Talk to the general contractor.

contractor says the spots can be dealt with, but that's what he said the first time. he's arranged a meeting with floor company owner

If you hire another floor guy please insure they are NWFA certified no matter what your GC says. Actually if the GC hired this floor guy it's on him. Go the woodfloors.org to find a properly trained individual instead of a glorified labourer. Not sure why these gc's hire such crappy workers?!?

Thanks so much for the advice. the floors are solid Brazilian walnut. our general contractor is arranging a meeting with the owner of the floor company. at this point, but we're tired of this remodel process and want a discount but our GC says it's not possible.

@cellisteph just so your aware IPE ( Braz walnut) is extremely unstable and requires the RH in the home to be on the higher side to have proper stability. It is also difficult to work with. Keep these facts in mind as the 'hardest' wood isn't always the best choice for the 'environment' it's installed in.

Ultimate Hardwood, you are correct. I had mine removed after 3 long years

I typically don't install IPE. Too problematic. Best used as an exterior product. Can be used as siding/decking unfinished and lasts like at least 50 years outside!

Thanks, our contractor/ floor guy found our interior moisture too high so they used dehumidifiers before installation. what is the recommended humidity for indoor IPE?

40-60% RH also what is the m/c of the flooring and subfloor? I think this is going in a negative direction. I'd grill the GC and the installer? What ate their qualification/certifications EXACTLY?? Most GC's aren't any sort of trade qualified(cabinet maker,framer,etc). Also look up the emptor caviat clause in your contract. Please tell me there's one. PLEASE!!!!!

*are

Thank you!

@Cancork, if the floors already have multiple coats of polyurethane, would they need to remove it to fix the edging issues, dings, and scratches?

@Ultimate Hardwood, what does m/c stand for? The flooring company is a member of NWFA but doesn't appear to be certified.

The contract says: "I understand all hardwood flooring is to be installed in the workmanship manner according to specifications and grading rules of the National
Oak Flooring Mfrs. Assoc. or the Maple Flooring Mfrs. Assoc., which do not guarantee against cupping, buckling, shrinkage or insect infestation. Town and
Country Flooring Center shall not be responsible or liable in any manner for latent defects in sub floors, such as moisture in concrete, wood shrinkage,
swelling, etc."

They said they'd use putty to fill the hole below and fix the lighter edging issues, but they didn't. They also coated over debris like cat hair, although they said they'd clean up. We put blue tape on all the spots that had issues, but they simply removed the tape and didn't fix them. Is it reasonable to ask for a 25% discount for their sloppy workmanship and just leave the floors as they are?

You should ask for the entire thing to be redone as promised. This is sloppy, and you'll hate yourself every time you walk around and notice another lazy area these people cut corners. IF they didn't want to redo it, they shouldn't have done a lazy job the first time!

M/C is moisture content, cellisteph.

You can call the NWFA and lodge a complaint against them. They will be ordered to rectify and or be fined or lose membership. In the future always hire certified pros so this won't happen again. If a company is not properly trained AND certified then how could they possibly understand the trade,execution of flawless technique and correct procedure and product usage?The short answer is they can't/won't/don't.

I agree with mediahead - these floors are unacceptable. Start over. Even if it means that the reno drags on. There is no excuse for shoddy work - and this is very shoddy work. The damaged boards should never have been installed in the first place. I'm not sure what's going on with the light edges - hard to see from the pictures what is reflection and what is actually lighter color. At least one of the photos appears to show sapwood, which is dramatically lighter in color. (top photo) What grade wood was this? Premium/Clear should not have any sapwood in it. Also, with the end cuts looking light in the photo, which they shouldn't be, as this wood isn't stained, I'm wondering if they didn't clean properly after sanding - so what you're seeing is a sawdust. Given the other stuff they've just finished over, I wouldn't be surprised. I've looked at picture after picture of Ipe installed as flooring and it should NOT look like that. And are those nail holes along the baseboard?? (2nd pic) If so, then the floors were installed TO the baseboard, not under it as should be done. Baseboards should be removed, flooring installed, then put back.

Thanks so much, everyone. Really appreciate your helpful advice. I told the contractor the floors are unacceptable, but he claims the floors look good, and the small spots can be dealt with. The contractor is the one who hired the floor company; we didn't have a say in the matter, so can we actually still call the NWFA and file a complaint?

@macpaddy, my husband thinks the dots are nail holes that kept the bundles of wood together. We'll ask about the grade wood when we meet the floor company owner tomorrow. We don't know how we're going to convince them to redo it other than threatening to call the NWFA. Even if they did redo it, we don't trust them to do a good job...Needless to say, this is keeping me up at night.

Here are more pics. The floors are "natural stain".

When you don't look too closely, the floors seem fine:

We also asked our contractor to protect our appliances/cabinets during buffing/coating, but they said it wasn't necessary. We returned home to find this:

Yes still call the NWFA Forsure. Also call an NWFA certified inspector to assist you. Did the flooring company ding the fridge? Im starting to get a clearer picture of your dilemma. It's the things we can't see that's starting to concern me. I would ask the flooring company to produce (physically see for your self) the m/c and RH readings prior to install. I'd also ask to see the invoice from the floor company.Dont pay your GC another dime for the flooring until it's done according to NWFA industry standards. Definately hire an inspector!!!!

As to the grade, if they tell you it's clear, it's not: Clear grade Brazilian Walnut flooring is color-sorted for a rich consistent deep reddish brown color. Ipe is a dark-colored wood and is most popular in the Clear grade. Ipe gets its nickname (“Brazilian Walnut”) from its resemblance in color to true American Walnut, to which it is not related. Nor should it be confused with Imbuia, which is also sometimes referred to as “Brazilian Walnut.” Only the heartwood of the tree is used in the Clear grade. Ipe is more brown in color than Brazilian Cherry but darker than Brazilian Teak. With Select and Better Brazilian Walnut flooring, much color variation will be present from browns to green, red, and yellow. With Rustic grade Ipe flooring, color ranges dramatically. http://www.countyfloors.com/grade_exo_brazilianwalnut.html

I've never seen nails used to keep a bundle of hardwood flooring together, BTW - that would damage the wood and there is no way the manufacturer is going to do that. The fact that the nail holes are along the edge of the baseboard makes me think they're from nailing that edge - which all should have been done UNDER the baseboard. Did they remove the baseboards to put the flooring down? That, to me, is the only acceptable way to do it. One option, if removing baseboards isn't possible for some reason, is to add a quarter round or shoe molding (and often that's done either way).

@Ultimate Hardwood, it appears that the flooring company dented both sides of our dishwasher. Also there are little holes in our toekick that we've just noticed- we're not sure where they came from, perhaps the buffing machine? How would an NWFA inspection help? We got a quote of $375 and trying to understand if it's worth the cost.

@macpaddy, thanks for clarifying what clear IPE is. Is there a certificate that'll prove what grade our wood is? They did remove the baseboards to put the flooring down (and now want to charge $3k for interior paint, which is another story). Nails aren't the right word, but there were some metal things keeping the wood together, which the picture below doesn't capture. This was taken before the wood was naturally stained.

An inspection will point out the flaws,how to remedy them and is the final say on the workmanship. Plus if you want to recover costs it will also help with that too. Usually once it's been inspected the situation will come to a close. It will expose any 'untruths' told by the GC or flooring guy.

I've heard that regular inspectors charge $300 - $400 for a wood flooring inspection. A NWFA Certified wood flooring inspector (some have more than 1 certification so you need to make sure you professional is WOOD FLOORING certified...and that certification comes from NWFA) can charge as much as $750 (depending on where you live and how close they are to you).

The cost of the inspection will equal out. If you DON'T do it...you will struggle to get ANYTHING out of the GC... If you do the NWFA inspection, you are almost guaranteed to get some sort of benefit with very little 'fight'.

If someone told you that a $375 "retainer fee" for a lawyer would get you "instant results", would you do it? Probably. Think of the inspection fee as part of making this RIGHT without much more effort.

NWFA inspectors are well versed to move into a court room. Other inspectors may not have the clout that NWFA inspectors have...they are considered "experts" by most court systems in N. America. That is what you are buying = Court-ready documentation for proof of "fault" by GCs/Installers.

Well said @cancork!!

Thanks so much, @Cancork and Ultimate Hardwood. I've just learned from the NWFA that the floor company isn't even a member of NWFA, although they're promoting themselves as such. NWFA is going to send a cease-and desist letter to them. In the meantime, our GC met with the floor company at our house, and they agreed that the floors need more work (re: sand and start over.) Is there still a need to hire an NWFA-certified inspector?

Get it in writing!!! And specify exactly whom will pay what.

I second that!!! And "good girl" for finding out that they are NOT NWFA! Way to go! I would 'wait and see' before going to an inspector. They are offering to do the work...so let them (as per Ultimate...get it in writing).

You can always bring in an NWFA inspector LATER. In the building world, the initial installer is allowed 1 kick at the can to get this right. Once they have mucked up that single attempt, now you bring in the big guns. NWFA inspector. An NWFA flooring installer who will come in and fix the floor on the GC's DIME!

The GC and flooring store owner have just discovered that you have a back bone and have some "insider knowledge" as to what they are up to. My guess is they will do everything possible to make sure you are "happy" and that you "keep quiet" about some of this.

I'm hoping the flooring store will send out their best team to make this happen. This would be cheaper for them than if the "first team" tried and failed.

Is the GC or the flooring company going to do something about the damage to the dishwasher door? And sanding won't take out the major imperfections - some of those boards shouldn't have gone down in the first place. Watch them very, very carefully. Also - what quality flooring were you paying for? If Premium/Clear, then that is definitely not what you got. It should be spelled out in your contract with the GC.

Thanks so much for your helpful advice. The GC claims that the dents on the dishwasher door are details that are naturally part of the original design, since there are somewhat matching dents on both sides. I'm contacting Thermador to verify.

The contract doesn't spell out premium vs. clear. Is it possible to reasonable to ask them:

"We would like written documentation of the following:

• grade and type of wood
• RH and M/C readings prior to installation
• invoices to Jim Walters Construction

We would prefer a NWFA-certified floor installer to complete the project. The imperfect boards shouldn't have gone down in the first place, so please make sure they take out the bad boards and replace the new pieces before re-sanding. Please also ensure that the floors are absolutely clean before coating."

Absolutely. That's is your right to ask that!!!! Do not compromise from this point on at all or you know how things will turn out. Be firm but fair. Everything in writing. As a matter of fact do not let them proceed to the refinish phase until you have all the proper readings. If you call the NWFA they will tell you what your readings should be.

Unbelievably, the floor company didn't even record the readings and can't produce them in writing. Our GC and his boss are both going out of town, and they refuse to hire a different floor company. What should we do?!

I'm assuming here that you have no financial leverage (ie: you've paid them all that is owing?). If you haven't paid them, then you've got some leverage, but if you have, then you have very little and it's going to be hard to get them to do what you want, as they can just walk away. Any legal action would require an inspection by a NWFA inspector, I'd think - and even then, there is no guarantee that you'll recover what you'll need to spend to go that route or that you'll win - and then whether or not you'll actually get anything even if you do win. (some of these guys are masters at this - they'll just change company names, close out bank accounts, open new ones...trying to get money out of them is like trying to squeeze blood from a stone) How reputable is the GC? Is he well-established in the community, with an excellent reputation he'd be anxious to maintain? From what you've been saying, it doesn't sound like he cares a whole lot, which is not a good sign. You could, of course, get another company in (or several) to give you estimates on remediation, so you'll know what your options are and how much they'll cost. Sometimes you just have to bite the bullet, consider it a costly learning experience and move on if all other avenues have been exhausted.

OK. They don't have readings (their mistake...and it could be costly for them in the long run). What did they promise would happen? What is their 'fix' that they have offered? Did you get it in writing? An email with a response = in writing...FYI.

They are allowed their ONE attempt. This is all they get. Once the attempt has been made you've done your duty to "them". Should their "fix" turn out poorly, NOW you go ahead and get the NWFA inspector in, get a full report and then go shopping for an NWFA installer to remedy the situation.

And so the legal wrangling begins. Technically the money to correct the issues should be coming from the 1st GC/Install team. How that happens is all part of the negotiations.

I hope you have held back a large percentage of money (30%-50%). This money is what they want. Once they have it...they won't be back (or they will try hard not to come back). So long as you have some of "their" money...you have leverage. If you've paid them out, this is going to get very ugly.

Fire them all!! Start over again. The websters dictionary states the the definition of insanity is to keep repeating over and over again hoping for different results one time. Cut your losses while you still can. That flooring company is a fraud and reflects upon the GC as the same. FIGHT!

Given your other posting re: this GC and his $1600 charge for protection of the house during construction and the obviously bad job he did of that, I'm inclined to think you're dealing with a bad apple here. However, if you can let us know some of the answers to the questions re: holdbacks (if any) and what, if anything, you have in writing to help your cause, as well as the general reputation of this contractor (Homestars, BBB etc.) then it might be a little easier to give some advice. Given that you've not be happy with the fixes so far, I'm generally inclined to agree with Ultimate Hardwood Ltd, but whether or not you have financial leverage is important. Clearly this contractor does NOT care about the quality of his work, and it's therefore going to be difficult to get him to perform no matter what you do; in that respect, I think it's time to bring in someone else. The only outstanding question is - who pays for it?

Thank you so much for your advice, everyone.

Town & Country Flooring already attempted to fix it once and failed, so we really don't want to work with them anymore.

Our GC texted that his construction company would pay Town & Country for the floor refinish. But when I pressed him for the grade of the wood and why we have to work with T&C he said, "I give up".

We already paid 95% of the flooring, but still have 12% of the remaining project to pay... In the meantime, Thermador confirmed that the "dents" in the dishwasher are not part of the original design. No response from the GC office regarding this, although they originally said it was the appliance store's problem.

I cannot find our GC in Homesteads or BBB. I've tried fighting but to no avail... My coworker referred the GC to us because he is her friend and neighbor, and when he texted, "I give up", I replied, "Do you give up on [my coworker's name] and your reputation too?" And he responded, "Threats don't work. I'm retiring. Call Dave at Town and Country."

Any advice on finding a good lawyer would be greatly appreciated!

So...he's retiring and therefore doesn't give a fig? Jeez...what an ass. And what a way to wrap up a career. Well, definitely don't give him the final 12%. I didn't think those dents were part of the design - was the DW in perfect shape when it was delivered? If so, then it's the GC's responsibility to replace it. I'd take nothing less; I didn't realize it was brand new - of course if you didn't see it and inspect it, then he could claim that the store delivered it that way, but then, who was in charge of accepting and installing it? No way you should have to accept something like that. If he's the Jim Walters Construction in Belmont, CA, he has good reviews on Yelp from 2012-2013. As for a lawyer - I live in Canada, so not much help there, I'm afraid. If your claim is under $10K you can sue in small claims court, which doesn't require a lawyer.

From the looks of T&C's Yelp reviews (other than yours and a couple of others) most are happy with their work, so you'd hope that *maybe* they'd make good on things. I'd try one more time with them, though of course, they've likely already been paid by Jim so getting them back may be next to impossible. You may have to go ahead and get someone else in to refinish the floors (having exhaustively documented the issues, gotten written witness testimony - this is where paying the NFWA inspector would be worthwhile) before you do anything. Then sue for the cost of the fixes - including the dishwasher if nobody has made good on that.

Floor company emailed: "The wood that was used 3/4 x 5 inch solid unfinshed Brazilian Walnut Clear Grade and was installed within the guidelines."

What guidelines is he talking about? Do we need to hire a NWFA inspector at this point to verify the grade?

The GC's boss emailed: "I saw the defects and unfortunately the floors need re-sanding and re-coating. They will scrape out the light filler and use a more color matched putty. There are so many color variations we have to use a color that will blend better with the dark pieces. The scratches, lines etc. will be gone and the wood around the vents will be sanded smooth. The downside .... 5 days to refinish. [GC] has offered his cabin for a mini vacation for a few days . And we will put you up in a local hotel for the balance or all of the nights whatever you want."

GC has texted asking us to order a new dishwasher, and the GC's office or he "will pay for it if needed."

Wow that sounds good to me. Any installer worth his weight will use the dust from fine sanding mixed with glista wood flour cement to make the filler. NWFA all the way. I'm done responding here. Thank u.

Well that's a bit of a turnaround. Can't help but wonder if posting his name here and this discussion turned things around...?? I still don't think they used the top grade of Brazilian Walnut here - it's usually much more uniformly dark, and colour matched. You wouldn't see the wild colour variations. Is the floor colour and variation what you were expecting? Every single flooring place I've checked online describes "Clear" as a uniform shade with minimal light and dark variations. And now I've got a new concern: if those lines we're seeing around the ends and sides of some planks are PUTTY, they've done a really poor job of installing this stuff. They shouldn't have to putty anything but nail holes - and those should be under the darn baseboards. We've installed our own hardwood flooring and we didn't have to putty anything at all. End cuts should be tight and flush with no need for putty and if they're filling along the length of a plank, they've not installed it properly.

OMG. I am so sorry for your troubles. Thankfully it sounds like you will get some sort of resolution.

What fabulous help you got from Houzzers; they are the best.

And I am so glad I used grade A clear white oak stained to a medium brown for my floors.

Thanks, everyone for your advice and sympathy! I'm so grateful to have found a wonderful Houzz community.

Quick update: my husband and I found an NWFA-certified installer who quoted $8k to repair the floors. We've asked our contractor to refund this amount after they acknowledged the floors were unacceptable. They are now asking us to sign a change order with the following language by today; otherwise, they will get the original floor installer to come back to repair our floors.

"Repairs as required and final finish of hardwood floor to be done by others. Owner releases
Jim Walters Construction of all liability and warranty pertaining to the hardwood floor finish portion of the contract."

Should we sign the CO?

I would go directly with the installer and HIS written warranty. Once that GC leaves he's never coming back!! NWFA installer is bound to the customer thru the association. Release the GC for sure but get the installers warranty in writing.

The warranty from the NWFA professional will be worth FAR MORE than Mr. Walter could offer. Go for it...but get the installer's warranty in writing...just as Ultimate suggests.