Your English is better than my Russian - I need serious refreshing course on Azbuka, lol

Did lots of reading on this subject. I am wondering about costs of LED T8's for you? I think that higher cost to buy them puts lot of people off.
Rina

Rina
if 1$=52R, so my one LED lamp (T8, 10W, 60cm) is worth about $ 5

Considerably less than here in Canada; found exactly same as you describe for just under $30/each, only little less if bought in bulk (12 for just about $200 Canadian $)...have to do some more searching.
Rina

Joe

Hope you don't feel I hijacked your thread...but info from Oks2n is great - she grows great jades in zone 1...
While I am pretty satisfied so far with lighting I have (basically reused old shop lights - no cost to me except for the tubes themselves - and very little cost for set up I mentioned with CFL bulbs), I would also like to get best possible lighting, upgrading when possible.

Pls. let us know what you think...

Rina

If your interested in what I use for indoor succulent lighting during winter for the indoor lighting dept, I use:

Some of them have four (4) 48 inch long F32T8 bulbs per shelf each of the bulbs has a light output of 2700 lumens in the color range of 6500 K. Others only have two bulbs thata re the same as mentioned as four are used at the lowest shelves two bulb shelves have window exposure

Three timers for each rack one for the lower shelving , one timer for the remaining window exposured shelving and a third timer for the mystery item that is rarely mentioned but is used to cool the wattage used, hopfully it's not forgotten for healthier, fuller indoor growing results with use of CFL bulbs

One shelf has a fixture for 4 bulbs @ 48 inch that are CFL T-5 bulbs at 6500K As a tester shelf I hope to lower the indoor succulent lighting and cooling budget with the T-5 set up.

I plan on an adventure with LED for 2015 as they are " to new" to provide enough plant benifits to me a reason to GO ALL IN with LED at this time, and at price per bulb VS price per winter any budget savings is something to be disired yet would be easier to cool a indoor racked set up with LED

Bascly the CFL bulbs do provide more heat than the other mentioned LED It's to easy to confess that a cooler plant in comftable brightness is a happier plant
AND.
It's always nice to met a succulolic
For what it's worth being a succulolic isn't ( In my opinion) as bad as being a succahorder.

I picked up a Hydrofarm FLP44 today. Talked the local nursery into knocking 25% off since it was priced high. Also picked up a few new succulents, along with a truly awesome spider plant. That thing is HUGE! Need a table to spread things out and find a way to elevate the shorter plants. 4 54 watt t5HO 6500k bulbs I'm hoping will be plenty of light.

This is what I have so far. That table is awesome, height adjustable from Costco for $40. Should I up from 4 bulb t5 to 6 or 8 when the time comes to use the second table I am picking up tomorrow? Also, any tips on what to use to elevate the smaller plants? I plan to replant the Jades into more shallow pots I picked up this weekend.

Also, what is the lighting that a zebra striped aloe hybrid will take? Are they higher light than their standard Aloe cousins?

Bama_Joe
Place low plants on supports, for example, on the boxes. As me :)

...or upside-down pots...

Older/ used 2" TC pots being used for elevating shims
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1/4 sheet cake pan to hold potted plants

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Depending on the size of your pots the number of potted plants that fit on the 1/4 sheet cake pan will vary
A potted plant on the tray

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Usually a CFL fixture will only hold a certain type of bulb. Example a 4 foot T-8 CFL fixture will only hold 4 foot T-8 bulbs. Any fixture of any size has a ballast that automaticly controls voltage use to match the bulb(s) wattage use.

CFL bulb suggestion Deffinatly pick any bulb that states it's daylight color or Color 6500k I suggest you get the max lumens with lowest wattge use per bulb consumption

Which bulb .... It's a budget balacing act that you can decide for yourself keep in mind to make lighting adjustmnts that are comftable for you and your plant collection
What I concider first is,: Higher lumens with lower wattge per bulb cost more to purchace but cost less to operate. Bulbs with higher wattage with same or lower lumens per bulb cost less per bulb but are more costly to operate.

Second concidration I use is wattge use per bulb with two thoughts.
Wattage is heat & knowing that heat cooks food better than it grows plants I aim for lower wattge use per bulb with the best lumens and brightness color a bulb will give over a longer period of time.

Also wattage used over time equals kilo watts per hour is the measuring unit the electric company uses to bill on a monthly basis

I have a 2nd fixture on the way, Quantum T5 4ft 8 bulb (6500k bulbs on the way) and picked up another table. The Quantum seems to be even better than the fixture I purchased above. I will have to decide which plants will go under the 8 bulb Quantum and what goes under the 4 bulb hydrofarm. Either way, think I have it covered. Even have a jump start kit coming with germI nation mat and all (this will be for starting camellia, maple and catalpa trees for now...catalpa being first as a favor to my friend and his new home).

BTW...how is flowering induced? Is it by hours of sunlight?

Thanks for all the feedback.

How is flowering induced?
Flowering usually indicates it's the end of a plants annual growing cycle flowering is a result of good sunlight exposure but also has/had exposure to sufficent tempature variations from night to day or day to night while in good growing conditions.
To confuse more flowering can also bloom in the beginning of a plants growing cycle, as well some will flower in the middle of it's growing cycle and some will flower more than once a year ( a growing season).

Often stronger, air is always moving outside dont let it stop moving while inside under lights

If you have good light at that window, why not try some plant hangers? You don't have to spend hours with macrame, just a few well-placed knots on good small gauge nylon rope. No more than a few bucks can make you a bunch of hangers. Just make sure you use strong hooks and place them in a stud to secure them from falling. That's just my two-cents worth. I'm too cheap to go out a purchase an expensive lighting set up. But, I would definitely re-purpose an old aquarium light. =)

If you are looking for a storage solution, and not lighting, I have suggestions!

I currently live in a similar set up, with only one window for good lighting. I bought a 4 tier shelving unit from Lowes. The kind used in garages for tools etc. They had more expensive metal options, as well as cheaper plastic versions, about $30 for the one I got. Hope that helps!

Rina - What are you using for a planting medium? It looks like sand with rock.

I currently have Miracle Grow Cacti mix and just purchased some Faford and a bag of perlite. Getting ready to repot a lot of the new purchases and wondered if I'm very far off. Also, what fertilizer are you mixing in when repotting or just juicing? Do you get your pots at random places?

Joe

All my succulents are potted in mix of turface, chicken grit & perlite; some in turface & chicken grit only, some in chicken grit & perlite. Only few have little bark added in. (I have some pots where I used aquarium gravel - size is good). I top dress with either larger chicken grit or some decorative stones (not always, but often).
I sift dust out of chicken grit, sift perlite to get dust & smallest particles out and rinse them both.
I add some slow release fertilizer when initially making a mix (I use Miracle Gro - that's what is available here).
I also use liquid MiracleGro.
I started making Gritty Mix exactly as suggested, but some ingredients are more difficult to find. I think I understand reasonably well about potting mixes, so I use whatever available to me & try to adjust amounts accordingly. I am getting well draining potting mix & don't have problem with over watering now.

Majority of my pots are plastic...I recycle pots, in summer I get more from garden centers that collect them back - they are free. I have many more empty. I have some clay & decorative pots, and some different containers that I liked to use for plants. Either as a cache pots, or I drill holes in them for drainage if potting into.

Rina

Edited to add: most of my pots are 4", obviously there are some bigger for larger plants, and few mixed plants pots.

Below-mix of chicken grit, perlite, turface, some black aquarium gravel.

This post was edited by rina_ on Fri, Jan 2, 15 at 23:22

Rina

What is turface?

Joe

Turface is calcined clay product, used on golf courses and playfields. It is laso used a lot in bonsai, succulent growing and similar. It is light, porous and lasts long time. If you can't find it, there are other materials with very similar characteristics. Here is thread from GW about some alternative products:
click to read

There are few members here that don't care for it. I personally like it & use it a lot. Reasonably priced, it is just under $20/50lb bag in Ontario, Canada. I think it may be even less in USA.
I screen it thru window screen to get rid of smallest particles, using what doesn't fall thru. I throw small particles on garden beds.
I learned about it here, on GW, reading posts by Al (tapla) about soils. If you are interested & didn't read them yet, here are some links:
read about soils here

I would use lots of scoria, pumice - but find it more difficult to buy.

Rina

I've read that you need proper airflow as well. I have a ceiling fan, but guessing that isn't the type of airflow you're talking about. What do you folks use?

Ceiling is better than no fan, floor-standing fan, even small computer fans are being used.
I have table-top fan, but find it too strong (unfortunately, only 1 speed).
Rina

Sweet, thanks Rina! I get the idea, just slow movement of air. Nothing spectacular. I have a two speed desk fan at work that isn't being used....time to come home with papa.

Winter is a great time to start planning a greenhouse. ;)

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Didn't get to repot them this weekend, but did get the new light. 8 bulb Quantum T5. Will need to move both setups out of my bedroom. Running out of space with a King size bed.

Joe

Fancy light fixture.
Are you using any tray /saucers under your pots?
You'll be squeezing them together very soon, you can double (or more) amount of pots on that table - just like in that GH hoovb posted above...with your recent new additions you will have to shrink your bed, lol.

Rina

I do on under some of the clay pots on the table behind that one. The new pots I purchased, also picked up saucers for them. Good to know I'm not out of room. I picked up a 2ft jump start kit for my third table so may be trying out some seeds....at the least...I will grow some fruits and veggies indoors. :)

Do you water the saucer like some and let the plant suck up what it needs, or do you water from the top? I read to be careful not to water the leaves, but thats what happens in nature, so didn't understand why they said to avoid water on leaves.

Joe

I keep most of the pots in 'comunal' saucer/dish/trays. Like plastic trays they sell for seed starting. I also have few long & shallow former cookie sheets that hold at least 14 - 4" pots. Easy to water, no spills or leaks. It would be a problem if you constantly overwatering & too much water drains out & sits in the tray. Doesn't happen to me too often anymore. If I want to flush the plant, I usually take it to the sink/laundry tub. I do have saucers too, mostly for clay pots and any large pots.
I water from top. Water may get on the leaves occasionally, but it is not a problem unless you do it all the times, or let it sit in the center of rosette. Easy to avoid if you use a watering can with 'skinny' spout. I have also watering screw-on tips from Lee Valley click to see that fit on most plastic bottles that I use too.

Rina

My room in the winter plenty of plants

Far left my junk bucket random cuttings
Moon cactis graft inside because of cold
Dog tail cactus
Aloe Vera pups
A underwatered mammilaria
A lucky bamboo Dracaena

Hi Joe.

I have grown cacti and succulents at various places over the past seventy five years -- northern England, Texas, southern California, Florida and, for the past forty five years, here in southern Arizona. I have always wintered many of my plants on south facing windowsills (sometimes year round). In my opinion the most important factor to consider when using natural light for illumination is closeness of the plants to the window glass -- in general, the closer the better for plant health, strong spination and flower production -- that is why I use small square plastic pots -- 4" (10cm) maximum size -- which fit comfortably on my windowsill ledge.

Just for general information here are some notes and pics relating to my current windowsill growing activities:

During cold days, and at night during the winter months, I maintain my plants in small square plastic pots indoors on south facing windowsills that receive full sunshine. On sunny winter days, when the temperature rises to around 60ðF approx. 16ðC) -- which happens quite frequently in southern Arizona -- they go outside on the patio, coming inside as the temperature drops at nightfall. With the arrival of spring - when the daytime temperature climbs into the 80's F (mid 20's C) and the nighttime temperatures are in the 50's F (10's C) - they stay outside until the arrival once again of winter temperatures

Following are some photos of staged indoor windowsill plants:

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South facing windowsill - a rainy day in Tucson - Arrojadoa dinae & Discocactus buenekeri

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South facing windowsill - an early January morning - Arrojadoa horstiana, Euphorbia balsamifera subsp. adenensis, Arrojadoa dinae, Discocactus buenekeri, Arrojadoa multiflora

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South facing windowsill - an early January morning - close-up pic of Euphorbia balsamifera ssp. adenensis in 4" (10cm) square plastic pots plus seedling in 2þ" (7cm) square plastic pot (flanked by Arrojadoa).

This post was edited by jpaz on Wed, Jan 7, 15 at 0:25

My 1 window

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I use cfls for my terrs and have found the daylight spectrum to be quite useful. I use 100-200W equivalent bulbs. That said there are no cacti/succs in my terrs, but I do have orchids and other plants there.

Something to keep in mind, Joe, is that the 4-6 inches at either end of a 4ft fluorescent tube are quite deficient light-wise. High light plants should be placed so they receive light from the rest of the tube. Low light plants can be allocated to the weaker zones near the ends.

Rina -Thats a good idea and a space saver as well. I haven't seen any seedling trays, but it is winter.

Jpaz - I really love the look of that Euphorbia. Will have to find a place to pick one up. Having a hard time finding upright succulents with a trunk like stem, Tylecodons were a no go. I don't like ordering with personal check or money order from a stranger.

I broke up my large jades, pruned the lower leaves, trying to thicken up the trunks and make them larger specimens.

Joe