Sophie knows about 1000% more than I do, but one thing I do know, is that I would be very wary of a fabricator who would be OK installing a counter that is known to need supports before said supports were in place. And yes, he should have discussed the options (such as invisible steel beam which would have been great) before he even quoted you a price.

I don't have any overhang in my kitchen so can't speak to the specifics. But I would be very disappointed in your fabricator/contractor.

OMG!!!!! Now what?!?!?

What did the fabricator say when he installed it? This is unbelievable, that a licensed and bonded installer and fabricator would leave you with this and that YOU have to get corbels installed?

Paige, did your contractor not put plywood roughtop down before placing granite? My island is 100"L & contractor put roughtop down cut to shape before fabricator templated countertop. It is bow-shaped w/ 7" overhang on ends, 12" in center. I have 2 corbels under the 12" section. I wasn't home when this was done, but I'm 99% sure corbels went on before roughtop. No way should 15" of granite be unsupported. You'll notice they never display it flat in stores. It's always on edge -- for a reason. My corbels are 8.5"D, so less than 4" overhang. Compensated by going w/ 26"H stools. Until you find out about roughtop & corbels installed, support granite w/ 2x4" posts underneath. Our K is transitional. Our CKD offered choice of corbels or steel, but I wanted corbel for architectural detail. If I had contemporary or modern (ain't happenin' in my house), I might have gone w/ steel.

Plywood isn't support. It flexes. Plywood is used as a thickness builder when 2cm stone has a laminated edge.

In this situation, your KD and cabinet installer are all equally culpable. Too many overhangs are done without any thought as to the engineering for their support.

The support possibilities begins in the design phase. The back of the cabinets has to physically be thick enough to accept corbels if that is the route taken. It may have to be reinforced if it is the typical thin 1/4" (or less) cabinet back. It is like building a house. You don't put on the roof until the foundation is correct.

My mention of plywood roughtop was not to suggest that it's sufficient. But it does spread the support offered by corbels or steel braces from underneath, & would minimize risk of catastrophic failure of 15" of overhang until proper bracing is installed.

Sophie, as usual, is !00% right. The installer should have placed steel supports. This is a potentially dangerous situation and the installer needs to come back right away.

Here is a picture. It becomes part of the cabinets....

http://www.countertopbracket.com/Countertop-Support-Hidden-Standard-Plus-p/sp.html.

All of this should have been discussed with the designer and installer.

While you are waiting , wedge something like a table under there for support. Or use telescoping building or car jacks.

I'm 99% sure my countertop is 3 cm as I bought 2 super slabs. I'll check my receipts tomorrow. If I'm correct, my installer & fabricator are very conservative, as I have roughtop.

No matter the thickness like lwo states if the cabinet is not supported to acxcpt the corbels and the weight they will carry they will not work. Corbels work best as decoration not support. This needed steel set in place before the tops were installed. The installer screwed the pooch and the GC helped him.

MillworkMan is correct. I'd bought 3 corbels, but our installer said there were only 2 points at which he could install them to carry the load. Hence I have one left over. I'm planning to buy another when I place an order for a bathroom vanity & I will use those two to make a console table-like shelf under a painting in the living room. There's structural engineering factors that go into these design decisions.

"There's structural engineering factors that go into these design decisions.''

Which is why non Pro's should keep the anecdotal chit chat to themselves and cease from offering ''advice'' when life and limb is on the line.

Then tell her what to do next. She said, "what next"?

There are some other supports that can be added after install in steel maybe check those out ( for some reason my computer won’t let me post pics this morning)

"Then tell her what to do next. She said, "what next"?"

Take it all apart, have the correct and proper steel supports installed and reset the tops. If that is beyond the comprehension of her installers, then she needs to get her money and back and find professional installers.

What next depends on the construction of the cabinetry, the layout of the individual cabinets, the pocketbook, and the willingness of those professionals who have thus far failed her to step up and diagnose and repair the situation. It is not a situation that can be resolved without on site interaction between all parties involved. Not solvable on the Internet.

If Sophie Wheeler's comment was directed at moi, the only "advice" I gave was to brace it from underneath w/ 2x4's until problem resolved. I did give several anecdotes about my island countertop experience. In 35+ yrs. of building power plants from small cogen to 1,100 MW nuclear ones, I may have encountered structural issues.

Thanks everyone (pro and non-pro). I'm going to call my fabricator Monday, and see what can be done. Until then, here are some pics! I still love them!

They're beautiful. Hope they're made right soon so you & your family can enjoy them. And while I'm not signed up as Pro here, we do have "A" General Engr'g license. So while not an Houzz Pro, not a neophyte either.

As tastefully as your K has been done, be interested in seeing updated pics showing your backspash when it's installed.

Still trying to decide on a backsplash, but new appliances coming this week!

Lovely kitchen. Do a plain backsplash.

Good thing you called the contract and make sure he does the right thing asap as that is definitely not a safe installation. Corbels are definitely no bueno for that install. That is going to need a good bit of steel reinforcing for certain.

Does this apply to Quartz as well? The fabricator told me that 12 inch overhang would be fine without corbels since it was Quartz not granite...

I agree that the flat steel supports are the best, as long as you have a good way of securing them. Just as a point of clarification, most countertop fabricators have in their contracts/work orders that the contractor ( or consumer if no contractor is involved) must have the proper supports in place before the countertop is installed. We work with several different fabricators and none of them install the support. They expect it to be done before they arrive.

This is an idea of what they look like.

Casandra383, my 100"L island has quartz countertop that is bow-shaped, 7" overhang on ends & 12" overhang for ~1/2 the length. My CKD didn't offer no braces option, either steel or corbels. I'd check w/ manufacturer or local distributor to verify your fabricator's statement. I also have plywood roughtop under it. Quartz may be stronger than granite b/c of the epoxy, but it's also heavy.

According to the Marble Institute of America, you can safely overhang granite that is 1- 1/4″ thick up to 10″ without supports. This should include Quartz also.

Cassandra, your top should have steel supports underneath. The problem, as I see it, with corbels is it provides a lot of support in a small space. The steel supports spread that support over a larger space and the risk of cracking is minimized.

Here are Caesarstone guidelines. Because it is a table I am having trouble pasting it, so here is the website. Instructions are on page 20.

http://media.caesarstoneus.com/pdf/CS_FabManual_0910.pdf

They say 1 1/4" needs no additional support up to 16". I would be uncomfortable with that.

Bruce, I bet that Newhaven looks beautiful with your cabinets. Picks up the red flecks!! If I had not gone with white I was going with natural cherry and Newhaven!!

Kathi Steele, the Cambria Newhaven is perfect match. It's been in 18 mos. & my wife still comments at least once a week how happy she is w/ both the choice of quartz & Newhaven. Our CKD has 4x4" samples of everything Cambria offers. On way back from trip to sis-i-law's in Tucson we stopped at their huge showroom in Rancho Mirage where they display full slabs. Guess which one they didn't have? We found tile stone that had 12x12" samples to verify we liked bigger sample as much as 4x4. About 4 or 5 months Cambria sent cutting board made of Newhaven w/ medallion on it. Our CKD gave me her invitation to their reception where they introduced lastest new lines. Beautiful. Movement looks more natural, & for those who go for the dramatic, they had a couple dazzling new lines. The tile store owner where we bought our backsplash tile knows a couple of principals at Cambria. She said they have best business ethics.

Crash's, our son's Staffordshire, view

of our countertop, roughtop & corbel

We have the same dilemma. We just had a 8.5' granite counter top with a 12" overhang installed. Prior to installation we talked to the owner of the shop he said we would not need support. The installers said we would AFTER installing it. We have a panel design on the front of the knee wall and would like to place the corbels in between the panels. However they are only 2" wide. I'm concerned a cornel that width will not be sturdy enough to support the tile, even with Bree o them being installed.

Hi Mary, yeah, sounds like we are in the same boat. I've had my granite now for a couple months without any reinforcement, and so far, so good. We just got 5 corbels about the same width as yours, and we will install them shortly. They will have to do. Hoping for the best!

OMG, after reading through this thread again, where's your contractor/ GC in all of this? Sounds like corbels are going to be purely decorative. Make sure nobody sits at that counter or leans on it until it is safely supported! I hope there are no small children or animals afoot. How on earth did this pass inspection? How did your contractor get permits passed?
Has he been paid in full? This may be a good small claims case.

There are corbels 2" in width that can support 250 lbs each. We had no GC since we were just replacing our existing counter and new tile backsplash. We discussed the possible need of support for the countertop with the owner of the stone company before the install. He said it wasn't needed. After the granite was installed the workers said it was. After checking the specifications with the Marble Institute of America we realized we needed supports. So now we are are looking for an answer.

I would remove it and start over, sorry for your troubles.

Mary, does your granite have edge that creates a lip underneath? If so, maybe you could put 3/8" plywood there to go betw. top & corbels. That would help distribute the load the corbels support w/o putting discrete pressure points on stone itself. But this would only be aesthetically acceptable as long as plywood is hidden by an edge. Also would probably help if plywood is glued to stone. Not as ideal as if roughtop supported by base cabs, but an improvement if doable.

Sandy C. "pass inspection"? "permits passed"? I don't think we have to do that here. No way can I remove them and start over. I didn't have a contractor through this process. I only had the fabricator and his crew that installed them. I asked the crew before they left if they'd be OK, and one of the guys jumped on it with all his body weight and said it would be fine.

I thought you were doing a remodel. Did you work with a designer? Who drew up the plans for you? Seems someone is responsible. If you did all of this on your own without permits, I guess it's up to you to fix the problem. The countertops need to be replaced. Make sure you hire a qualified insured and bonded contractor.

A known danger that is not corrected creates a condition of personal liability for the homeowner. An incorrectly supported granite counter is the same category as a pool without a fence around it. It is an attractive nuisance, and you are required to mitigate risk or assume responsibility for liability. Your insurance company will not cover any losses created by the known danger. If a child or small animal is harmed by accessing the pool or breaking the unsupported counter, the resulting lawsuits will not be defended by insurance. Your personal assets are up for grabs.

Mary and Paige, you need to research the MIA's guidelines for overhangs. The problem with corbels is they support 250 pounds for a very small area. Please see what their limits are for length and width of support.

Granite, marble and quartz are very heavy materials and if not supported correctly, can at any time, crack and break off. As a home owner, you have to be aware of the liability if it breaks and falls on someone. That is why you should have steel supports for your overhang.

I have a formica countertop with an overhang that has steel supports.

Please see my post from May 21 that has the link on it.

Here is a picture. It becomes part of the cabinets....

http://www.countertopbracket.com/Countertop-Support-Hidden-Standard-Plus-p/sp.html.

I really wish I could install these after the fact. Ughhhh

Paige, maybe instead using brackets like those shown by Brickwood Builders & Kathi S., you could use flat L-braces attached to the solid parts of your peninsula, & then cover them w/ flat corbels or pilasters that don't interfere w/ knees. The JB's for the electrical outlets are attached to solid parts. Enkeboll & Dubois have them in several styles, some only 1.5"D. Here's an example in acanthus.

Might be a viable alternative. I am not sure. Probably should read the MIA paper.

I saw these in a house I was showing to a buyer.

H Reber, these corbels look like something from the bowsprit of a sailing ship.

My kitchen designer said these two corbels would be enough support for our 12 inch over hang. My husband tested it by doing a pushup on them. They are nailed to the studs. They seem very sturdy, for sure they can hold over 220 lbs.

"My kitchen designer said these two corbels would be enough support for our 12 inch over hang."

Bamboo Good:

Your kitchen designer needs to spend a bit more time studying the MIA's Natural Stone Countertop Installation manual. The corbels are fine, but there is too much span between them. Put one on the end and one between the existing and you should be fine. Page 3 specifically.

Hi. Not sure if anyone still is looking for info on this. I was having a hard time with the same issue and found this site. I emailed them and got a response right away (even though it was a Sunday). Tyler is very knowledgeable. Hope it helps. We ordered ours from him. https://www.tylermorriswoodworking.com/corbels/faq

Im just curious if you asked them how they suppoted it. i have real quartzite countertops with a 13 inch overhang.it hhas no corblrles at all.they put carbon fiber flat bars molded onto the bottom of the countertop.its as strong as the metal but better because the stainless steele bars are usually low quality and stillend up rusting