They will still be around, and if well made and well designed, still look good. They've been going strong for 150+ years so far. As to style, no, of course not. The industry requires at least a new style every decade to keep people replacing perfectly functional kitchens. In 20 years we should be ready to cycle back to arch top golden oak cabinets.

I hope I'm around and still in style in 20 years. Can't worry about the cabinets!

Nel, I hope I'm around and still in style in 20 years. Can't worry about the cabinets!. Very tru and too funny (:

sophie appreciate your wisdom I am trying very hard to remain authentic in this build. Can you give examples of cabinet styles for French country homes?

They are a classic, plain, inoffensive cabinet door style in general. They are plain enough to fit in with a bunch of things. But they aren't timeless, and technically they probably work best in a traditional house with other simple details throughout.

As Sophie says, it's the combination of things and what they look like in the context of those things and the rest of the house that will tell the timeline of something.

I think it is the use of Alder which will date the kitchen first, not the door style. Alder is a rustic wood and as such I think it's use in cabinetry used to more limited to rustic type houses and it's only been recently that alder cabinets have shown up in otherwise fairly traditional (non-rustic) interiors.

A rustic looking kitchen in a suburban house may be popular right now, but it won't always be. That's the thing that will go out of fashion. That doesn't mean you shouldn't use it if you like it. But I wouldn't worry about 20 years from now.

I just put in white shaker cabinets in my 1949 house. I did a white backsplash (but not subway) and soapstone instead of a white countertop with one area of butcher block. Floors are wood and match the rest of the house. Mixed metals for hardware and lighting that matches the rest of the house. I hope it will date/age less but that may be wishful thinking!

First examine the actual architecture of the home. Is it a genuine French country home? Or is it just a modern box+box+box with hip roofs and some arched windows that the builder threw that “French” label on because it sounded good?

For timeless French, Painted raised panel doors. Curves. All of the things that are not popular and are actually decidedly uncool right now. Not the formality of French Provincial. Simpler. But with the same roots.

Here’s a time capsule. Without the blue outlining, it’s basic form would be timeless for a genuine French country home. It’s a closed kitchen it’s not over the top formal. It’s painted white. It has curves. It has a decent layout, and doesn’t require roller skates. It’s not a kitchen that wandered into your living room. It’s a workroom first, that happens to show a bit of style.

The 70’s Mediterranean look owes a debt to French Country. Curves. Stained wood. Warmer color palette rather than cold.

French Country done in a non Disney manner needs the architecture to support it. Because it’s about light, and volumes, and the space itself. Not the decor that fills it.

It AIN’T this.

That is Disney.

True French Provincial panel details would be something like this, but a square or arched, raised panel door would do as well.

The midcentury American version of French Provincial was this, which has its charm

Sophie and pal Thank you for the pics, helps a lot. I don’t like painted cabinets, and since rustic alder won’t work, what about cherry cabinets.

And for something Genuinely French Country, here is Julia Child’s French vacation cottage. All about Function. See the section of the sink in stainless with integral drain board. And plenty of stained wood used. Note the Fabulous terra cotta floors. And a Genuine Structural beam. Not fake.

Cherry, Maple, Oak, Birch, are all fairly enduring woods for cabinetry. Raised panel in Cherry or rift sawn Oak if you wanted to stay away from heavy graining would be nice, and I think Oak is pretty common for French furnishings

Cerused oak would be a nice touch. Gives you the grain of wood, but more lightness. And it is classically French. The limed oak paneling was a method of fly control from an age where indoor plumbing and bathing were virtually unknown.

I think Shaker looks best when painted. And painted cabinets can always be repainted. To me, cherry cabinets look very dated, but I must admit that in my town, the two top sellers of high end kitchen cabinets are cherry and antiqued cream. But then, WC Fields said that when he died he hoped he was in KY. When asked why, he said it was because KY was 20 years behind the time!

Sophie..OMG, I don’t think I could handle Julia's Kitchen the pots/pans all over the walls would drive me batty! Lol Thank you so much for the pics and ideas

Pal thank you for the ideas!

They've been going strong for 150+ years so far.

I think it's more truthful to say that they've existed for 150+ years ... were eclipsed by other styles for decades ... and now have their season in the sun again.

The industry requires at least a new style every decade to keep people
replacing perfectly functional kitchens. In 20 years we should be ready
to cycle back to arch top golden oak cabinets.

Totally agree.

As Sophie says, it's the combination of things and what they look like
in the context of those things and the rest of the house that will tell
the timeline of something.

Again, totally agree. The problem, of course, is that so many people live in houses that don't have a definable "style"; thus, no context /no timeline hint exists. In that case, the right answer is consistency throughout the house.

Sophie..OMG, I don’t think I could handle Julia's Kitchen the pots/pans
all over the walls would drive me batty! Lol Thank you so much for
the pics and ideas

I know everyone's supposed to love Julia Child's kitchen, but I also find it clutter-y.

It IS “cluttery” in the context of the modern demand that kitchen be formal reception area for your book club. In the context of a food production room, everything needed is right at hand. It’s functional first. Decorative is only incidental. All is subservient to producing the meal.

It IS “cluttery” in the context of the modern demand

It is cluttery because everything's out in the open /visible. Opening a cabinet to remove a saucepan isn't disfunctional.

We may be straying OT, but re French Provincial, I lived about 5 miles outside of Grenoble as a teenager, and I am pretty old now, so it was many decades ago. In those days, that area was really sleepy, and only was busy during Dec-Feb for skiing. The kitchens in actual French provincial homes I saw then had unfitted cabinetry, no upper cabinets, but open shelving on the walls. That was where the pots and pans went, on the shelving. Utensils were in drawers or in a crock. I am struggling to remember what the sinks were like, but I know they were large and single-bowl, but can't remember the material. Counters were wood, that were scarred and a bit permanently sticky. A kitchen would have one square of thick marble that was also scarred and stained. No one would consider an entire counter of marble due to the expense. No one gave a thought to the kitchen's appearance or aesthetic. It cracks me up when I see what people think is a French provinical kitchen. The fine cabinetry pictured in Palimpsest's post above just didn't exist in one of these kitchens - it would have been too fine for a kitchen. The food was the best in my life.

M Miller We may be straying OT.. absolutely not, love the discussion, thoughts and ideas. Stray and stray some more.(:

mrs Pete, thank you.

Actual kitchens in Province.

Funny about "form over function" or "function over form". Today, after church, we ran into the FIL of one of DD's closest friends. He also attends pulmonary rehab with me. We stopped to visit and we told him DGS's great news - that he's been accepted to Cornell University's Engineering School for next year. This man went to veterinary school at the U of Penn (one of the three top in the country), and of course, Cornell and Penn are Ivy League rivals. He said at Penn, they cared most about how things looked, and how they worked was secondary; Cornell couldn't care less how they look so long as they work! I think this is highly applicable to kitchens today. I could cook in Julia Child's kitchen in a heart beat. I like my most used pans hung on a pot rack - I don't want to go rummaging in a drawer for a pan. I like the utensils within arm's reach - HATE them in drawers. I would have a very hard time cooking in the kitchens that are today, part of the living room.

I also like to look at homes for sale in France just to see what they look like inside and have seen many kitchens. Most are pretty simple. In some homes the kitchen is empty - perhaps like in some areas of Italy, people take their kitchens with them. I do frequently see stand alone furniture type pieces combined with cabinets.

I do see the arched door frequently, but perhaps this kitchens is 20 years old like my own:)

This one is just a few years old. See more here:

http://thelittlewhitehouseontheseaside.blogspot.com/p/the-kitchen-files.html

What I do see often, though not all the time, are some of the elements I like in this kitchen - a pretty hood - but not ostentatious, plate rails, some open shelving, and color. I don't recall ever seeing a gray and white French kitchen.

I rarely see an island - more often a big table. There is usually more stuff out. The fridges are much smaller. Decor does play some role - just not the rooster on the counter kind. There are often some fabric elements - window treatments, table cloth and and often art or wall decor that has an antique feel - passed down from grandma - that connection with the past that is often lacking in America. I don't recall ever seeing a kitchen with a purposely "themed" decor.

There are also a few with very modern cabinets much like a contemporary American kitchen.

Here is a recent discussion on French Country you might enjoy. The point is made that there is French Country as a reality in France, and what we on this side of the pond call "French Country":

http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/4938310/design-around-this-24-french-country-redux?n=43

As for timelessness, a kitchen that harkens back to the past often seems more timeless and less "dated" because it has gone passed "dated" to vintage charming / cozy.

Jhmarie thank you for the french country link, wonderful

Sophie and M Miller have really hit the nail on the head. As for timeless, most of the kitchen reveals in Houzz will look dated in 20 years or sooner because, as noted, styles have to change to get people to buy all new. I have to laugh when someone questions a white kitchen and the response is "white is timeless". That might be true for the color but not for all the other details that make up the kitchen. Sophie's "Disney" photo is a prime example.

People have been listening to Motzart for 350 years or so and building Shaker cabinets for 200 give or take. Both are timeless.

Thank you all so much. Perhaps the correct question becomes: how to create a timeless kitchen with wood shaker cabinets? I may start another thread

I think the question still requires context. They've been around for 200 years because they were in the buildings of the Shaker sect, and a true shaker door is a raised panel door with the panel turned around to the inside.

They were not a typical door in most kitchens in the 20th century. Recessed panel is not necessarily shaker.

I put shaker doors in a kitchen in 1995 because I lived in a Greek Revival house that had recessed paneling everywhere. (But the recessed panels were sometimes double recesses and most had bolecton moulding around the recess.) I wanted something recessed but simpler to go with the original paneling. There's no such thing as a "correct" kitchen cabinet for a Greek Revival house because they had no such thing. My building had no kitchen until 1965 when it was converted into apartments.

in 1995 not everybody offered true shaker sticking. (which is 90-degree). A number offered a recessed panel with an angled sticking.

Is it a nice simple door that fits in a lot of different settings? Sure. but not so much timeless especially if you live in a house that would have originally had something else.

I lived in a house and summer cottages built between 1925 and 1940, then a tract house built in 1951 that all had what would now be called "Shaker" cabinet doors-- some proper, with the cove on the inside of the panel, others with just a flat plywood panel. I was building them in the 1970's. So I guess I disagree with those who assert they disappeared for some protracted period.

Alder stains well, and paints well ... it's not an inferior wood. Alder stained cherry looks good at a significantly lower price point.

The so-called "shaker" style has been in and out of fashion since the beginning of built-in kitchens. What matters is creating a seamless look with the rest of the house, it's cabinets and it's architectural style.

I would love to have a "Julia Child" type kitchen, but we have too much dust and too many cats. it's like a cooking lab with everything ready to grab and use.

I couldn't deal with the cleaning factor in Julia's kitchen. She spent far more time cooking, than I ever have or would, or anyone else I know for that matter. I would expect a professional chef's kitchen to look entirely different than us "regular" folk. I'm all about function, but her kitchen would not be functional, for me. Could I cook in it? Of course. Would I be happy with it in my own home? Definitely not.

That is Disney. My taste must be in my @ss because I actually could cook in that kitchen fairly happily... though I'd remove the crystal chandelier just because I wouldn't want to clean it. Yes, I find it over the top, but not entirely offensive. I do understand it is someone's 'version' of Country French.

Now, this is Disney:

...and I'm sure someone's idea of a kitchen they could live with : - )

I do like Julia Child's kitchen also, and could happily cook in it, after becoming accustomed to the clutter of it.

DD is in the hospitality business and has hired many Executive Chefs for her properties over the past 16 years. She knows many as friends. Most do very simple cooking at home as they're very tired after long shifts in a restaurant kitchen. Many don't even remodel their kitchen - wouldn't be used enough.

A food columnist or cookbook author is more likely to be someone who cooks all day long, at home, in her/his own kitchen. Their kitchen will have a professional look (not the pseudo "professional" kitchens we see on GW), it may even have some true professional-grade appliances, and it will be used all day, every day.

Finding a balance based on how ONE TRULY COOKS - not some fantasy of how one is GOING to cook with a new kitchen, is key. I certainly don't cook the way I once did, but I was 30 years younger, with a husband and two children to cook for daily. But I do still cook, and I want a well equipped kitchen. I may not use that angel food cake pan but 3 times a year, but I still need it. The popover pans are used 2-3 times a year, but I still need them.

Most people I know who redo their kitchen don't really "cook" - they reheat, heat up, zap or something, but not true cooking. Some of this is due to time - when one gets home from work at 7PM, one is not going to start a dinner that takes a minimum of an hour to fix. Some is due to the fact that the cook in the household (usually the woman, but not always), has never really liked cooking anyway. Knowing oneself is key!!!

I cook enough and bake enough that I wanted an attractive, highly functional kitchen. But at 74, I was not going to put in one that cost $100,000. First of all, I could not afford to do so, and secondly, I don't cook enough to justify that expense. From a resale point of view, it rarely adds value to ones house - people have their own ideas and even a less than 5 yr old kitchen is often gutted when the house is sold.

So, build what YOU like and what works for your cooking style, interior design style, and budget. And be VERY realistic about all three.

2ManyDiversions - that kitchen likely cost a fortune. If someone handed it to me, I, like you, could cook in it fairly happily. But setting aside that it is someone's figment of imagination of what a country French kitchen looks like--and surely that person has never been in an actual French kitchen--setting that aside, the double islands and the glossy reflective black counters would make me nuts LOL.

Yes, that's what I meant by being fairly happy with it - if someone 'gave it to me'... and yes, I agree with you friedajune, I'd much prefer to have countertops that aren't so reflective (or black), no double islands, and the... oh, I could go on about things I don't like in it - many choices I wouldn't make, even if I had the $ for it. BTW, I've never been in an authentic French kitchen, doubt I ever will be.

I bookmarked this kitchen because I though the owner did a lovely refresh with her older cabinets. They are not shaker, but could be, and it is not French Country - more American country, but with a little change in decor and a hood rather than over the range microwave, it could be:

http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/4512247/finally-finished-with-kitchen-updating

I bookmarked this recent kitchen because I thought it had many timeless elements too:

http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/4835814/kitchen-reveal

If I did a new kitchen, I would probably do it with a vintage or craftsman style. The layout to this kitchen is poor, but I like the cabinets and appliances - an example of not being dated because its vintage:

I like this kitchen very much!!! Admittedly, not the best layout either.

I would add a floral roman shade, floral / vintage prints and / or some french china (very inexpensive in out local antique stores) to add some French flair.

I think there is some misapprehension that the average European has a kitchen that is more picturesque and tasteful than the average American and I think if anything Americans have cornered the market on "decorator" kitchens whether or not they function, get used a lot or are in popular taste or good taste. My overall impression of the typical European kitchen is that they are Spartan, function based, have tiny appliances and are often uglier than their American counterpart in the same demographic.

I have read each and every one of your comments, thank you so much. Anglo, your pearls of wisdom are so true. I guess, I am not looking to have a french country kitchen, after all. Rather, I just want one that is warm, inviting and even timeless. Wood, Shaker cabinets and wood floors will the starting point. The wood species will be from trees native to my area such as oak, pine, alder, birch or hickory.

I'm in agreement with some of the comments above that while shaker cabinets have *existed* for hundreds of years, they, like all things, will ebb and flow in their "trendiness". They have been trendy for 20 years, first in the cherry cabinet look of the late 90s early 2000s, and then in white form for the last 10 years.

It is almost impossible to create a kitchen that will not look 20 years old in 20 years (unless you make some changes in 20 years). And i don't think it's a grand conspiracy by the kitchen industry to make us all buy new kitchens. It is human nature for tastes to evolve and change. Women's clothing trends have been changing for all of modern history! Kitchens in 1920 looked very different than in 1940! It's not some recent hgtv conspiracy. Tv and internet and social media may quicken the pace, but it's just human nature.

When people claim they have chosen a "timeless" style, I chuckle. It usually means they have chosen something they like that is already dated (usually a trend from 10-20 years ago, maybe from when the person owned their first home). So yes, it's not a current trend; it's just an old trend that makes their kitchen dated from the onset. These people like to think they are above trends. Or they've chosen a current trend that has existed for years, but is having a big time revival (like shaker, subway tiles, etc). But consumers are inevitably going to tire of these styles, and while they will still *exist* in the future, they are going to be a big marker of a 2000-teens kitchen -- thus dating kitchens in the future. I like subway tiles; but i'm totally aware that in 20 years all these subway tile kitchens are going to feel 20 years old.

I am of the mindset that white cabinets in general can help avoid a dated kitchen. White cabinets of various styles have been popular in some form forever. The white 80s kitchen looked different than a current kitchen. But it is relatively easy to swap out the countertop and hardware and backsplash for $5000 and make a 20 year old kitchen look brand new (assume appliances have been updated over time as they have died). I've seen this done successfully several times. Updates to non-white kitchens often do not update well. The updates can look like lipstick on a pig. The exception is if the non-white kitchen has cycled back in style. Think the midcentury slab styles from 1950 can be nicely updated today for a modern looking kitchen. But those same cabinets could never have helped you in 1980.

So what do you do? Pick something not insanely trendy, and particularly not on the waning end of a trend. Go neutral - with colors, backsplash, countertop etc. And be willing to update things periodically. New light fixtures in 10 years, new hardware in 15, new backsplash in 15, new paint color in 12.

Or, just pick something you really like and live with it for 10, 30, or 50 years, changing things as you like, as life goes along. I can spend a month in Italy every winter for the next 10 years for the cost of a major kitchen renovation. Neither will have much "resale value" in a decade, but I'm clear about which will make me happier! (and yes, at other times, with other kitchens, the decision was to refurbish the kitchen)

One of the best decisions I've ever made re my kitchen, was to replace the hideous laminate countertops that were there when we bought this house, and to use Glacier White Corian. We did not replace the ugly cabinets - we painted them, and since they were quite plain, it worked. We actually had more cabinets made to match them to give me more counter space.

But those Glacier White Corian countertops have proved to be perfect AND "timeless"! When we did the fixed up the kitchen after buying the house, we painted the cabinets a color called "Scarab Green" - it matched the green in the fabulous Brunschwig & Fils french documentary wallpaper I used, called "Fraises des Bois". The white countertops made it "work". About 15 years ago, DD told me my kitchen looked dated and I needed to update it. She was right - those green cabinets screamed 1980's, but I did love that wallpaper. Tore my heart out when it came down! But I moved forward. I painted the cabinets a light, warm taupe, used a Farrow & Ball wallpaper for the backsplash and walls, called "Polka Squares". At that time, we also redid the lighting in the kitchen and put in wood floors, bought a new stainless dishwasher (Scarab Green sprayed refrigerator had died and was replaced by a white one), a new stainless hood (goodbye Scarab Green painted hood!) and an integrated Corian sink and a new faucet. But those Glacier White Corian countertops looked terrific with the new color scheme and were in outstanding condition.

Fast forward to last year. I had already gotten a new stainless steel Vent-a-Hood and a counter depth stainless refrigerator, and I was finally ready for new cabinets. At my age, drawers are a HUGE help for me, and I wanted drawers. I'm very much attracted to white kitchens, but since my kitchen faces due west and the back wall is taken up mostly by a huge bay window, it would have been very glarey and also just not quite right with the hall and the DR. While not an "open concept" kitchen, one does still need to look at the rooms that abut it!

So, this time I chose Repose Gray and Shaker cabinets. I painted the walls 1/2 strength Repose Gray had them leave out the magenta (appears in bright light). I also painted the woodwork a bright white, going against having all my woodwork in the house the same color. It's fine - remember, no "open concept". I removed the old 4" Corian backsplash, and put white Carrera marble large subway tile behind the cabinets and behind the stove etc.

But guess what stayed and was re-used? My Glacier White Corian countertops and integrated sink! It's still in perfect condition! And it's truly a timeless classic. It may not be the "hottest trend", but I can tell you that in the UK, Corian (almost always Glacier White) is used in the highest end homes, in particular in highly contemporary ones - it is considered a "luxury" surface there.

Glacier White Corian is like a white dress shirt for a man or a great white blouse for a woman. It ALWAYS looks good, and goes with everything. Like the above, it can be bleached if a horrid stain occurs, and since it is a solid surface, it is very easy to keep clean. Yes, it does scratch, but all those scratches are light surface ones, like the scratches that appear on ones sterling flatware over years of use - it's called "patina", not scratches, as it is not something one must simply accept (as one learns to do with etching and stains on marble) - it actually enriches the appearance of the surface.

I think painted cabinets are far less likely to look dated than stained wood ones are. We've had cherry, golden oak, and now are using rustic alder etc. They date a kitchen as accurately as an Avocado Green or Harvest Gold refrigerator!

Other "timeless" features are true site-finished hardwood floors throughout the house, stained in a medium warm color. There have always been floors like this and there always will be. Bleached woods, hand scraped wood - all these are trends that will date a house.

Good windows are also timeless. Replacing the pair of double-hung windows with a huge bay was a very good move on our part. It brought the back garden into the room, made the small room (11x15) feel longer, and gives me a place above my sink for plants. My white orchids LOVE it there - great light, and all that humidity/steam when I run the hot water (I do let it run to give them this steam and humidity, while the dog eats, before washing her dish).

As lighting looks change, one can easily change fixtures as well. Undercounter lighting is going nowhere - we must see to cook. Pulls can be changed for a newer look if that's what one wants. I don't see stainless going anywhere as it makes our huge appliances appear, well..not quite so huge. And it's neutral.

My advice to anyone doing a kitchen is to stick with good bones. Make the more permanently affixed things more classic. They are not only expensive to replace, they are disruptive and destructive to the house and just a PITA in general. There are a ton of granite countertops out there today that instantly date a kitchen; in 5 years, there will be a ton of quartz ones that do the same. Most people do not like the look of "aged and used" marble and it's going to be coming out. Mosaic tiles for a backsplash? That was a trend that didn't last 5 years! Screams "dated". Subway tile may not yell "I'm hip and trendy" anymore, but it also won't scream that one is dated.

H&M is the place to satisfy ones hip and trendy wants and desires. Just don't do it in a kitchen that takes forever to rip out and replace, and will cost one a fortune.

And don't let anyone tell you that Corian is "dated". Some patterns certainly are, but if one sticks to Glacier White, it will still look good 5 owners after you.

Shaker cabinets are timeless in a sense that they are universal enough to work well in different kitchen design combinations. Elegant and stylish, they work best in traditional kitchens but their style is simple at the same time, so they also complement contemporary designs.