I agree entirely with floral's comment. And I am not sure why we are persisting in a discussion that is really just splitting hairs :-)

Would you have preferred Ms. Koziatek to say: 'Composting keeps food waste out of landfills, creates a mulch that can be used for gardening and improves the environment'? Does it really make any difference?

One thing is certain - the reverse is true. Organic mulch creates compost. That's why you have to keep applying it - it keeps decomposing.

There are two reasons I think her phrasing of it makes sense: many/most listeners will understand mulch as something they can spread in their yard or garden (and many might think compost means a smelly pile, not finished compost); anyone with more detailed knowledge or specific interest can ask or look it up or argue about the meaning in places like this)

Second, from what I have seen/know of municipal composting operations - and this may not apply to all of them - they use a lot of yard waste/waste wood chips and the like to minimise odours and ensure the right balance/aeration of their windrows. The process often doesn't get to 'completed' compost, in the sense that some of the wood waste degrades more slowly, so the completed product may be most appropriately used as a mulch (straight out of the facility, anyway). It's also quite possible that their target market to use the end-product is mostly those who want a mulch.

In short, her position is marketing manager, and it may be that this is the best simple message for the listeners.

It's funny, Tox, but I have the exact same response when I hear people call wood chips 'mulch'. I'm serious. I always want to say, "Well....actually they're wood by-products that you are using as a mulch." When people say they mulched their gardens, I always want to say, "With what?" even though I already know they think mulch is made from wood.

I'm curious, do you have the same reaction when people call wood 'mulch'?

Oh! It also just occurred to me that you may be youngish, and didn't grow up hearing the 'compost' pile called the 'mulch' pile as I did.

Oh no annpat, I'm in my 50s and we called it the mulch pile too, up in Michigan. For some reason that's a very common designation. We weren't composting very well - it was basically a pile of grass clippings that was slimy in the middle, with heaps of leaves added in the fall, at least the ones that weren't sucked up by the city truck at the curb.

Wood chips being called 'mulch' doesn't bother me nearly as much as calling compost 'mulch'.

As to what would have been better...I would have called it 'a rich soil amendment'. That evokes the dark crumbly earthy smelling compost that we all know and love.

Ah well, thanks for letting me get it off my chest. I wasn't really trying to perpetuate a debate, just surprised at how amateur this company's messaging was and felt like I could vent to you guys.

Happy rotting!

Tox! No, you can't vent to us about that! You're all alone on this! There's a reason people in Michigan commonly called a "compost" pile a mulch pile. Besides, I'd far rather you be annoyed about this than me being annoyed about people assuming wood makes a good mulch. For eons here, I've been compelled to ask "and what kind of mulch did you use?"

Hey as long as they mulched...it could be worse! :-]

Tell me about Michiganders, is the compost pile = mulch pile a Michigan thing? Years ago we started recycling coffee grounds and banana peels here at my office and one guy said "Oh yeah you can get some of that good mulch!" and we looked at him funny and had to explain the whole thing. So I'm not sure it's confined to Michigan.

What did you have to explain to him, Tox? In my book he was right.

No, it isn't strictly a Michigan thing. My father was from Oklahoma and he called the place he sent us to after meals the 'mulch' pile. I'm from Maine and I switch back and forth on what I call my bins, but in the end, they mostly produce mulch. (tee hee)

I never mind this debate, because novice gardeners are always confused about the two, and I like to make them aware that there are mulches of various materials and various quality..

Actually, mulching can produce compost. That's how I do it by sheet mulching wood chips from my chipper shredder. So much easier than turning the piles like I used to do. Kitchen scraps just get pitched into the garden. The bugs do the work.

Mulch ado about nothing. For the record, here in Wisconsin I have also alternately referred to it as my mulch pile and/or compost pile. One of my dogs used to love to jump up into the pile to see what goodies were there and I also referred to her as our mulch monkey and/or compost critter.

I think the stale bread I put in there stopped her inquisitiveness. ;-)

tj

Poor pup.

If we turn this into a debate, Santa's going to hear us!

Happy composting and mulching, and God bless us, every one!

annpat, I seem to recall you have a strong aversion to including bread in the compost :-) I assume that's what prompted your most recent response!

Don't worry Tox. Santa loves us gardeners. ;) Oh, and I just put some moldy bread in my compost this morning (I'm a rule breaker). I compost everything! Like David Goodman says: Compost your enemies!

I don't visit this forum very often, but since you are splitting hairs so finely, why not??

I often refer to compost as micromulch. If I wanted a mulching effect in my lawn, then compost is the material to use, because it will fall between the blades of grass very easily. If I want a mulching effect in my garden beds then I use shredded juniper...which we call "cedar" in Texas because we apparently can't tell the difference between cedar and juniper. Anyway we get yards of it for free from the local tree trimmers where I live.

Richard Brennan

One thing is certain - the reverse is true. Organic mulch creates compost.
That's why you have to keep applying it - it keeps decomposing.

Richard's comment is the least certain thing posted here. CapTurbo made a similar statement. I wonder Richard he was baiting the forum? Just because something decomposes, that does not make it compost. Compost has to have a protein source and shredded wood bark, for example, has none.

Back when there was a USSR, the soviets did a lot of agriculture research on mulches. One of their discoveries had to do with ammonia recycling. They determined that the carbonaceous mulch (shredded wood and dry leaves in particular) captured/absorbed ammonia gas escaping from the soil. The ammonia gas resulted from the decomposition of protein (dead microbes and roots). When ammonia gas leaks out, we smell it as a spoiled milk smell. Ammonia gas has a very strong affinity for water, so the morning dew on the mulch reabsorbs the ammonia out of the mulch and drips back into the soil as a nutrient. They determined that the recycling effect worked in the top two inches of soil.

gardengal, I like to do my part to promote composting, and I always fear that novices, seeing something especially stomach churning in the bin, will be discouraged from participating. Holding you in high regard, I'm confident you agree.

"I always fear that novices, seeing something especially stomach churning in the bin, will be discouraged from participating"

LOL! Never thought about it in those terms :-) I am a firm believer in composting and the benefits of compost in the garden so the more we can encourage folks to compost the better. However I am not so strict about what can be included - I just steer clear of dairy or fats or hard pits/nuts like avocado that take eons to breakdown. I have even been known to toss a small critter body or two into my pile that my cat brought me.

It's all good!!

That's why we keep a pile of leaves or wood chips or shavings next to the bin, to cover up those yuckies so we don't have to see them.

As for dchall's comments on nitrogen: my understanding was that if it's not present in the organic material in sufficient amounts, it will be drawn from the air (nitrification I believe), but this is a much slower process than the reverse, and that's exactly why low N materials take a long time to break down.

If they don't get it from the atmosphere, where DO they get it? It has to come from SOMEwhere, otherwise wood would never break down, and we'd be miles deep in it.