Mama...are you thinking about a smaller Miele?

One that hooks up to a regular 15Amp. 120V line?

And something like this...(or even smaller)?

Hummmm.....

Another reason I don't like a FL is because unless you plan on building a platform yourself, you pretty much need to buy one of their cabinets because the machine doors sit so low.

The top loader that I like is the Samsung with the built in scrubber bowl.

MamaP - many of us have thought for some time that a dual-machine setup would be ideal for you: FL for your daily washing needs with really hot washes, and a TL for your soaks and linen projects. I'm glad you've come to this realization. And you would finally be able to stop carrying pots of boiling water to the laundry! A 120v Miele or Electrolux would serve you well, I think. A *new* Miele would only be a Euro-size application, but 'Lux could give you small or large. With the number of loads you do, I think you would actually adapt to the smaller volume quite well.

Regarding pedestal: Yeah, ain't no fun bending over. There's no two ways about it. You could either buy a pedestal or Mike could pour you a nice concrete one like Larsi has. Or you could just keep your knees in use like I do and deal with it. I recognize you've got a few years on me...

Hi MamaP

Hope you are well after all the troubles with appliences over recent times.

I think also Alex makes a good point, no more souppots, we all are not getting any younger and if I needed to do so to get hot washes, I would go mad......

As for a really good frontloader I as many other are voteing for Miele.

I think that E-lux makes great machines but as the company I am employed at put one in at a location we took care of the cleaing, it ran 2-4 times a day and after 1,5 the bearings started to go and at 2 in needed to be skiped.

Make notes of how many washes you do a month, after that tell us the number and we should se how good of quality washer you need. I did this test a few years ago and I went on for a years and the numbers were high, i think i came up to 700 washes there about.

As for a pedistal, here in Sweden you can buy pedistals for washer and dryers everywere as our machines are the same size mostly and those are not as expensive as I read yours are for your big washers.

My Whirlpool Duet has a pre-soak cycle, an on-board water heater, steam (210F right?), allergan, sanitize, etc. I still maintain that you have to bend one way or another whatever washer type you use. Either you bend at the knees or you hang over the top and mash your boobs. As for the risers - my husband built mine as we didn't use the risers on the last set. I was fine without risers this time but we needed the space underneath to run an extended dryer vent hose and redo the pipes and drainage so we could reach them without moving the washer or dryer. I think that makes one of the biggest changes in TL vs FL - access to the valves and drainage. Directly behind a TL makes it nearly impossible to reach unless you're double-jointed at the elbows and at least 6ft or under 2ft, lol. We still attach a leak sensor, though, just in case. Good luck with your decision.

Which Maytags are we talking about? The Maytag Neptunes with the solid door or the rebadged ones by Samsung with the regular glass door?

I don't think the true Maytag Neptunes got very, very hot - I think 130F was the Boosted Hot wash temp (but I will have to look that up). The Samsung-sourced units had a Sani cycle, but, from what I've read, were more problematic than the original Neptunes (once their bugs were worked out).

Mama....So many good points. I like what Dadoes said! You DO NOT need a soak option with a front loader. The time the clothes are saturated with water and detergent is MUCH longer than a top loader. And most front loaders allow you to extend the wash time, so you are essentially getting a wash & soak in one shot!

The Miele W3037 has Water Plus that can be activated (deep rinses that you will love), it will go up to 150/160F which is more than needed (140F is my fav hot temp) and you can just plug it right in. No special electrical needed.

I had this size washer, as do several on the board (enduring, Roc, anoop....) and I have washed king sized blankets repeatedly, CA King sheet sets and thick Queen blankets....PERFECT.

I know the Miele is perfect for you!! And I'm sure Miele Pittsburg has authorized Miele service. They come to you!!

The "Euro/compact" new Electrolux unit might also work really well for you, and it is very, very reasonably priced. Also, I know many friends who have and love their Whirlpool Duet front loader!

This is the front panel of my Whirlpool Duet washer. Lots of cycles; lots of choices. It's all cold-water rinse and the washer determines the size of the load and length of cycle. That last 1 minute may last 5 minutes until it's absolutely sure the water has fully drained out. FanFresh runs air through the load after it finishes spinning to loosen the clothes off the drum. Really great for jeans and towels that tend to plaster themselves in there.

Aha! See there? Presoak option with three time choices!

Thank all of you...Larsi my dear kiddo...I will be getting a FL'er...oh lordy I said it..but it won't be a Miele LOL..I think that model is 2 thous. A thous. Out of my budget...haha. I'm taking my time though and want to make the right choice which you all have been giving me....I do have reservations about the Elux after reading its the skimpiest on water.

Moroseaz, what temp does yours go to and is it only on sanitize cycle that you get heat or can you get the heat on other cycles?

When I do make a choice it will be for a FL only...if sometime in the future I find I can't live without a top loader that's when I'll buy a small portable...but I firmly believe that with the learning curve involved...I can not have something else here to fall back on...I have to get on the bike and peddle. I wish Jean was also here, she would be cracking the funniest jokes about this.

Well, looks like I made a huge decision..to give up a TL as a daily driver and find myself a FL. besides my electricity and wa ter costs ought to drop. I have a electric hot water heater, I can't tell you how many times a day I drain it..raising my monthly bill...HIGH.

Also I don't have to have 200F water, it would have been great, but even 140--150--160 will work. I can boil my vintage linen on the stove..that's not the same as lifting and carrying it. Lol.

Thanks guys...my minds made up ..a FL with a heater.

moroseaz, is it smart enough to start a presoak with a few minutes of regular speed tumbling so as to get everything wet?

I really liked my Electrolux front loader. It had an added water option and I felt that it washed with plenty of water. It also had a recirculating spray that periodically would spray the clothes. Rinsing is where I think it was lacking and I am not even sure if it went into a spin between rinses??? The mind is the first to go. Larsi is sure making the Miele 120V sound great. I think I should have looked at that before buying the speed queen. At a previous residence I had the Miele 4048 it was their larger front loader and although I had no complaints on performance the spins were horrific. At times I thought there was a helicopter landing nearby. I don't know if they have improved that but I couldn't get over it. Thank goodness it was in the basement. That would prevent me from buying another Miele unless I was sure it had smoother spins. The one I had didn't waste any time trying to balance itself and never didn't spin and always reached the designated speed but I thought the house was going to come apart. :)

MamaP...Did you see the pics of the Whirlpool Duet Front loader....Selectable Pre-Soak times?? :)

I did Larsi snd I like that. I'm having problems making heads or tails out of all these suggestions...remember I know nothing about FL 'ers..completely foreign to me...for instance does steam mean it has an on board heater? Lol

If a front loader has a steam option, then yes....It has an onboard heater. But like with USA Miele units....we have no steam, but an onboard heater :)

Yes, steam means an on board heater that will work with other cycles besides the allergen and sanitary cycles. That timed soak is neat, my LG has a predetermined cold 30 minute soak, not particularly useful. Water level is another thing you will need to be sure of. You can't add very much extra water to the FL because of the sensor. Same is true of the temperature control. If you add the extra hot water, mine does an automatic drain when the sensor is tripped. 2 quarts maximum in my LG.

Larsi is right: the following words almost always give an indication of onboard heat in a FL: Steam, Sanitize, Allergen. I believe there was once an HE TL that had an Allergen cycle without onboard heat, relying on tap hot, but I don't know how it would have been certified to hit the 131F needed. ABT.com and AjMadison.com both provide nice tools for comparing models side by side, as well. One of the line items is usually "Onboard Heater?" with a checkmark.

Who is the best service provider in your area? Whirlpool/Maytag maybe? We know not the SQ dealer.

There's an HE TL with a "Sanitize with Oxi" cycle. In other words, lower temperature along with chemical sanitization. Kind of like the Little Giant having both thermal and chemothermal disinfection programs. Best to verify that the sanitize cycle on a specific machine actually gets to a high temperature, if that's what you want.

Poppy, I ha ve no idea the best service provider in my area..but I won't buy without knowing that.

Thsnks Larsi and Alex...this sure is difficult. ..I feel lost in a bunch of washer choices and its very confusing...I need to make sure I pick one thst I can choose a heated cycle of my choice and not just sanitize cycle..since lets say I want to wash whites on the whites cycle but I want hotter than my tap...lol. so much to learn.

Washing machine I bought

It's a hard decision to make! I went with a Maytag front loader. There's a rebate on and sales. Good reviews.

Good luck finding a new machine!

Yes, it's very confusing MamaP. And the manuals do not help. Unfortunately, the most precise English-language manual I know for any modern machine is the guide developed by Roc for the w30xx series. Nothing comes with that level of detail, though it should be standard IMO.

Currently this is what I want..LOL..LOL

on board heater

Would like option for extra water but that is probably a dream lol

To be able to get from 140 /160 temps on the cycle I choose.

Soak cycle is nice...but if it offers a nice long hot wash time I could bypass the soak.

Size I'd confusing also..what size do I want ..I know I don't

want huge. Moroseaz does your machine offer these things? And whatsize is yours?

Oh what fun - we get to help Mamapinky pick her next washer!

I really like my LG FL washer. 3+ years of flawless operation. And relatively inexpensive (I went with the smallest size option they had with a heater). My other choice at the time was Fridgidaire but no stores in my area had it in stock and I wouldn't buy a washer without seeing it in person first.

My washer has a steam option but I don't really use it. If I want a hot wash, I use Sanitary or Allergen cycle. I think Steam is really not needed at all. Any washer that offers a Sanitary cycle has a heater. Another feature that was important to me is a true Wool cycle. My washer doesn't have a Water Plus option but it has "Turbo Wash" which engages spray nozzles and uses more water than a standard cycle. Oh, and one other feature that I love is a magnet on the door that keeps the door cracked open when not in use.

Do you have a local facebook or Yahoo group? That's how I found our wonderful repair man. He only repairs American brands, like Whirlpool, Maytag, and Kitchen Aid, and since he is so good, and fair, that is a big influence on my decisions. I remember when it used to be easier to choose appliances.

Allergen is a great target temp to have. I wished I'd had that on my Samsung, at the time. Sanitize was just too hot for the normal hot wash but 131F is a great temp for whites and sheets. Miele and Electrolux have whites cycles that hit 140F I believe. Also a very prime temp to have.

@Alex, I think the Elux Allergen target temp. is 130F.

I can't find the exact temp. in the manual but for some reason I believe it's 130F.

I can't say I want a machine that only heats to 130 I have hot tap at 136..lol.

Mama...The Allergen temp. is 130F and the Sanitize cycle is around 150F.

Hot is tap hot. My hot water mixing valve is set for 125F and the machine doesn't mix any cold water with that. It's pure hot tap. The machine might adjust and add cold water (ATC) if the incoming hot water is excessively hot but I haven't tried that.

mamapinky, in my LG washer you can get up to 155F on Sanitary or Allergienne cycles.

Thank you..I'll check in later..on my way to Pittsburgh with Amiee..grrr

My guess is that on moroseaz's machine, the heater is active on Sanitize (of course), Allergen, and Heavy Duty ... and on any cycle that allows Steam Clean to be selected.

The target temperature on Heavy Duty is probably varied per the selected soil level ... higher level = higher temperature (due to longer wash time for the heater to operate).

Steam Clean (or a similar Stain Treat option) may perform a profile wash ... starting with a cool or warm fill and raising the temp as the wash progresses.

136°F household water supply, of course, doesn't mean that's what you'll get in the machine without onboard heating. Frontloaders, of course, take in a lower volume of water than toploaders and thermal energy from the water is "lost" to the mass of the clothes, drum and tub ... thus the reason why onboard water heating is pretty much a requirement.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: A frontloader with water heating is absolutely, positively, unequivocally, without question what I would choose if I had need to buy a new washer.

I don't know what temperature the water fill comes in as. Apparently, my particular washer has been discontinued but looks like the newer model is WFW92HEFW.

Configuration and Overview of the WFW95HEDU ( might find discontinued models on sale)

Capacity

4.50

ADA Compliant

ADA Height and Side and Front Reach Compliant

CEE Tier Rating

Tier II

Energy Star® Qualified

ENERGY STAR® Qualified

UL

Yes

Energy Factor

3.20

Water Factor

3.00

Cycle and Options

Number of Wash Cycles

12

Washer Cycle Selections

Allergen, Clean Washer, Cold Wash, Delicates, Drain & Spin, Heavy Duty, Normal, Quick Wash, Sanitize, Towels, Wash & Dry, Whites

Pre Soak

20 minutes, 40 minutes, 60 minutes

Option Selections

Control Lock, Delay Wash, EcoBoost™, End of Cycle Signal, Extra Rinse, Fan Fresh®, Presoak, Steam Clean

Number of Soil Levels

4

Soil Selections

Extra Heavy, Heavy, Light, Normal

Spin Speeds

5

Spin Speed Selections

Extra Fast, Fast, Medium, Off, Slow

Temperature Selections

Cold, Cool, Hot, Warm

Controls

Display Type

Cycle Indicator Lights with Digital Time Remaining

LED Color

Blue

Feedback-Status Indicators

Add Garment, Clean Washer Reminder, Delay Wash, Done (Clothes Clean), Door Locked, Eco Monitor, Estimated Time Remaining, Fan Fresh®, Sensing, Steaming

Drum Material

Stainless Steel

Hoses Included

No

Motor Drive Type

Direct Drive

Pedestal Options

Yes

Stackable

Yes

Out of Balance Sensing

Yes

Suspension System

2 Springs 4 Dampers

The new model shows a new temperature called 'extra hot' and loses the Allergen cycle. Look at that 8hr pre-soak, though, lol. There's also an option for water hardness. Biggest change seems to be that bulk detergent dispenser. Don't know if that's optional or removable.

Details on the WFW92:Configuration And Overview

Capacity

4.50

ADA Compliant

ADA Height and Side and Front Reach Compliant

CEE Tier Rating

Tier III (Highest Possible Efficiency Rating)

Cycle And Options

Number of Wash Cycles

12

Washer Cycle Selections

Clean Washer with affresh, Cold Wash, Color Last, Delicates, Drain & Spin, Heavy Duty, Normal, Quick Wash, Sanitize, Towels, Wash & Dry, Whites

Pre Soak

30 minutes, 60 minutes, 8 hour

Option Selections

Control Lock, Delay Wash, Detergent Concentration, Drum Light, EcoBoost™, End of Cycle Signal, Extra Rinse, Fan Fresh®, Presoak, Steam Clean, Water Hardness

Number of Soil Levels

4

Soil Selections

Extra Heavy, Heavy, Light, Normal

Spin Speeds

5

Spin Speed Selections

Extra Fast, Fast, Medium, Off, Slow

Temperature Selections

Cold, Cool, Extra Hot, Hot, Warm

Controls

Display Type

Cycle Indicator Lights with Digital Time Remaining

LED Color

Blue

Feedback-Status Indicators

Add Garment, Clean Washer Reminder, Delay Wash, Detergent Level, Dispensing, Done, Door Locked, Estimated Time Remaining, Fan Fresh®, Load&Go™, Sensing, Steaming

Drum Material

Stainless Steel

Hoses Included

No

Motor Drive Type

Direct Drive

Out of Balance Sensing

Yes

Sound Package

No

Suspension System

2 Springs 4 Dampers

There are over 1000 review on the 95HE's, almost all at excellent or great. The 92HE's seem to be so new that there are no, or very few, reviews. Seems to me you may find the 95s still available at some great sale prices. You will definitely pay more up front for a FL but you'll see a huge amount of savings in the long run; water, electric and additives. I don't mind the longer cycles and I believe my clothes are cleaner because of the them. My washer is now 9 months old and only needed it's second Clean with Affresh cycle yesterday. Considering how much fur I've pulled out of there, I'm shocked it doesn't choke and ask for a garbage disposal. I also wanted all you folks who don't believe I use a hot-water cycle to note that the pictures attest to me using that cycle, lol. If you do decide to look closer at the 92's, it looks like you'd be very happy with that extra hot option and the long presoaks. All of these machines have a 4.5 capacity - plenty big enough for king-size blankets but a little small for over-size king comforters. I know you use queen-size so probably big enough for your comforters and bedspreads.

Capacity for family of 4-5 suggested as 4.0-4.5 cu ft drum. Most of the FLs I've seen have the "normal" cycle with the least amount of water, something for heavy duty, whites. delicate, bulky, sanitary, short express wash cycle and clean washer. Depending on the brand there will be some extra programed cycles that duplicate the others. On my LG, there's kids wear =sanitary cycle, rugged wear = extended heavy duty, workout wear = delicate with extended tumble, cold wash = useless, comforter =bulky with more water choices. I can have up to 5 extra rinses. This option is useful. Spin speed can be adjusted by cycle. There is a turbo/acela option to speed up cycle time on some cycles. Steam (heater engaged) works on normal, heavy duty, whites, comforter, sanitary and the duplicated heavy duty cycles. All rinses are cold only. Cycle times depend on the soil level selected. I use bulky and comforter cycles most often (most water). No extra rinses = 56 minutes. Steam = 2 hours. These times increase if you add extra rinses. Rinse cycle = 15 minutes. Because I have soft water, I use minimal detergent. Powder = scant Tbl. Liquid 2 tsp per load.

I picked the LG because the filter is easily accessible on the front. Not true for the whirlpool/maytags available at the time. No elux for me because no local service.

As there are lemons in every product line, there are no perfect machines. We all have to compromise on something. Good luck in your hunt.

Dadoes, what brand front loader would you choose for yourself? Whirlpool?