If you eliminate your powder room, then company has to either go upstairs or use the master bath. Maybe you could push your kitchen forward a bit into the side porch and push the laundry and existing powder room back a bit into the back porch and squeeze a pantry in between the kitchen and powder room.

I've really struggled with the whole "powder room" issue. I've never lived in a house with one, but recognize not everyone might be able to climb the stairs to use the restroom. So taking in a bit of the back porch to have both would be workable.

Where will guests go to the bathroom if you eliminate the powder room? Are you sure you want them having to go upstairs or through your bedroom?

There are 4 doors in the master bedroom. Do you intend to have a dresser or hang a TV in the room? If so where? The WIC cuts the wall in half.

I would highly suggest posting your kitchen in the kitchen forum as the island as it is now creates a barrier. Plus at 7'6" deep there is not enough room for an island.

7'6" = 90".

Perimeter counters take up 25.5" (24" cabinets plus counter overhang) leaving you with 64.5" of width.

The minimum for a one person kitchen (meaning only one person working in the kitchen at a time) is 42". If two people share cooking duties, then you ideally need 48" of working aisle space. Assuming it's only 42", that now leaves you only 22.5" for an island. A typical cabinet is 24" without overhang.

Normally you could squeeze space into the living/dining room, but that space is not that large either. Workable as it is, but certainly not large enough to have part of the island jutting into the space.

The living room width is listed as 17'1" but it really isn't. Because of the doors to the patio and the entry door into the house, you need to take away 6' of that for pathways, so the actual usable width is 11'1". And in reality, with the front door situated the way it is, it's actually 10'1" for your living room space.

The dining room is only large enough to accommodate a small dining table and maybe 6 diners.

I agree about taking some of the back porch to make the mudroom/utility room more workable. As is, it will be tight.

Some other comments is since this is for empty nesters, be sure there is room to maneuver if you ever need a walker or a wheelchair. Yes a walker is more likely than a wheelchair, but one never knows.

Random thoughts:

I agree that you need a powder room somewhere downstairs -- this plan doesn't allow for an easy door into the master, so people would have to go through the bedroom.

There are 4 doors in the master bedroom. Do you intend to have a dresser or hang a TV in the room? If so where? The WIC cuts the wall in half.

Hmmm ... The bed can only go in one spot, as shown below. I like a bedroom that keeps all the doors towards the foot of the bed (meaning no one has to walk past a sleeper to reach the bathroom or the closet). If the closet were larger, I'd say, "No problem -- keep 100% of your clothing in the closet." But this is a small closet. I'd investigate taking in ALL the back porch for a larger closet and a powder room.

I think the kitchen's fine. Lots of natural light, good access to the table.

Two things I don't like here:

First, the house is "front oriented", meaning all your public spaces are located at the front of the house. A lot of people want their living areas oriented towards the backyard so they can watch kids playing outside or be located close to the grill.

Second, you say you're empty nesters ... so the two bedrooms upstairs are for guests, not for everyday use ... yet the upstairs bedrooms are huge! 13x17 (plus the two upstairs rooms share the gallery, which could be a nice spot for grandchildren's books and toys), while the master bedroom downstairs is 13x15 ... and the living /dining room is 17x 22. Put simply, you're allocating a huge amount of your space to guest rooms. Seems a little off to me ... looks like you're treating your guests like royalty, while you're skimping on everyday space.

I like the connection to the screen porch.

The master bath looks like it'd be good for an aging couple, though that vanity looks minimal to support two sinks ... which brings up the question, where's your storage space in this bathroom?

Cpartist, I really found your comments on the January post very interesting. Have you had a chance to take a look at the home tour link? I'd be interested in your thoughts. It seems like all of the space is well used, and we are being a little selfish in that I am not really planning for what "company" may need. Honestly, it will likely be mostly grandkids visiting anyway. It seems odd to be thinking in terms of walkers, ect but we really do want this to be our last home. I've made myself a list with items like wider doors and additional blocking where grab bars may need to be installed. That said, I am considering doing the owner / builder thing. We've had the property for some time and have a very livable 560 sq ft cabin we completely restored. I would love to find the build somewhere close to visit. Virtual tours are great but I'd like to get a real feel for it. I so appreciate your suggestions. I'm busy making lists of adjustments, ect.

Mrs. Pete

Thank you for your insight. I am considering removing the window adjacent to the master bath wall and possibly placing the bed there so it faces the doorway. As I said above, I love the house in the virtual tour but I just don't know how livable it really is. As to public areas, the screened in porch area will "face the yard and creek" so that is where we will spend the majority of our time. I am considering extending that porch all the way down the side of the house. Again, I appreciate the thoughts.

Cpartisit, I will definitely post in the kitchen sections for additional suggestions. Again, thank you so much for your thoughts and please feel free to keep them coming.

For an empty nesters "last home" this design seems small on the first floor and large on the second floor. I'd look for a design with two bedrooms on the first floor and whatever you may need on the second floor. Does snoring mean anything in your life?

Agree with everyone about the necessity of a powder room.

Also, I dont understand the kitchen island. Do you have the island dimensions? If the kitchen is 7.5’, the counters 2’, the walkway 3.5’, then you only have 2 feet of width for the island. I personally would prefer a 4’ Aisle. If someone sits at the island, they will be basically sitting in the hallway/walkway.

This house seems to get built a lot. Here is a round-up of them, with links to a couple more at the bottom of the post.

I think the kitchen seems better in the version without the island. Otherwise, its insufferably tight, and will be unnavigable with any sort of walker or wheelchair.

ETA: This version is a little larger at 2.3K sq ft, and it seems to work somewhat better, especially the kitchen.

There is also [another thread[(https://www.houzz.com/discussions/thoughts-on-my-plans-dsvw-vd~3648652) here on Houzz, on this same plan. Now, in that case, the potential builders were a young family, so different issues applied. But CP and others provided some other ideas that you might want to consider.

Cpartist, I really found your comments on the January post very interesting. Have you had a chance to take a look at the home tour link?

No but I will do so just to make sure I'm seeing it the way you are. However I tend to be able to transfer in my mind 2d space to 3d space and virtually walk through a space in my mind. I learned it from my mother.

I know, I could tell from the January thread so I'm very interested in your insights. I've bounced between this plan and the 4 Gables by Mitch Glenn. I've been through that thread as well, but I almost feel like it is too much house. I don't see using the upstairs bedrooms often at all. I plan to go through your kitchen comments tomorrow and really put pen to paper.

Holly, thanks so much for your comments. I've been through the previous thread and the york blog as well as the link with the 5 versions. I just can't seem to find one in my area to tour. At any rate, I couldn't find a direct link to the 2,300 sq ft version unless they are including the porches in the Kentucky version. I definitely can do without the "island" but I like the butcher's block idea on this blog: york I'm a one girl show in the kitchen, so a ton of space isn't needed. But, I plan on being there forever, so I want to make sure it is accessible as we age.

Ok I just looked and if you look at the photos carefully, you'll see that the aisles are quite tight which is fine for a young family with one or two children, but again as a couple aging in place, you really need to consider your aisle widths. Ideally all aisles should be no less than 42" (says the woman who didn't catch until too late that the hallway aisle leading to her master bedroom is only 38" wide. Sigh)

I also agree with Mrs Pete's comment about the upstairs space being better and also about how the house is front oriented.

May I ask where you're planning on building and how the house will be sited on your property?

we are being a little selfish in that I am not really planning for what "company" may need. Honestly, it will likely be mostly grandkids visiting anyway.

Yes but if you do have company, you don't want them having to share your bathroom. Or maybe you don't care?

And do you feel that you'll have enough room for the grandkids downstairs? How about when they get to the teen years and are bigger?

I've made myself a list with items like wider doors and additional blocking where grab bars may need to be installed.

Smart. BTW: I added a hand held in the shower and put it on a grab bar slide bar.

Also consider a curbless shower. My Mom had Parkinson's and that small curb into the shower might as well have been Mt Everest for her.

Realize that for wheelchair access, any room will need a way in and out or a minimum of a 60" turning radius.

That said, I am considering doing the owner / builder thing.

We didn't do the owner/builder thing and I can tell you that even not having that, there are 100's if not 1000's of decisions that have to be made daily. I have basically put my drawing on hold for the past 2 years. It's daily decisions. I would definitely think long and hard about it, especially if you've never done it.

I know, I could tell from the January thread so I'm very interested in your insights. I've bounced between this plan and the 4 Gables by Mitch Glenn. I've been through that thread as well, but I almost feel like it is too much house. I don't see using the upstairs bedrooms often at all. I plan to go through your kitchen comments tomorrow and really put pen to paper.

Have you considered working with an architect to design a house that is compact but gives you the space exactly where you need it? Maybe a bit more space downstairs and smaller space upstairs.

Also if you're definitely building a 2 story, I think you should consider adding a closet on both floors that can be converted to a future elevator if needed.

Do you have a monkey to clean behind the master bathroom's freestanding tub in an alcove?

Here is a pic of the blogger's kitchen. I think if you try to open the oven door, you will have very little room to stand between the open door and the island. To me, it appears very tight.

I'm currently building my empty-nester/retirement/last home I ever plan to live in and I made our master bedroom 17 x 15. The reason being is during the last few years of my mother's life, she pretty much lived in her bedroom because she had a hard time getting around. She had a large master and it gave her room to create a nice sitting area with a couch and a big TV in addition to a complete set of bedroom furniture. She was very comfortable and didn't feel cramped. Just something to think about.

Lastly, we are owner/builder and it has become a full-time job for 2 people. Like Cpartist said, it's unbelievable the amount of decisions that need to be made, even with a very detailed set of plans. We both have extensive construction experience and we still have had numerous delays and problems. Right now we are installing all the finishes ourselves just to get the house done and because I'm sick to death of dealing with incompetent subs. Today is the first day we've taken off in over 3 weeks. Something else to think about :-)

If you look at the photos of the house that was 2300 sq ft, you can just tell that the space is larger. Look how much more spacious the kitchen is.

The original plan:

The expanded version:

In the entry picture, look how tight the entryway is between the sofa and the table along the wall. That space I'm guessing is barely 3' wide.

Look at the dining room table. Between a table and a wall you need a minimum of 3' of space if no one will be walking behind a diner. That space between the table and the wall of the staircase is less than 3'. Note how on the other side of the table against the back wall, the blogger actually has a bench. Now think about having a walker, and trying to maneuver around that space.

I realize it has its problems. To be completely honest will all of you, I am terrified of making a wrong decision that will be terrible down the road. Just to give you all a bit of background. My husband is in his last 3 years or so of a 30-year law enforcement career. We've purchased 30 acres away from everything, and its a really beautiful place. All of the prep work on the land has been accounted for, so its just settling on a plan. He's a bit older than me so I want to make sure I choose something he can be comfortable getting around in. Hes a big guy. We will have the opportunity to live on site during the building process. I've attached a few pictures of the property. I've attached another plan I've looked at and possibly see if that will work better with a few modifications. I'd like to eliminate some of the sq footage on the second floor.

Here's a pic of our building site. We have the resources lined up to begin the dirt work but it has been a super wet winter for east Texas... so it will be a while before we can start. Likely mid summer. I added the pic of the creek since I just love it and our back porch will look out to that. The back porch will look over a sandy creek. I have a better video of the whole area, but I can't get it to load correctly. I'll try later so you have a better perspective

I know you specified actual experience with building the Sugarberry; as with most of these comments, I don't have that experience... yet. We are building the Sugarberry, any day now on a wooded lot with a creek. We've had the plans for three years and have seen five in person, as well the eight or nine I've found online. It is a fantastic house. It's obviously small, exactly what we want, and as long as you know that going into it, it's NOT too small. We are leaving kitchen as is, and it's perfect for us and probably you. We are extending the mudroom onto back porch and making screened porch wider (those spaces are so small in person they almost aren't functional). We are leaving master closets as is, but that is another space that is too small for most people. There are some other specifics on Moser's plan that make it a pricey, small-house build - truss system, roof lines, exposed rafters, etc. We are owner-building and making some adjustments to the build process in favor of our budget. Otherwise, it truly is a great space in person; there's a reason the Sugarberry is built often and loved by many. Good luck!

The second plan is too small to be seen so I can't give any info on it.

I do think the plan is overall a nice plan as carsoneray stated, but the needs of a young couple are quite different than the needs of a couple who are retired and that needs to be taken into account.

It's a beautiful property. How wonderful to be able to build on it.

Does the creek ever flood?

Would you consider working with a person of design talent or an architect to come up with a small plan that would give you all you need?

Absolutely

Here in the UK any new build has to have a downstairs loo...i wish I had another loo !

Now you keep the 1/2 bath, get a pantry, enlarge the utility mud room.

Kirista message me please

sent a message, I'll also send a better version of the other plan

carsoneray, could you shoot me a message if possible? I'd like to ask about your modifications in a bit more detail.

Virgil has a point. We're empty nesters and moved about two years ago from a double story house to a single, with 3 bedrooms on the one floor. Not that we need three bedrooms as bedrooms, but the layout gives us a master, a guest, and an exercise/music room/study all of which will be accessible no matter how decrepit we get.

Oh, and you do not want to eliminate the ground floor powder room in a two story house: you want your guests to have access to a facility near (but not opening into) the living/dining area. In a single story, you can skip the powder room and have a second full bathroom, but you definitely don't want the guests having to traipse through your bedroom or up stairs to do the needful.

Thank you both, and that is something to consider. Thank goodness I haven't purchased plans yet, right????

Also for aging in place, at some point you may need live-in help, if only a family member who is around to help with things like an older grandkid or something, so while you don’t want too much space, do think in terms of how use of space can evolve over time. If you do have to have live in help, it will be much easier for everyone if they have a nice bedroom and bathroom and sitting space of some kind that is separate from your spaces, because everyone wants privacy sometimes.

• For anyone interested in this plan, Brittany York's blog originally had great pictures. She has since updated with her budget, pros and cons of the plan, ect. It was very informative. http://duchessofyork.blogspot.com/

Did you build a Sugarberry? If so, please post final plan.

And could you repost the optional plan you considered in a larger format. We can't read those dimensions.

Would also like to see pictures if you went with Sugarberry plan!

I know this is an old post, but no way would I build a house from scratch that does not address the issues of storage needed at the entryway, not to mention the fact that there is no way to stop cold air from going right from the outside into the only living area, and where on earth do you put shoes/boots? The kitchen is also tiny.

J Williams, the OP is in East Texas - not much winter there.

OK, but still you enter in right behind the couch, are you telling me noone has outerwear, purses, hats or different types of shoes there? This is a family home right? We currently live in a home with 0 consideration for storage of outerwear/placement of shoes and no where for a real sized couch to go. It’s makes the front room, our only actual living room, into a giant coat/shoe room/storage room, we pretty much live in the kitchen.

Can I comment? We built this house - three years ago. You don't wan't both the doors to the side porch. It is not needed and also removes wall space on the interior.https://www.houzz.com/hznb/projects/pine-lake-pj-vj~3137141

And these builders shafted us. Three years in, we are having to re paint the entire exterior. At least $5K.